Kitz Forum
Chat => Chit Chat => Topic started by: Bowdon on November 19, 2020, 11:21:49 AM
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This is a bit of a rant at the BBC, though I'll make it clear that I don't mind paying the tv licence as I regularly use iplayer and watch live tv.
But they have been putting out false information when being asked what services do you need a tv licence for.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/explainers-51376255 (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/explainers-51376255)
Do I have to pay for a TV licence?
The law says that you must have a TV licence if you:
watch or record live TV programmes on any channel, even if it's not on the BBC
watch or stream programmes live on an online TV service such as ITV Hub, All 4, YouTube, Amazon Prime Video, Now TV and Sky Go
download or watch any BBC programmes on iPlayer
You don't need a tv licence to watch ITV Hub, All 4, Youtube, or Amazon Prime Video, as they aren't platforms controlled by the BBC and don't put out any BBC content (though according to their Netflix explanation you can still watch a BBC programme on those services as long as its not being shown live).
Further on down that page they exempt Netflix even though the other catch-up online services are the same.
But a licence fee is not needed to view BBC programmes on other streaming services, like Netflix.
So, downloading Gavin & Stacey on Netflix would not require a TV licence, whereas downloading the same episode on iPlayer would.
You only need a TV licence to watch BBC content either via a tv capable of receiving the BBC live channels or iplayer. I'm not sure if Now TV broadcast BBC channels?
If you're going to use a TV to watch programmes then I'd disconnect the aerial cable and just connect it to content online.
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you need a TV licence if you are watching Live TV from ITV Hub, All4 etc.
if you are watching anything "as live" then the TV licence is required.
it is nothing about "being controlled by the BBC".
netflix is exempt because it's not broadcasting any "live tv".
amazon prime does broadcast "live tv", hence why you need a licence if viewing that particular content.
You only need a TV licence to watch BBC content either via a tv capable of receiving the BBC live channels or iplayer. I'm not sure if Now TV broadcast BBC channels?
If you're going to use a TV to watch programmes then I'd disconnect the aerial cable and just connect it to content online.
incorrect on both counts.
the TV licence is required to watch any live TV from anywhere.
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As chenks points out you don't need a tv license to watch on demand programmes on ITV Hub/All 4/My 5, but you DO need a tv license to watch LIVE broadcasts on those apps.
The BBC are correct in the quotes you have provided.
You need a tv license to watch live tv on Now TV, on any channel.
https://help.nowtv.com/article/do-i-need-a-tv-licence-to-watch-now-tv
If you're going to use a TV to watch programmes then I'd disconnect the aerial cable and just connect it to content online.
That's a myth. You can be prosecuted with or without an aerial connected.
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If I go on youtube and set myself to live stream talking about anything, would you need to buy a BBC tv licence to watch me?
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Yes, you must have a TV licence to watch ANY live programs and that includes You Tube and Amazon Prime. You do not need a licence to watch Netflix because nothing on that platform is live, but if that changes you will need a licence.
See https://www.tvlicensing.co.uk/check-if-you-need-one/topics/Live-TV-and-how-you-watch-it (https://www.tvlicensing.co.uk/check-if-you-need-one/topics/Live-TV-and-how-you-watch-it)
Stuart
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If I go on youtube and set myself to live stream talking about anything, would you need to buy a BBC tv licence to watch me?
You aren't a tv programme, so no.
Edit: if you want to go in to the definition of what is a tv programme and what isn't, for tv license purposes, part of the legislation is here
https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2004/692/part/3/made
Which clears up nothing :)
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If I go on youtube and set myself to live stream talking about anything, would you need to buy a BBC tv licence to watch me?
no, and you know you don't need one for that.
stop putting forward absurd scenarios.
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Actually I think there could be a question over YouTube and what is considered a live event. The information is not clear and while I doubt the powers that be would go after what Bowdon is suggesting other scenarios might be more problematic. There are quite a few folks streaming live on YouTube during lockdown demonstrating all sorts of things and some of these can have hundreds of people watching and some have to be subscribed to or are donation events. Most Smart TVs have YouTube as part of their platform. I think it might be a grey area!
None of this bothers me since I do have a TV Licence, however it is my wife's name and she is threatening to cancel when she is 75 and will not get a free licence! :'(
Stuart
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if you need an ofcom licence to broadcast then it would require a tv licence to view.
some random guy streaming live on youtube doesn't require an ofcom licence.
of course, if someone is streaming live TV content on youtube then they are breaking the law as they don't have the copyright to re-broadcast.
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no, and you know you don't need one for that.
stop putting forward absurd scenarios.
I was respectful of yours and other peoples answers so please be respectful back.
The whole reason for the thread was because Alex Belfield (ex BBC presenter) said some of the viewers to his live streams were being told they needed a tv licence to watch them.
He's been in contact with the BBC, and Ofcom, about a clarification of the rules regarding youtube livestreams. So far they haven't given a full answer and have passed it on to another department.
I'll put the video as a weblink here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ev3E6eeg7Bo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ev3E6eeg7Bo)
This isn't the first time youtube have come in to focus. I remember many years ago another channel that streams all the time in a news programme format was contacted by ATVOD which tried to get them paying a licence. They refused and nothing came of it. It seems ATVOD merged to be part of Ofcom.
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I was respectful of yours and other peoples answers so please be respectful back.
it may surprise you that my response was respectful. if i had chosen to be dis-respectful it would have been obvious to all.
you posed a rather silly question about you live streaming on youtube and whether viewers would need a TV licence. both me and you know that you knew perfectly well you didn't need one for that.
i also won't give Alex Bellfied "the voice of reason" and who has a donation page called "Freespeechforall" the benefit of viewing anything of his content. most likely "Ex-BBC" for a reason and now has a grudge to push.
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I think my own biggest gripe about licensing is the heavy handed enforcement techniques.
Our own licence is in the name of my other half so for many years, whenever I bought a TV and the retailer told TV licensing, they used to write me rather nasty letters, increasingly threatening, and bordering on a direct accusation of guilt. Have they never heard the phrase ‘Innocent til proven guilty’?
Whilst I think licence dodgers should be held to account, I’m not sure the criminal courts are the way to do that. As we’ve seen in this thread, the rules can actually be genuinely misunderstood, but could earn a conviction and criminal record. :'(
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you posed a rather silly question about you live streaming on youtube and whether viewers would need a TV licence. both me and you know that you knew perfectly well you didn't need one for that.
It might have appeared a silly question. But when an ex BBC guy, whose in the tv/radio industry is asking the question then me as a lowly bbc licence fee payer become unsure on the answer. That's why I asked the question, especially when you and others answered my initial post well. I thought I'd go for clarity and put the question that made me unsure to see what others thought of it.
I pay the tv licence. I have no problem doing so as I watch BBC programming both on tv and radio, and I watch the iplayer and sounds(radio) daily too.
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I pay the tv licence. I have no problem doing so as I watch BBC programming both on tv and radio, and I watch the iplayer and sounds(radio) daily too.
you might still be a confused about the tv licence.
it has nothing to do with watching the BBC - you need one to watch ANY live TV on any platform. even if you never consumed any BBC content but still watched live TV you'd still need one.
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you might still be a confused about the tv licence.
it has nothing to do with watching the BBC - you need one to watch ANY live TV on any platform. even if you never consumed any BBC content but still watched live TV you'd still need one.
I was confused when I started the thread. I can see now why they exempted Netflix because of the no live content part.
At least I learned something today :)
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Its often observed that the license fee rules are deliberately confusing to scare people into continuing to pay for fear of being prosecuted / jailed - they send threatening letters to people and tell lies about their 'detection systems'. Its a massive tax-funded bureaucracy which will not survive in the commercial world and they know it ...
As I understand it you have to pay for a license to watch any live broadcast, bbc or not and including things like live sport streamed over Amazon / BT sport, non-live streamed content is OK, as is catch-up TV ... its ridiculous.
I think being forced to pay for a service you hardly use is pretty objectionable.
My view is that the BBC should not be funded by taxation (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9DWyTn9CrgY) and they should compete with everyone else, they don't really produce anything unique, they are politically biased and are increasingly irrelevant - my kids generation just don't watch live TV or consume media in that way any more.
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Didn't take long for the anti-BBC agenda to pop its head in
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Personally, I wouldn't be surprised if the TV licence evolved into one for having a broadband/internet connection
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they don't really produce anything unique
I strongly disagree, I think their satirical and documentaries are exceptional, plus as already pointing out part of that license fee is for the broadcasting infrastructure. Alas its grossly unfair to blame the BBC for the license fee, when you need it for none-BBC live content, surely THAT'S wrong as that content is already advert supported. The fact you need a license to watch pay per view on Sky is what's insane.
What I object to is the government meddling in their funding, making them inherently more likely to side with the current government. Their funding needing needs to be ring-fenced in some way so they can actually be neutral without fear of funding cuts.
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The most annoying part of the BBC for me is that they split away the radio stations from iplayer, when most devices i.e. tv's, games consoles only have the iplayer app installed, not the Sounds app that they moved radio to. The Sounds app itself doesn't have a good UI and is overly complicated.
I think the BBC need to be moving to become a subscription service, or free with advertisements. The commercial side of the BBC i.e. BBC Studios is making millions from the UKTV acquisition. I think they also own other advertising based tv channels too. The BBC needs to decide what it wants to be, either a commercial organisation, which it as already proven to be successful (the current new head of the BBC is the one who made all the money at BBC Studios), or remove the adverts and give us commercial free channels like the regular BBC ones are.
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What a ridiculous thread this is.
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The most annoying part of the BBC for me is that they split away the radio stations from iplayer, when most devices i.e. tv's, games consoles only have the iplayer app installed, not the Sounds app that they moved radio to. The Sounds app itself doesn't have a good UI and is overly complicated.
Its not like iPlayer is a great UI either, but like you said at least its available on more platforms.
Also bizarre is how long they have been beta testing UHD streams on "select platforms" while not even bothering to support 1080p at all. I just don't understand their thinking.