Kitz Forum

Broadband Related => FTTC and FTTP Issues => Topic started by: adslmax on March 01, 2019, 04:26:09 PM

Title: DLM reduced my line?
Post by: adslmax on March 01, 2019, 04:26:09 PM
I just noticed DLM had resync just after 1:25pm today (very disappointed with massive huge 8701Kbps knocked off from 80000Kbps)  :( :'(

Code: [Select]
xDSL
Mode VDSL2
Traffic Type PTM
Status Up
Link Power State L0
Downstream Upstream
Line Coding (Trellis) On On
SNR Margin (dB) 6.1 12.1
Attenuation (dB) 11.6 0.0
Output Power (dBm) 12.5 0.0
Attainable Rate (Kbps) 71571 22147
Rate (Kbps) 71299 19999

DSLAM type / SW version:   BDCM:0xa48c (164.140) / v0xa48c
Modem/router firmware:     AnnexA version - A2pv6F039g1.d24m
DSL mode:                  VDSL2 Profile 17a
Status:                    Showtime
Uptime:                     2 hours 59 min 22 sec
Resyncs:                   1 (since 01 Mar 2019 13:25:45)
         
            Downstream   Upstream
Line attenuation (dB):     11.6      0.0
Signal attenuation (dB):   Not available on VDSL2      
Connection speed (kbps):   71299      19999
SNR margin (dB):           6.1      12.1
Power (dBm):               12.5      0.0
Interleave depth:          16      1
INP:                       48.00      0
G.INP:                     Enabled      Not enabled
Vectoring status:          5 (VECT_UNCONFIGURED)      

RSCorr/RS (%):             0.0000      0.0000
RSUnCorr/RS (%):           0.0000      0.0000
ES/hour:                   0      0

IP Profile has dropped too at 68.93Mbps

Do u think DLM will try lower SNR from 6dB to 3dB next step?
Title: Re: DLM reduced my line?
Post by: j0hn on March 01, 2019, 06:38:10 PM
DLM hasn't reduced your line and it probably wasn't a DLM initiated resync.
The line is connecting just shy of the attainable rate with no spare SNRM.
It's probably just another crosstalker.

It would be better in future if you posted the output of xdslcmd info --stats rather than the 2 sets of stats you posted. It provides much more info.
It can also be copy/posted from DslStats rather than having to telnet in with Putty.
You will find it under "Telnet Data > Connection Stats"

Every time your line has dropped below 80Mb in the past it has returned to the full 80Mb within a relatively short time frame.
DLM may not lower the SNRM target for a while (if at all).
Title: Re: DLM reduced my line?
Post by: adslmax on March 01, 2019, 08:46:40 PM
Thanks but I don't think it won't go back to 80 meg now because the dsl checker has changed from 78 to 68 over the last five years now.
Title: Re: DLM reduced my line?
Post by: CarlT on March 01, 2019, 09:18:05 PM
Seems a good attitude to have in that case - not worrying about it.
Title: Re: DLM reduced my line?
Post by: adslmax on March 02, 2019, 12:49:21 PM
My dsl checker say Downstream Handback Threshold(Mbps) are 63.4 but this mean I can't raise the fault to my isp until the sync rate went below 63Meg is that correct?
Title: Re: DLM reduced my line?
Post by: vultura on March 02, 2019, 01:59:50 PM
https://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.php/2017/01/bt-wholesale-broadband-checker-adds-downstream-handback-threshold.html

https://www.thinkbroadband.com/news/7615-handback-a-new-term-to-add-to-your-broadband-dictionary

Title: Re: DLM reduced my line?
Post by: pooclah on March 02, 2019, 08:04:58 PM

My dsl checker say Downstream Handback Threshold(Mbps) are 63.4 but this mean I can't raise the fault to my isp until the sync rate went below 63Meg is that correct?

Hi Max

Yes that is correct.

From an old post of yours

Quote
Max Rate 81069K
Sync Rate 79999K
SNR 3.1dB
G.INP Enabled

Now you're posting

Quote
SNR Margin (dB)   6.1   12.1
Attenuation (dB)   11.6   0.0
Output Power (dBm)   12.5   0.0
Attainable Rate (Kbps)   71571   22147
Rate (Kbps)   71299      19999

Have you been trying 'to improve your connection' again and upset the DLM?

Kevin
Title: Re: DLM reduced my line?
Post by: adslmax on March 02, 2019, 10:54:07 PM
Hi Max

Yes that is correct.

From an old post of yours

Now you're posting

Have you been trying 'to improve your connection' again and upset the DLM?

Kevin

No I haven't touch anything!
Title: Re: DLM reduced my line?
Post by: CarlT on March 03, 2019, 02:44:19 PM
Best guess DLM wasn't happy with performance at the 3dB margin and returned it to standard settings. If it sees improvements it'll reduce the margin accordingly.

Whomever wrote the software and web pages that allow people to monitor pages like the BT Wholesale availability checker for changes and receive emails for relatively minor adjustments to their rate adaptive xDSL services goes right alongside the dude who produced software allowing people to obsessively speed test their services hourly in having a lot to answer for.
Title: Re: DLM reduced my line?
Post by: adslmax on March 04, 2019, 03:50:06 AM
Rather surprise my line got both interleaved ON after resync around 1:40am today

Downstream   Upstream
Line attenuation (dB):     11.5      0.0
Signal attenuation (dB):   Not available on VDSL2      
Connection speed (kbps):   78451           20000
SNR margin (dB):           6.6      14.1
Power (dBm):               12.4      -0.6
Interleave depth:          8      8
INP:                       46.00      47.00
G.INP:                     Enabled      Enabled





Title: Re: DLM reduced my line?
Post by: tiffy on March 04, 2019, 05:32:38 PM
Yes, you certainly have US G.Inp applied now, as you have not supplied stats as j0hn suggested earlier can't really say why this has occured, most likely a sharp increase in US ES rate.

From my experience on the lines I monitor, US G.Inp application is now more likely or perhaps more obviously, periods of increased US ES rates beyond a defined threshold will activate a DLM re-synch and apply US G.Inp as per normal expectation.

See recent post on my observations regarding US G.Inp application showing definitive US ES & CRC rates prior to application:
https://forum.kitz.co.uk/index.php/topic,23099.msg391893.html#msg391893

   
Title: Re: DLM reduced my line?
Post by: CarlT on March 04, 2019, 06:26:45 PM
Anyone remember this?

https://forum.kitz.co.uk/index.php/topic,23064.msg391816.html#msg391816
Title: Re: DLM reduced my line?
Post by: vultura on March 04, 2019, 07:26:23 PM
To have such speeds is just a dream for me......
Title: Re: DLM reduced my line?
Post by: tubaman on March 04, 2019, 07:29:59 PM
To have such speeds is just a dream for me......
Ditto.   :(
Title: Re: DLM reduced my line?
Post by: g3uiss on March 04, 2019, 08:16:46 PM
And another ditto.....20/2 best I can get  >:(
Title: Re: DLM reduced my line?
Post by: adslmax on March 04, 2019, 08:28:19 PM
I know I guess I am very lucky as the cabinet seem very friendly with me lately  :P
Title: Re: DLM reduced my line?
Post by: burakkucat on March 04, 2019, 09:12:52 PM
Anyone remember this?

https://forum.kitz.co.uk/index.php/topic,23064.msg391816.html#msg391816

Yes, Carl, yes.  ::)
Title: Re: DLM reduced my line?
Post by: adslmax on March 04, 2019, 10:38:53 PM
Anyone remember this?

https://forum.kitz.co.uk/index.php/topic,23064.msg391816.html#msg391816

Yes and what about it?
Title: Re: DLM reduced my line?
Post by: adslmax on March 05, 2019, 08:07:09 PM
The line has resync this afternoon before 2pm and now back to 80Meg. :)

Downstream   Upstream
Line attenuation (dB):     11.6      0.0
Signal attenuation (dB):   Not available on VDSL2      
Connection speed (kbps):   80000      19999
SNR margin (dB):           6.3      14.8
Power (dBm):               12.5      0.0
Interleave depth:          8      1
INP:                       49.00      0
G.INP:                     Enabled      Not enabled
Vectoring status:          5 (VECT_UNCONFIGURED)   

adsl info --pbParams
adsl: ADSL driver and PHY status
Status: Showtime
Last Retrain Reason:    1
Last initialization procedure status:   2
Max:    Upstream rate = 28573 Kbps, Downstream rate = 83617 Kbps
Bearer: 0, Upstream rate = 19999 Kbps, Downstream rate = 80000 Kbps
Bearer: 1, Upstream rate = 0 Kbps, Downstream rate = 0 Kbps
Discovery Phase (Initial) Band Plan
US: (7,32) (871,1205) (1972,2782)
DS: (33,859) (1216,1961) (2793,3970)
Medley Phase (Final) Band Plan
US: (7,32) (871,1205) (1972,2782)
DS: (33,859) (1216,1961) (2793,3970)
                  VDSL Port Details               Upstream                Downstream
Attainable Net Data Rate:           28573 kbps              83617 kbps
Actual Aggregate Tx Power:             0.0 dBm               12.5 dBm
====================================================================================
  VDSL Band Status   U0   U1   U2   U3   U4   D1   D2   D3
  Line Attenuation(dB):   2.7   13.3   20.5   N/A   N/A   6.9   15.8   26.4
Signal Attenuation(dB):   2.7   12.4   19.5   N/A   N/A   8.9   15.7   26.4
        SNR Margin(dB):   14.5   15.1   14.7   N/A   N/A   6.5   6.2   6.0
         TX Power(dBm):   -14.9   -30.5   -0.1   N/A   N/A   8.3   7.8   7.0
Title: Re: DLM reduced my line?
Post by: burakkucat on March 05, 2019, 08:51:45 PM
Yes, I see. That's looking good.  :)
Title: Re: DLM reduced my line?
Post by: adslmax on March 09, 2019, 06:28:22 PM
Got power cut three days ago (first time we has our power cut for a year)

Code: [Select]

xDSL
xDSL
Mode VDSL2
Traffic Type PTM
Status Up
Link Power State L0
Downstream Upstream
Line Coding (Trellis) On On
SNR Margin (dB) 9.0 15.3
Attenuation (dB) 11.5 0.0
Output Power (dBm) 12.4 -0.3
Attainable Rate (Kbps) 95323 36358
Rate (Kbps) 79999 19999
B (# of bytes in Mux Data Frame) 130 237
M (# of Mux Data Frames in an RS codeword) 1 1
T (# of Mux Data Frames in an OH sub-frame) 0 42
R (# of redundancy bytes in the RS codeword) 8 16
S (# of data symbols over which the RS code word spans) 0.0518 0.3781
L (# of bits transmitted in each data symbol) 21468 5374
D (interleaver depth) 16 1
I (interleaver block size in bytes) 139 127
N (RS codeword size) 139 254
Delay (msec) 0 0
INP (DMT symbol) 48.00 0.00

Code: [Select]
adsl info --stats
adsl: ADSL driver and PHY status
Status: Showtime
Last Retrain Reason:    0
Last initialization procedure status:   0
Max:    Upstream rate = 36358 Kbps, Downstream rate = 95323 Kbps
Bearer: 0, Upstream rate = 19999 Kbps, Downstream rate = 79999 Kbps
Bearer: 1, Upstream rate = 0 Kbps, Downstream rate = 0 Kbps
Link Power State:       L0
Mode:                   VDSL2 Annex B
VDSL2 Profile:          Profile 17a
TPS-TC:                 PTM Mode(0x0)
Trellis:                U:ON /D:ON
Line Status:            No Defect
Training Status:        Showtime
                Down            Up
SNR (dB):        9.0             15.3
Attn(dB):        11.5            0.0
Pwr(dBm):        12.4           -0.3

                        VDSL2 framing
                        Bearer 0
MSGc:           -6              26
B:              130             237
M:              1               1
T:              0               42
R:              8               16
S:              0.0518          0.3781
L:              21468           5374
D:              16              1
I:              139             127
N:              139             254
Q:              16              0
V:              14              0
RxQueue:                60              0
TxQueue:                20              0
G.INP Framing:          18              0
G.INP lookback:         20              0
RRC bits:               0               24
                        Bearer 1
MSGc:           186             -6
B:              0               0
M:              2               0
T:              2               0
R:              16              0
S:              5.3333          0.0000
L:              48              0
D:              3               0
I:              32              0
N:              32              0
Q:              0               0
V:              0               0
RxQueue:                0               0
TxQueue:                0               0
G.INP Framing:          0               0
G.INP lookback:         0               0
RRC bits:               0               0

                        Counters
                        Bearer 0
OHF:            0               3041547
OHFErr:         0               230
RS:             2679841984              2127855
RSCorr:         6750            1427
RSUnCorr:       0               0
                        Bearer 1
OHF:            19549448                0
OHFErr:         0               0
RS:             234593370               0
RSCorr:         23              0
RSUnCorr:       0               0

                        Retransmit Counters
rtx_tx:         2083729         0
rtx_c:          138             0
rtx_uc:         0               0

                        G.INP Counters
LEFTRS:         0               0
minEFTR:        79982           0
errFreeBits:    383142040               0

                        Bearer 0
HEC:            0               0
OCD:            0               0
LCD:            0               0
Total Cells:    1064710656              0
Data Cells:     709722215               0
Drop Cells:     0
Bit Errors:     0               0

                        Bearer 1
HEC:            0               0
OCD:            0               0
LCD:            0               0
Total Cells:    0               0
Data Cells:     0               0
Drop Cells:     0
Bit Errors:     0               0

ES:             0               130
SES:            0               0
UAS:            0               0
AS:             314062

                        Bearer 0
INP:            48.00           0.00
INPRein:        0.00            0.00
delay:          0               0
PER:            0.00            3.98
OR:             0.01            64.22
AgR:            80614.82        20063.54

                        Bearer 1
INP:            4.00            0.00
INPRein:        4.00            0.00
delay:          3               0
PER:            16.06           0.01
OR:             95.62           0.01
AgR:            95.62   0.01

Bitswap:        73/73           18/18

Total time = 3 days 15 hours 14 min 22 sec
FEC:            6750            1427
CRC:            0               230
ES:             0               130
SES:            0               0
UAS:            0               0
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
Latest 15 minutes time = 14 min 22 sec
FEC:            18              6
CRC:            0               2
ES:             0               1
SES:            0               0
UAS:            0               0
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
Previous 15 minutes time = 15 min 0 sec
FEC:            2               0
CRC:            0               0
ES:             0               0
SES:            0               0
UAS:            0               0
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
Latest 1 day time = 15 hours 14 min 22 sec
FEC:            468             71
CRC:            0               19
ES:             0               15
SES:            0               0
UAS:            0               0
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
Previous 1 day time = 24 hours 0 sec
FEC:            1958            965
CRC:            0               123
ES:             0               48
SES:            0               0
UAS:            0               0
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
Since Link time = 3 days 15 hours 14 min 21 sec
FEC:            6750            1427
CRC:            0               230
ES:             0               130
SES:            0               0
UAS:            0               0
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
 >
Title: Re: DLM reduced my line?
Post by: pooclah on March 09, 2019, 09:53:12 PM
Yep been there - makes a big difference when no or only a few other users are connected to the cab

https://forum.kitz.co.uk/index.php/topic,18498.msg333293.html#msg333293 (https://forum.kitz.co.uk/index.php/topic,18498.msg333293.html#msg333293)


Title: Re: DLM reduced my line?
Post by: adslmax on March 09, 2019, 10:22:11 PM
Yeah I just wish openreach leave it uncapped and let the line speed go faster for the higher sync rate like 95/36 instead of 80/20
Title: Re: DLM reduced my line?
Post by: pooclah on March 09, 2019, 10:59:00 PM

But what would you need all that bandwidth for?

I find even with 3 of us streaming HD TV/films Iím only using a small percentage of mine.
Title: Re: DLM reduced my line?
Post by: CarlT on March 10, 2019, 08:20:00 AM
Yeah I just wish openreach leave it uncapped and let the line speed go faster for the higher sync rate like 95/36 instead of 80/20

As I said on the other place not worth the extra support overhead.

You'd have raised a case with PN due to your line speed dropping a huge, massive 15Mb as other users came online, crosstalk kicked in and forced rate adaption at a lower rate.

Only really viable if BT vector every cabinet, use SRA and have aggressive line management, combined with locking down the equipment you can connect to the line and that isn't happening.

If bandwidth envy is a thing for you though you might enjoy a watch of the video at https://forum.kitz.co.uk/index.php/topic,22482.msg394080.html#msg394080