Kitz Forum
Computer Software => Security => Topic started by: sevenlayermuddle on September 28, 2019, 02:49:58 PM
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I think this is a scam, but not yet certain...
...An automated call, claiming to be from Amazon, offering to cancel my prime membership, to avoid getting charged. I'm invited to press a button to speak to somebody, but have not yet done so.
Interesting thing is, I accidentally subscribed to a free trial of Prime a week ago, easily done with Amazon's interfaces. And that's OK, I'll enjoy access to the free streaming for a few weeks, then cancel before it becomes chargeable. Multiple reminders to do so have been set! But that has another three weeks to go until it expires, so why would Amazon be calling me today (twice)?
And of interest, since I don't trust Amazon any more than anybody else, I have never given them my phone number. The contact number on my Amazon account is fake (a truncated version of my own number). Our BT phone account is not even in my name, other half does that. So, rather odd they should be calling me on a number they should not know. ???
So I'm proceeding on the assumption it is a scam, probably aimed at 'phishing' my account details. I haven't yet elected to speak to the caller, whilst I ponder how best to play it.
If it is a scam, it is certainly a coincidence that I really did take out a prime trial last week, and the scam is targeting people in that situation. A data leak? A lucky guess? Or just an assumption that many (maybe most, excluding techies!), average people have accidentally subscribed to prime in the past, and ended up paying?
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I'm sure it's scam. Like you, I got tricked into a Prime trial, and I did exactly the same as you. I've never been phoned by Amazon, and if they've got a number for me it will be an invented one.
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Thanks for the encouragement. :)
Clever scam, though. Upon answering the first call, given the lucky timing, I actually assumed it was genuine. But I happened to be busy at that moment, so just hung up, thinking I’d cancel it later.
I link to think I am sensible enough and careful enough to be immune to scams but truth is, sooner or later, somebody might catch me off guard. Same goes for most of us, I suspect. :(
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PS: Actually, I should have tried searching before starting this thread....
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-49733823
Silly me, for even thinking it might be anything other than a scam. But a useful reminder that I am indeed silly sometimes, and should bear that in mind :-[
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<Cough> As far as I am concerned, Amazon Prime is a scam. :D
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I'm afraid these days I work on the principle that ANY unsolicited call is a scam.
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<Cough> As far as I am concerned, Amazon Prime is a scam. :D
I agree, although it is undoubtably, technically legal. Interesting nonetheless that Amazon’s legal ‘prime’ scam has been so successful as to give rise to a second order scam, this one hugely fraudulent and totally illegal. :'(
I'm afraid these days I work on the principle that ANY unsolicited call is a scam.
Me too. Yet, owing to an unfortunate timing coincidence, lucky on their part, this one nearly had me going.
And not all unsolicited calls are scams. Not so long ago I took a different unsolicited call claiming to be from Amazon, displaying a UK geographic calling number . Specifically it claimed to be a delivery driver, wanting to know if we were home before attempting delivery. That’s ‘we’ as in my other half who, despite my cautions to the contrary, does supply a phone number to the likes of Amazon. It still seems like a weird call but the evidence is it was genuine, as a guy with a similar sounding voice turned up 10 minutes later with a nicely wrapped ‘amazon’ box, contents of which she had indeed ordered. ???
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<Cough> As far as I am concerned, Amazon Prime is a scam. :D
As much as I hate using Amazon due to their shady tax practices, we find Prime saves us a fortune as we shop there regularly. My mum also watches Prime Video.
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As much as I hate using Amazon due to their shady tax practices, we find Prime saves us a fortune as we shop there regularly. My mum also watches Prime Video.
If you choose to use prime and it works for you then that’s absolutely fine. I’m sure they have many happy users.
The reason many of us regard Prime as, in some ways, a scam, relates to the nasty tactics they use to trick people into accidentally signing up for free trials. These signups can even go unnoticed, then later turn into card charges.
See
https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/reclaim/amazon-prime-refund/
And
https://www.theguardian.com/money/2018/jan/25/amazon-prime-charges-renewal-automatic
They also had their knuckles wrapped by Advertising Standards Agency, for dodgy claims about the benefits of Prime
https://www.asa.org.uk/rulings/amazon-europe-core-sarl-a17-408329.html
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Very recently I inadvertently signed up to Prime while updating a Subscribe & Save order. Fortunately I noticed and customer services were able to undo the damage. It would have been rather better if I had the option to untick Prime during my order process.
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Fair point.
Another dodgy tactic seems to be that they continue to encourage me to "join Prime", even though I'm already part of a Prime Family so getting most of the benefits already.
I also consider it shady that while Prime Video is shared with Prime Family, rentals and I think even video purchases are not. Purchases however CAN be shared with Google Family, which is a huge bonus now most of my digital copies I got from Blurays have been migrated to Google.
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Another scam, even if legal...
Today, I was shopping on Amazon for an internal Sata drive. I found one I liked and clicked ‘add to basket’, to be confronted by a half screen ‘foldover’ inviting me to add accident & breakdown insurance. Yes really, accident and breakdown cover, on an internal disk drive. ::)
Just when I thought the endless phone calls inviting me to reclaim miss sold PPI might be over, I suddenly envisage it happening all over again, in relation to Amazon selling pointless and useless product insurance policies. :o
I reacted by looking for the same drive elsewhere. Found it on the BT shop for only £5 more than Amazon, which I gladly paid, just to avoid buying it from Amazon. :(
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I view Amazon’s website through an ad-blocker in Safari iOS and perhaps that helps a lot, maybe improving my experience greatly by deleting a lot of the clutter. I have been doing this for so long that I have no idea what the site would look like without such pruning.
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@Weaver,
On iOS too, I get presented with the insurance sales pitch. I don’t think it is an advert, it looks like it’s part of the website. It is presented in such a way, imho, that it would be possible for some people to accept it my mistake. I’ve only noticed it as of yesterday, so might be new. Appears for lots of goods, but the Sata drive seemed plain ridiculous.
If you’d like to try it, just find (for example) any internal Sata drive (search say, “2Tb sata”) and tap “add to basket”.... I’d be interested to know if your ad-blocker prevents it.
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Just tried it, exactly as you specified, and no advert. This Safari ad-blocker, 1Blocker X, can strip out all kinds of annoying crap including particular objects that you pick out and ‘nuke’ by highlighting them; it’s not restricted to third-party content adverts.
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I have also got it set up to really gut eBay and get rid of the vast amounts of random irrelevant junk on their site, stuff which makes pages slow expensive and makes them so large that scrolling is required.
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When they ask you to press a button, does this invoke a call-back to them ? Because then they can (try to) charge you £50-150 for an ultra-high rate chargeable call.
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When they ask you to press a button, does this invoke a call-back to them ? Because then they can (try to) charge you £50-150 for an ultra-high rate chargeable call.
May be wrong, but I have always believed that to be an *urban myth. I have often pressed the button to “speak to an advisor” on scam callers, just so I can annoy them, and have never been charged.
*PS: My belief of urban myth applies only to BT landlines. For Mobiles, and other CPs, I have no opinion to offer, as to whether such fraud is a real risk.
Edit: added PS
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It sounds to me like an urban myth - but I thought I would ask. So we think it doesn’t exist. Correct ?
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Its not a scam, there is a difference.
But prime benefits are kind of blurry.
They have been told off for the next day delivery as more and more products are no longer next day on prime.
The free delivery is really inclusive delivery, as it isnt free if you have to pay a subscription fee. The majority of prime items have a price premium over non prime items as well. So can see how delivery costs are factored in.
What annoys me the most tho is amazon are still so dated on their delivery service, dpd etc. give you a delivery slot. Even hermes and yodel do now. With amazon its a 14 hour delivery window, which is ridiculous in 2019. If you can find something on same day delivery you do at least reduce it to a 4 hour window as it becomes 6-10pm.
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It sounds to me like an urban myth - but I thought I would ask. So we think it doesn’t exist. Correct ?
I don’t think there is any way a scammer can get cash just by persuading a called party, on a BT land line, to press a button. That is my belief, and I have often tested that belief by pressing buttons on incoming scam calls, and never cost me a penny.
The reason scammers play a recorded message, inviting the victim to press a button, is simply to save manpower.
BT do the same thing themselves. We are still on a traditional, quarterly paid, BT landline. When the bill is (over)due we get an automatic call along the lines of
“This is British Telecom, we need to talk to the account holder. If you are the account holder, please press button <whatever>”
It is virtually indistinguishable from the 1001 similar calls that are scams, except that one is not a scam. ::)
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The big problems we have with Amazon are how dreadfully poor things are packed in weak-ass boxes. (oh how the mighty have fallen, they used to have the BEST packing/boxes)
But mostly the subscribe and save items being charged and delivered consistently days early.
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Back on Amazon, and not specifically Prime, I had to buy some bits for a piece of garden machinery a couple of weeks ago. Amazon.co.uk had them, but prices were extortionate.
Since the machine is German made, I tried Amazon.de. There were the bits I wanted, at just under 10 Euros, vs UK £24. After currency conversion and postage I paid just over £13, a saving of £11. Nice trick but begs the question, is the .uk site ripping us off on a regular basis? :o
And in case anybody’s wondering, in both cases the seller was Amazon themselves, rather than a merchant.
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Can not justify subscription to Amazon Prime and have always refused to be pressured into signing up, to date, I usually submit orders of £20 plus and stick to Amazon direct supply items to take advantage of the free P&P..
However, have noted and previously commented that the delivery time for non prime customers has constantly been increasing, I reside off the mainland but within the UK, from experience, I know that Royal Mail (1st class) small parcel delivery can easily be next day, 3 days max even with 2nd class, virtually all of my Amazon orders are received by Royal Mail, can only conclude that Amazon are deliberately holding back order dispatch trying to exert increasing pressure on customers to sign up to prime.
As an example, I placed an order with Amazon on Saturday, 28/09, value approx. £150, items in stock and directly supplied by Amazon, opted for the usual free delivery, content well within Royal Mail "small parcel" catagory, expected delivery date advised as Wed. 09/10, certainly the worst I have seen to date.
I will certainly be taking my trade elsewhere whenever possible in the future, other options are available !
Edit: Typo correction
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I use Amazon Prime Video a lot and the ‘free’ delivery thing helps a bit as we use them very heavily; given that it’s a four hour round trip drive to civilisation, internet shopping is crucial.
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@Weaver
Yes, I appreciate that your "off the mainland" location is certainly more remote than mine and you are also making use of the other Amazon Prime facilities which are available as well as free (and prompt) delivery, however, I currently have no wish to do so and I refuse to be pressured into subscribing just to receive delivery times to normal expectations for my residential area as achieved by many other supplier I have used.
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I personally find that delivery times seem to be completely random. That includes the past couple of weeks with (accidental) Prime... simply random, no better, no worse, than normal.
Best was an item last month....
I excitedly opened the email, “Arriving today”. It was “out for delivery”. :)
Five minutes later, another update, “delay due to external factors” :(
Quickly followed by “cannot deliver, parcel damaged, order will be refunded”
I then received confirmation of the refund. I was gutted, as I’d been looking forwards so much to that item. I had even enclosed a ‘gift’ note, to myself, from myself, all wasted. I nearly re ordered, but was nearly in tears, as the price had gone up. :'(
Later that day, it arrived, in a damaged box but intact, with no further explanation. :D
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Can not justify subscription to Amazon Prime and have always refused to be pressured into signing up, to date, I usually submit orders of £20 plus and stick to Amazon direct supply items to take advantage of the free P&P..
However, have noted and previously commented that the delivery time for non prime customers has constantly been increasing, I reside off the mainland but within the UK, from experience, I know that Royal Mail (1st class) small parcel delivery can easily be next day, 3 days max even with 2nd class, virtually all of my Amazon orders are received by Royal Mail, can only conclude that Amazon are deliberately holding back order dispatch trying to exert increasing pressure on customers to sign up to prime.
As an example, I placed an order with Amazon on Saturday, 28/09, value approx. £150, items in stock and directly supplied by Amazon, opted for the usual free delivery, content well within Royal Mail "small parcel" catagory, expected delivery date advised as Wed. 09/10, certainly the worst I have seen to date.
I will certainly be taking my trade elsewhere whenever possible in the future, other options are available !
Edit: Typo correction
yes they delay dispatch on super saver easily known as they send email when dispatching, although some people claim quick delivery on super saver, for me they always delay it.
prime delivery can slow now as well.
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If I might be forgiven for pulling this thread back on topic, two further media reports...
https://www.edp24.co.uk/news/scam-amazon-calls-warning-suffolk-1-6293705
https://www.harwichandmanningtreestandard.co.uk/news/17932451.trading-standards-warning-amazon-scam-calls/
All of the media reports are recent, albeit misguided in that there is some daft belief in geographic relevancy. I would not be surprised if, in coming weeks, this turns into quite a big thing.
Imho Amazon have brought it upon themselves, and their customers, by starting the whole ‘Prime’ scam/gimmick in the first place . They can’t be surprised that less scrupulous crooks are cashing in, and taking it to a whole new level. :(
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yes they delay dispatch on super saver easily known as they send email when dispatching, although some people claim quick delivery on super saver, for me they always delay it.
It's the fact that what would appear to be deliberate dispatch delays are increasing all the time, certainly in my experience, I find this really annoying and increases my determination not to be press ganged into a Prime subscription and do my best to source my requirements elsewhere even if that involves greater cost and incurs what I would consider to be fair & reasonable P&P charges.
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Thanks Tiffy, but as I started this thread, I really do think it might be time to get back on topic? :)
If I might be forgiven for pulling this thread back on topic, two further media reports...
https://www.edp24.co.uk/news/scam-amazon-calls-warning-suffolk-1-6293705
https://www.harwichandmanningtreestandard.co.uk/news/17932451.trading-standards-warning-amazon-scam-calls/
All of the media reports are recent, albeit misguided in that there is some daft belief in geographic relevancy. I would not be surprised if, in coming weeks, this turns into quite a big thing.
Imho Amazon have brought it upon themselves, and their customers, by starting the whole ‘Prime’ scam/gimmick in the first place . They can’t be surprised that less scrupulous crooks are cashing in, and taking it to a whole new level. :(
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@SLM
Was just editing an opology to my previous entry when you posted, enough said, back on topic.
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:)
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If I might be forgiven for pulling this thread back on topic, two further media reports...
https://www.edp24.co.uk/news/scam-amazon-calls-warning-suffolk-1-6293705
Unfortunately that first link gives me just a pale blue background and nothing more.
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Unfortunately that first link gives me just a pale blue background and nothing more.
Odd. I see a page from the Eastern Daily Press, which I assume to be a legitimate regional paper - peppered with ads of course, like all newspapers. The story told is...
Trading Standards officers have had reports from residents who have received scam calls from a "fraudster pretending to be from Amazon", claiming that "your Amazon Prime subscription is due to expire,"
A post on the Suffolk Trading Standards Facebook page said: "Amazon Scam Calls: Beware of telephone calls being made by fraudster pretending to be from Amazon.
"We've had reports of calls being made from individuals claiming your Amazon Prime subscription is due to expire, and will be automatically taken from your account.
"The recorded message asks you to press 1 to cancel or to speak to an advisor.
"The call then goes through to an individual who 'requires' your personal details.
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Unfortunately that first link gives me just a pale blue background and nothing more.
Opens OK for me also, Firefox, Pale Moon or MS Edge on Win 10.
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If I click on the link (using Pale Moon on Linux) it hangs with a message about a script not completing. If I copy the link and enter it into Konqueror (a Linux/KDE browser), it opens and works normally, but then after closing Konqueror I can't open it again. So there does seem to be something strange about the web page, and it affects different browsers in different ways.
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I had a amazon super saver arrive on royal mail special delivery once, they delayed dispatch 6 days then sent it pre 1pm next day.
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Opens OK for me also, Firefox, Pale Moon or MS Edge on Win 10.
loads here, but 24 trackers/advertiser hosts, wow. 98% of the page filtered and it still loaded. 2% content 98% tracking. Sites that loaded with tracking dont deserve linking to, I will just quote their text instead.
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loads here, but 24 trackers/advertiser hosts, wow. 98% of the page filtered and it still loaded. 2% content 98% tracking. Sites that loaded with tracking dont deserve linking to, I will just quote their text instead.
Yes, had not paid much attention to that aspect, my Bit Defender 2020 AV "tracker blocker" which runs on my main browser, Firefox, indicates 19 sites blocked on that URL, one of the worst I've seen on any site.
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Odd. I see a page from the Eastern Daily Press, which I assume to be a legitimate regional paper - peppered with ads of course, like all newspapers. The story told is...
Thank you for quoting the contents of the report. I suspect the non-loading is due to its advert bloated status . . .
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Amazon Prime is a scam
For me it's not and I get good use out of it.
Before I signed up to Prime I was paying about half the subscription costs in Amazon postages even though I would wait a few days for non-urgent items so they were free.
With my Prime I get unlimited free next day delivery. I've ordered an item at 11pm on Sat eve and it was here the next day (Sunday!) My bro who lives nr the city gets same day delivery.
I also get access to:-
- Prime TV for movies and box sets. You have to pay extra for the latest movies but I can usually always find something to watch for free.
- Prime Music which is streamed to my echo devices
- Free Kindle books- currently a choice of 2 free pre-release books per month to keep plus free access to their lending library. (You have to 'return' the book before you can download another).
- Offers from Amazon pantry - usually free delivery. Many items supplied by Morrisons.
- Prime day!!!
There are lots of other things included which I don't use such as Drive storage and Free video games.
For me it is well worth it and I have saved many times over as I cancelled NOW TV when I got Prime TV, so thats a saving of £96 before I even start on anything else. The music is used daily. I always claim my free books and read them although I perhaps don't take full advantage of the lending library. I use pantry about once a month for heavy shopping items and they often have some really good deals on wines which I would buy anyhow.
Oh and Prime day... Love it. I have saved an awful lot of money on prime day on genuine offers. The downside is it only happens once a year but if you know you are wanting a specific item its well worth waiting until it comes around. Over the years, I saved nearly a third on my Hive heating.. I got a shark vacuum cleaner for nearly half price. A steam generator iron for half price and an additional echo dot for £20.. plus loads of smaller items.
I pay annually as it cheaper anyhow and sometimes they give you another tenner off... so for me the £70 pa has been worth every penny as it more than pays for itself - several times over.
I suspect it depends on your individual circumstances if it is good value for you for not.
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I use Amazon Prime like kitz, though I mainly use it because I regularly order a lot of items from Amazon.
The Prime tv and movies are good too.
I've been a prime member for many years.
I just noticed the annual savings, so I just changed to yearly (Thanks kitz :) ).
I've never had a phone call from Amazon Prime though, so it's probably a scam. In my case they email.