Kitz Forum

Broadband Related => ISPs => Topic started by: Alex Atkin UK on March 24, 2020, 09:11:28 PM

Title: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: Alex Atkin UK on March 24, 2020, 09:11:28 PM
Quote
To help all of our customers stay connected at this difficult time, weíre removing usage caps from all our broadband products until the end of June. Many of you are already on unlimited packages, but for those customers who are on older broadband products with a usage limit, this means youíll be able to use your Zen broadband as much as you like without having to worry about additional charges.

Quote
Unsurprisingly, over the last few days we have experienced an 18% increase in traffic on our network, but this remains well within the additional capacity we have in place to deal with extraordinary situations such as this.
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: sevenlayermuddle on March 24, 2020, 10:27:54 PM
Good on Ďem. :)

I hope they told that Brussels Commissioner, the one that thought Netflix should stop streaming HD? ::)
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: jelv on March 24, 2020, 11:09:15 PM
If Netflix, YouTube, Apple TV and Amazon Prime Video hadn't already decreased the bit rates the increase would have been much more than 18% - no telling if Zen's network would still have been OK.
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: sevenlayermuddle on March 24, 2020, 11:25:06 PM
If Netflix, YouTube, Apple TV and Amazon Prime Video hadn't already decreased the bit rates the increase would have been much more than 18% - no telling if Zen's network would still have been OK.

Source?
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: mofa2020 on March 24, 2020, 11:48:26 PM
Source?

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-03-24/youtube-to-limit-video-quality-around-the-world-for-a-month
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: sevenlayermuddle on March 24, 2020, 11:55:31 PM
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-03-24/youtube-to-limit-video-quality-around-the-world-for-a-month

Iím aware that it has been widely reported.  That does not prove that it was based on factual evidence or need.
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: j0hn on March 25, 2020, 12:16:59 AM
Iím aware that it has been widely reported.  That does not prove that it was based on factual evidence or need.

The EU apparently asked as some networks in the EU were struggling or expected to struggle.

Seems Amazon, Netflix, YouTube all lowered their quality EU wide despite numerous UK ISP's stating they have coped fine.

I can confirm YouTube defaults to 480p but I can change that at any point.
Netflix and Amazon I haven't checked but they both released statements to that effect.
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: sevenlayermuddle on March 25, 2020, 12:18:33 AM
And as if on cue, BBC have chipped in.   Not that they are a source of facts either, but interesting...

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-52027348

Ignoring all the daft advice from Ofcom, at the end of that article...

Quote
But the internet companies say they can handle the pressure.
Openreach, which maintains the telephone cables and cabinets across the country used by most broadband providers, said that - despite the jump - usage is still lower than the usual peaks it experiences in the evening.
"We're not seeing any significant issues across our broadband or phone network," an Openreach spokesman said.
"We've seen a circa 20% increase in daytime usage over our fibre network, but that's in line with what we expected and not as high as the usage levels we see during evening peak times."
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: Alex Atkin UK on March 25, 2020, 01:54:28 AM
I've been watching Disney+, Netflix and YouTube - I haven't noticed any difference at all.

I do have UltraHD on Netflix and checking just now its working fine.  Just saw it pulling 40Mbit from ipv4_1.cc0.c125.lhr004.ix.nflxvideo.net as it seems to prefer using the Plusnet line for some reason, Zen usually pulls from their Netflix cache.

Can confirm that Youtube is definitely not defaulting to SD for me either though, went straight to 4K as normal when I tried to watch a LinusTechTips video.

I did notice: https://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.php/2020/03/netflix-lowers-video-quality-to-aid-broadband-isp-congestion.html

Quote
Netflix have also yet to confirm if this will apply to the United Kingdom, where the majority of fixed line providers have yet to really struggle with managing increased demand (weíve covered this here).

Indeed all of the biggest UK providers will already be using specialised Content Delivery Networks (CDN) to effectively cache online videos closer to their end-users, which helps to ease the burden of video streaming services on their networks and wider capacity (not only Netflix but many others too, such as YouTube, Amazon Prime, NOW TV etc.).
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: Weaver on March 25, 2020, 02:26:19 AM
I have been having enormous problems with slowness and software bugs in the Netflix iOS app. I found the cause the other day. The quality setting was set to "high" as opposed to "standard". That seems to make it 4-6 times slower to download a programme, but those figures are very very approximate. The programme image quality is poor when there is a lot of fast moving random detail if set to "standard" that must be why I changed it some while ago and then forgot all about having made the change.

Sometimes an episode gets to 99.9% or 100% downloaded and then just sits there at that level forever, never changing to a box with a tick in it. Thatís the iOS app bug.
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: Alex Atkin UK on March 25, 2020, 02:45:54 AM
That really sucks.  I mean half the point of having a download option is so you can pick a quality setting higher than you can stream.
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: Weaver on March 25, 2020, 03:25:36 AM
I donít see why there should be more load on the content providers, if anything it might be less peaky, with less of an evening peak because people may have more times at which they can watch content. Or am I wrong?

What about increased load on ISPs though, due to home working?
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: j0hn on March 25, 2020, 09:27:14 AM
I've been watching Disney+, Netflix and YouTube - I haven't noticed any difference at all.

Not likely to notice a difference on Disney+ as it launched at a reduced rate.

https://www.theverge.com/2020/3/22/21189920/disney-plus-delayed-france-uk-streaming-reduce-quality-coronavirus

You must surely notice a difference on YouTube unless perhaps watching on a mobile phone.
Even I notice it on my phone though as I usually watch in 1440p where available.
Every single method of watching YouTube now defaults to 480p for me (TV, Android phone, Shield TV).

Netflix 4k may be unaffected. I only read reports of them reducing the HD streams.

Facebook and Prime video have also reduced stream quality across the EU, some not limited to the EU.
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: sevenlayermuddle on March 25, 2020, 10:17:44 AM
Worth pointing out that Netflix streams always appear to start at a very low bitrate and resolution, then ramping up quality after monitoring the connection quality for few minutes.  All streamers do similar, I think.     My Panasonic TV actually shows the Netflix bitrate on request so  Iíve just put this to the test....

I just started a random chosen stream... 1.4Mbs/480
After about 70 secs, it switched briefly to something/720, then quickly to 4.42Mbps/1080.

In the past, I have noted Netflix bitrates of 4.6Mbps or more so it may be slightly reduced. Or maybe it is a reflection of the fact I have limited bandwidth and other half is working from home in the other room, in a video conference right now.

But certainly, no evidence to suggest they have bowed to the well publicised EU request, to reduce HD to SD.    Then again, maybe they have, for those in the European Union.

Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: jelv on March 25, 2020, 10:37:31 AM
I wonder if it makes a difference if you are getting it direct from the source or via a CDN?
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: sevenlayermuddle on March 25, 2020, 10:45:59 AM
I wonder if it makes a difference if you are getting it direct from the source or via a CDN?

Not a topic (CDNs) that  I know anything about.  But I am with Zen and do seem to recall somebody (Alex?) recently mentioned CDN in relation to Zen...
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: Alex Atkin UK on March 25, 2020, 02:21:45 PM
Not likely to notice a difference on Disney+ as it launched at a reduced rate.

https://www.theverge.com/2020/3/22/21189920/disney-plus-delayed-france-uk-streaming-reduce-quality-coronavirus

You must surely notice a difference on YouTube unless perhaps watching on a mobile phone.
Even I notice it on my phone though as I usually watch in 1440p where available.
Every single method of watching YouTube now defaults to 480p for me (TV, Android phone, Shield TV).

Netflix 4k may be unaffected. I only read reports of them reducing the HD streams.

Facebook and Prime video have also reduced stream quality across the EU, some not limited to the EU.

Glad to hear Disney+ is not normal quality as I thought its "4K" quality was pretty garbage.  I mean it doesn't look bad from a normal viewing distance, but definitely doesn't look 4K, up close its just postertised/compressed to hell.

YouTube on desktop seems unaffected, on my phone I noticed the 4K video on Auto went to 720p.

Only been watching Netflix on ShieldTV and 4K seemed normal, Titans which is HD seemed a little rough in places but that could be normal as some Netflix content just seems to get more aggressively compressed than others.  Although I did have a nagging feeling that when I started watching a couple of days ago it looked better.

I've forced ShieldTV to use Zen now, so lets see if that's any different.
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: kitz on March 25, 2020, 11:47:54 PM
Plusnet also sent out something similar last week

Quote
Our network
Our network is key to keeping you connected and is built to support the Ďevening peakí, when most of you are watching Netflix whilst doing the online shop, and the kids are on TikTok.
This roughly amounts to at least ten times the typical daytime demand, so weíre confident that we can keep you doing things you need to, when you want to do them.

What we can do to help you
We only sell unlimited broadband plans, so being online more is not a problem. You might have one of our older broadband plans with capped usage, but donít worry you wonít get any additional data charges during this time. And weíll let you know if this changes.
We know that the need to stay safe might mean some customers will face difficulties paying bills at the moment, especially those who run small businesses. If you get in touch we will try and help to make things a little easier to manage, and donít worry if it takes a little longer to get through to us Ė calls to our customer service teams are free.

... and Vodafone have added extra capacity.

Quote
We have added extra capacity to our broadband and mobile networks to make sure they are in the best possible position to cope with any extra demand as more people work from home. Our networks are strong and robust, weíve invested billions over the last five years to ensure they are the best they can be and as reliable as possible for you.
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: kitz on March 26, 2020, 12:51:15 AM
Not a topic (CDNs) that  I know anything about.  But I am with Zen and do seem to recall somebody (Alex?) recently mentioned CDN in relation to Zen...

Depends on the ISP's network and type.   

CDNs bring content nearer to the customer. So instead of streaming a movie all the way from California, its streamed (delivered) from a location near to the ISP's PoP.

All CDNs have a presence in London and since most ISPs have London gateways so there are no overseas transit costs for the SP.  It cuts out the routing normally done by the likes of Cogentco or Level3 etc. 
However transit costs are miniscule compared to Core, which in turn is cheaper than Backhaul.
   
Depending on network design; LLU, WBC & Dedicated WMBC ISPs can reduce some of their Core costs and could if they wished connect their northern customers to a CDN based in Manchester.

Benefit to the end user =  Faster delivery.
Benefit to the ISP = Large reduction in 3rd party Internet transit costs and possible reduction in Core costs
Benefit to the content provider = resiliency plus reduction in transit costs as the CDNs mirror the content around the globe.

----

CDNs are probably why there is less interest in multicast these days as it's not just the likes of Netflix that use them.  All the social media platforms, a large proportion of games and large websites do. 
My brother uses AWS Cloudfront CDN for his company because its massively scaleable and cuts down on their own origin server costs.   They just bump up the amount of AWS servers at certain times of the year to cope with demand... and then drop back again to their usual number during normal business weeks.   
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: Alex Atkin UK on March 26, 2020, 12:57:39 AM
I haven't seen it today, but I have seen in the past a netflix cache inside Zen's network when looking at the NAT states on my router while watching Netflix.
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: kitz on March 26, 2020, 01:15:50 AM
Zen probably has a Netflix OCA (https://openconnect.netflix.com/Open-Connect-Overview.pdf).
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: sevenlayermuddle on March 26, 2020, 08:47:48 AM
Thanks for the explanations.

Canít help thinking, if the word goes around that some ISPs are able to side-step Brussels restrictions on Netflix bitrates, these ISPs might suddenly become very popular.
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: Chrysalis on March 26, 2020, 09:08:07 AM
If Netflix, YouTube, Apple TV and Amazon Prime Video hadn't already decreased the bit rates the increase would have been much more than 18% - no telling if Zen's network would still have been OK.
netflix have disabled the hidden menu now also, it allowed choosing the cdn server and bitrate
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: johnson on March 26, 2020, 09:16:23 AM
Canít help thinking, if the word goes around that some ISPs are able to side-step Brussels restrictions on Netflix bitrates, these ISPs might suddenly become very popular.

Come again? Just because some discussion was had with the EU before this happened does not mean they were trying to make your bananas straight.  :D
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: Alex Atkin UK on March 26, 2020, 02:48:45 PM
Well that was unexpected.

Code: [Select]
1  lo1.subs.bng1.wh-man.zen.net.uk (62.3.89.162)  6.179 ms  5.939 ms  5.853 ms
 2  ae5-161.cr2.wh-man.zen.net.uk (62.3.86.13)  5.899 ms  6.354 ms  6.309 ms
 3  vl-50.ph-0-4-3.cor1.manc1.ptn.zen.net.uk (51.148.73.58)  6.820 ms  14.548 ms  7.035 ms
 4  ae-2.pe1.ixn-lon.zen.net.uk (51.148.73.34)  12.951 ms  15.520 ms  13.409 ms
 5  ae-2.cor1.lond2.ptn.zen.net.uk (51.148.73.3)  12.725 ms  44.010 ms  12.692 ms
 6  ae-15.agg1.lond2.ptn.zen.net.uk (51.148.73.28)  13.381 ms  15.750 ms  19.330 ms
 7  ldn-b9-link.telia.net (62.115.169.134)  12.295 ms  12.347 ms  12.535 ms
 8  ldn-bb3-link.telia.net (62.115.117.6)  12.458 ms  13.098 ms  13.189 ms
 9  ldn-b7-link.telia.net (62.115.138.151)  12.485 ms  12.131 ms  14.323 ms
10  * * *
11  * * *
12  4.7.1.138 (4.7.1.138)  80.812 ms  80.742 ms  80.772 ms
13  po300.es02.nyc001.ix.nflxvideo.net (23.246.60.103)  152.637 ms  152.738 ms  152.902 ms
14  po302.es02.nyc005.ix.nflxvideo.net (23.246.61.45)  149.958 ms  149.516 ms  149.430 ms
15  po306.es01.lhr005.ix.nflxvideo.net (23.246.61.141)  152.308 ms  152.658 ms  152.215 ms
16  ipv4_1.cxl0.c022.lhr005.ix.nflxvideo.net (45.57.0.146)  152.471 ms  152.287 ms  152.455 ms
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: CarlT on March 26, 2020, 03:53:27 PM
Haha!

Why are they using Telia transit to get to Netflix? Netflix have open peering policies?

Either severe capacity issues at their peering or they've messed up somewhere.

Either way I'm not that surprised Telia aren't peering with Netflix in the UK. They probably haven't a clue why anyone would use them to connect to Netflix when anyone can just connect directly either via a peering interface or a public peering LAN.
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: kitz on March 26, 2020, 04:22:04 PM
Where was you trying to trace?
Although Netflix may use CDN for their video content, they may not be using cloudfront and [web]site content is still hosted on their own local to them servers.   

I've even seen some sites which may use CDN for gaming content, cloudfront for some files, yet they may still have other files one their own server such as databases for game stats and the domain name which points to their own servers.

CDN is excellent for storage of large files, but not much use when it comes to dynamic content and it's useless for databases. 

Code: [Select]
Tracing route to netflix.co.uk [44.226.113.145]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

  1    <1 ms    <1 ms    <1 ms  192.168.1.1
  2    11 ms    10 ms    10 ms  250.core.plus.net [195.166.130.250]
  3    13 ms    12 ms    11 ms  84.93.253.83
  4    12 ms    12 ms    12 ms  core1-be1.colindale.ukcore.bt.net [195.99.125.132]
  5    12 ms    22 ms    35 ms  peer7-et-4-0-1.telehouse.ukcore.bt.net [194.72.16.122]
  6    13 ms    11 ms    12 ms  166-49-128-32.gia.bt.net [166.49.128.32]
  7    12 ms    13 ms    13 ms  hu0-6-0-4.ccr22.lon01.atlas.cogentco.com [130.117.14.65]
  8    13 ms    12 ms    12 ms  be2869.ccr42.lon13.atlas.cogentco.com [154.54.57.161]
  9    79 ms    80 ms    82 ms  be2101.ccr32.bos01.atlas.cogentco.com [154.54.82.38]
 10    79 ms    79 ms    80 ms  be3600.ccr22.alb02.atlas.cogentco.com [154.54.0.221]
 11    91 ms    90 ms    89 ms  be2879.ccr22.cle04.atlas.cogentco.com [154.54.29.173]
 12   103 ms    96 ms    96 ms  be2718.ccr42.ord01.atlas.cogentco.com [154.54.7.129]
 13   122 ms   127 ms   127 ms  be2832.ccr22.mci01.atlas.cogentco.com [154.54.44.169]
 14   119 ms   120 ms   121 ms  be3036.ccr22.den01.atlas.cogentco.com [154.54.31.89]
 15   135 ms   135 ms   134 ms  be3038.ccr32.slc01.atlas.cogentco.com [154.54.42.97]
 16   146 ms   149 ms   148 ms  be3110.ccr22.sfo01.atlas.cogentco.com [154.54.44.141]
 17   167 ms   164 ms   162 ms  be3670.ccr41.sjc03.atlas.cogentco.com [154.54.43.14]
 18   147 ms   146 ms   146 ms  38.88.224.218
 19     *        *        *     Request timed out.
 20     *        *     ^C
 
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: Weaver on March 26, 2020, 05:29:44 PM
I tried a traceroute to the last domain name I could see in the Alexís list and I went to the USA! Donít know what on earth is going on there.

traceroute to ipv4_1.cxl0.c022.lhr005.ix.nflxvideo.net  (45.57.0.146), 30 hops max, 56 byte packets
 1  sent:22 loss:0% last:2.707 ms avg:2.632 ms
    firebrick (81.187.147.254)
 2  sent:22 loss:0% last:42.082 ms avg:44.733 ms
    221.53.155.90.in-addr.arpa (90.155.53.221)
 3  sent:22 loss:0% last:41.697 ms avg:49.856 ms
    g.aimless.thn.aa.net.uk (90.155.53.47)
 4  sent:21 loss:0% last:47.395 ms avg:54.155 ms
    ge-4-3-6.edge5.London1.Level3.net (195.50.116.49)
 5  sent:21 loss:95.2% last:186.478 ms avg:186.478 ms
    ae-1-3502.ear2.NewYork1.Level3.net (4.69.148.33)
 6  sent:21 loss:0% last:166.446 ms avg:112.971 ms
    4.7.1.138
 7  sent:21 loss:0% last:172.795 ms avg:180.518 ms
    po300.es02.nyc001.ix.nflxvideo.net (23.246.60.103)
 8  sent:21 loss:0% last:197.145 ms avg:178.304 ms
    po302.es02.nyc005.ix.nflxvideo.net (23.246.61.45)
 9  sent:21 loss:0% last:177.37 ms avg:184.413 ms
    po306.es01.lhr005.ix.nflxvideo.net (23.246.61.141)
10  sent:21 loss:0% last:242.003 ms avg:181.522 ms
    ipv4_1.cxl0.c022.lhr005.ix.nflxvideo.net (45.57.0.146)


And something that is probably a waste of time completely:

traceroute to netflix.co.uk (46.137.171.215), 30 hops max, 56 byte packets
 1  sent:4 loss:0% last:2.343 ms avg:2.299 ms
    firebrick (81.187.147.254)
 2  sent:4 loss:0% last:35.935 ms avg:67.962 ms
    221.53.155.90.in-addr.arpa (90.155.53.221)
 3  sent:4 loss:0% last:38.798 ms avg:89.563 ms
    p-aimless.thn.aa.net.uk (90.155.53.108)
 4  sent:4 loss:0% last:89.215 ms avg:61.135 ms
    99.82.180.58
 5  sent:4 loss:0% last:40.27 ms avg:45.005 ms
    54.239.101.50
 6  sent:4 loss:0% last:40.418 ms avg:75.085 ms
    54.239.101.65
 7  sent:4 loss:100% last:0 ms avg:0 ms
 8  sent:4 loss:0% last:65.172 ms avg:105.336 ms
    52.93.128.246
 9  sent:4 loss:100% last:0 ms avg:0 ms
10  sent:4 loss:0% last:52.608 ms avg:99.725 ms
    52.93.6.230
11  sent:4 loss:0% last:47.379 ms avg:77.759 ms
    52.93.101.29
12  sent:4 loss:0% last:53.316 ms avg:52.031 ms
    52.93.101.52
13  sent:4 loss:0% last:61.404 ms avg:65.921 ms
    52.93.7.109
14  sent:4 loss:100% last:0 ms avg:0 ms
15  sent:4 loss:100% last:0 ms avg:0 ms
16  sent:3 loss:100% last:0 ms avg:0 ms
17  sent:3 loss:100% last:0 ms avg:0 ms
18  sent:3 loss:100% last:0 ms avg:0 ms


and

traceroute to netflix.com (34.250.41.147), 30 hops max, 56 byte packets
 1  sent:22 loss:0% last:3.024 ms avg:2.225 ms
    firebrick (81.187.147.254)
 2  sent:22 loss:0% last:37.618 ms avg:45.219 ms
    221.53.155.90.in-addr.arpa (90.155.53.221)
 3  sent:22 loss:0% last:44.834 ms avg:56.946 ms
    p-aimless.thn.aa.net.uk (90.155.53.108)
 4  sent:22 loss:0% last:39.827 ms avg:54.419 ms
    99.82.180.58
 5  sent:22 loss:0% last:37.533 ms avg:44.072 ms
    54.239.101.30
 6  sent:22 loss:0% last:38.952 ms avg:45.468 ms
    150.222.65.3
 7  sent:22 loss:100% last:0 ms avg:0 ms
 8  sent:22 loss:0% last:53.818 ms avg:62.101 ms
    52.93.128.216
 9  sent:21 loss:100% last:0 ms avg:0 ms
10  sent:21 loss:0% last:54.952 ms avg:60.839 ms
    52.93.6.214
11  sent:21 loss:0% last:54.099 ms avg:58.132 ms
    52.93.101.31
12  sent:21 loss:0% last:56.136 ms avg:52.995 ms
    52.93.101.62
13  sent:21 loss:0% last:48.275 ms avg:51.663 ms
    52.93.7.127
14  sent:21 loss:100% last:0 ms avg:0 ms
15  sent:21 loss:100% last:0 ms avg:0 ms
16  sent:21 loss:100% last:0 ms avg:0 ms
17  sent:21 loss:100% last:0 ms avg:0 ms
18  sent:21 loss:100% last:0 ms avg:0 ms

Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: Alex Atkin UK on March 26, 2020, 05:47:25 PM
Haha!

Why are they using Telia transit to get to Netflix? Netflix have open peering policies?

Either severe capacity issues at their peering or they've messed up somewhere.

Either way I'm not that surprised Telia aren't peering with Netflix in the UK. They probably haven't a clue why anyone would use them to connect to Netflix when anyone can just connect directly either via a peering interface or a public peering LAN.

Yeah I don't understand what is going on there.  Some glitch with me using Unbound for full name resolution maybe?

I might have to switch back to Cloudflare DNSoTLS as that seemed to (somehow) work fine seeing Zens cache.

Ah, there we go:
Code: [Select]
1  losubs.subs.bng1.th-lon.zen.net.uk (62.3.80.17)  13.051 ms  20.377 ms  14.863 ms
 2  ae1-177.cr2.th-lon.zen.net.uk (62.3.80.38)  22.324 ms  13.685 ms  13.568 ms
 3  vl-50.ae-5.pe2.thn-lon.zen.net.uk (51.148.73.54)  13.698 ms  34.108 ms  35.241 ms
 4  ae-1.pe2.ixn-lon.zen.net.uk (51.148.73.97)  13.954 ms  14.288 ms  13.760 ms
 5  ae-14.cor1.lond2.ptn.zen.net.uk (51.148.73.27)  14.325 ms  14.676 ms  13.755 ms
 6  ae-15.agg1.lond2.ptn.zen.net.uk (51.148.73.28)  14.336 ms  14.328 ms  14.367 ms
 7  netflix-cache1.lond2.ptn.zen.net.uk (51.148.80.10)  13.849 ms  13.407 ms  13.862 ms

Its HD but the bitrate seems to be a bit p00.
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: Weaver on March 26, 2020, 06:32:37 PM
@Alex how did you discover the correct destination address to traceroute to?
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: Alex Atkin UK on March 26, 2020, 06:43:49 PM
@Alex how did you discover the correct destination address to traceroute to?

NAT state table, or specifically on pfSense I just viewed the traffic graph page which lets you display all remote IPs currently being accessed.
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: Weaver on March 26, 2020, 07:25:15 PM
I could look at the sessions/flows table in my router, but itís very noisy and you donít get domain names; Iíd have to reverse-lookup them. Thereís typically an awful lot of random ipv6 crud to look through, much of it not relevant.
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: jelv on March 26, 2020, 11:22:30 PM
https://www.thinkbroadband.com/news/8701-netflix-streaming-quality-seems-to-have-halved-or-more
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: sevenlayermuddle on March 26, 2020, 11:44:37 PM
A mischief deep within makes me want to contact Brussels with a concern that there is increased terrestrial TV news coverage of Coronavirus.  Iíd mention that these broadcasts are all in High Definition, whereas emergency services also have to compete for radio spectrum.

Whatís the betting theyíd ask the BBC to switch Freeview back to SD? :D
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: Weaver on March 27, 2020, 01:47:21 AM
The image quality was awful at times well before this on standard rate when there was a lot of incompressible content. At least itís good news for me in that I can download programmes faster on my slow 10Mbps d/s link.
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: tubaman on March 27, 2020, 07:46:54 AM
I've just picked-up on this thread and I'm afraid this is something I'd very much label as 'first world problem'. The world in is crisis and we are worrying that our streaming services don't look quite as nice as usual! With the number of people having to work at home now I think it's absolutely right that bandwidth is being diverted to more important things.
If they were threatening to turn them off that might (only might) be a different matter, but for now what has been done seems a very proportionate response to me.
 :)
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: chenks on March 27, 2020, 08:39:11 AM
we never had bandwidth issues to being with.
BT showed that they were never reaching anywhere near their highest peak.

lets watch all these streaming services "forget" to increase it again once everything is back to normal.
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: Alex Atkin UK on March 27, 2020, 02:12:33 PM
I've just picked-up on this thread and I'm afraid this is something I'd very much label as 'first world problem'. The world in is crisis and we are worrying that our streaming services don't look quite as nice as usual! With the number of people having to work at home now I think it's absolutely right that bandwidth is being diverted to more important things.
If they were threatening to turn them off that might (only might) be a different matter, but for now what has been done seems a very proportionate response to me.
 :)

You seem to be forgetting that vulnerable people are relying on this to cope with the stress.  Plus as already pointed out, there is no bandwidth problem that they need to mitigate here.  You can't make a big push for net neutrality and then simply backtrack on it, even during an emergency, without causing a fuss.  What's to say those home workers aren't also watching Netflix to relax in their free time?  Who are they to say my mental health is less important?

We need to make a big deal out of this so people finally realise THIS is the future they are asking for by ditching physical media.

The services also need to realise how insane this is when I could go and Torrent the same content at better quality than they are now streaming, and that doesn't seem to be throttled either.
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: tubaman on March 27, 2020, 03:05:12 PM
I absolutely understand that people use streaming services to help relax and that it's good for their mental health. All of the services are still available at present, just not at the quality level they have been. The workers at home can still watch Netflix if they choose. I just think that at this time of international crisis there are much higher priorities than the resolution of online steaming services.
 :)
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: Alex Atkin UK on March 27, 2020, 03:19:54 PM
Maybe just me but I stop enjoying things once the macro-blocking reaches a certain point.
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: tubaman on March 27, 2020, 04:53:22 PM
Maybe just me but I stop enjoying things once the macro-blocking reaches a certain point.

There is a point where it gets annoying yes, but that depends on what you are watching on I suppose. Its less obvious on smaller screens.
 :)
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: chenks on March 27, 2020, 04:59:24 PM
youtube, for example, have just changed their "auto" setting to default to 720p, but you can still manually put it back up to 4k (where applicable).
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: Weaver on March 27, 2020, 07:15:00 PM
I donít believe there was a problem that needed fixing; the important thing for ISPs is peak demand surely ? and I donít see that being any worse - homeworkers now working through the day will have a spread-out load, and the evening peak will be unchanged.

On the other hand, if the ISPs are concerned about total traffic quantity then that will have been moved from offices to homes but in the case of calling in to the office with a corporate VPN then you still have the into-office traffic too so all in all a 2x (or 3x) increase in total : home-Internet + internet-office + office-internet possibly.
Title: Re: Zen bandwidth usage during pandemic
Post by: Alex Atkin UK on March 27, 2020, 11:33:49 PM
I donít believe there was a problem that needed fixing; the important thing for ISPs is peak demand surely ? and I donít see that being any worse - homeworkers now working through the day will have a spread-out load, and the evening peak will be unchanged.

Exactly!  I've not seen a single report from an ISP saying they were struggling under the load, all the major UK ISPs said they were well within their peak capacity.