Kitz Forum
Broadband Related => FTTC and FTTP Issues => Topic started by: guest_10 on January 25, 2019, 01:48:46 PM
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Hi all
We recently switched over to PlusNet Fibre from BT Infinity and since that point had nothing but problems and have no clue what the issue is. I'm not an expert on things, but I know a little bit. So I'll try to give as much info as possible.
ISP: Plusnet
Master Socket: NTE5C with VDSL faceplate (This was installed recently by the openreach engineer when the problems started prior to this it was the old master socket with a mk 3 faceplate)
Modem Router: Formerly Plusnet One now changed back to the BT Smart Hub 6.
Cabinet: Huawei
Home Set-Up: Multiple devices wired to a Switch and 2 x Linksys RE6500 access points wired via CAT 6 to the router.
Prior to switching over to Plusnet we had BT and didn't have any issues with broadband speed at all. I tested the line pretty regularly using speedtest and I would get pretty similar speeds using a CAT 6 or wireless on both bands. Wireless test was always done in the room where the router or access points were. Didn't experience any noticeable issues.
Since switching over to Plusnet, the problems kicked in with slow internet speeds and regular dropouts. Currently getting speeds of around 5 - 6 meg on the laptop via WiFi sitting in the same room as the router.
Reported it to Plusnet and they said they couldn't see the dropouts on their side, sent out an engineer, who switched out the master socket to NTE5C and tidied up something in the junction box and ran all the tests he could. No problems on the line from the cabinet to the property. His tests were showing that 68meg was coming through the master socket. When the router got plugged in and did the test again, the speed dropped 10meg which the engineer thought was strange but it was still above the point of sale rate, so he couldn't do anything more. His view was that if there are issues, it's either the router or Plusnets equipment at the exchange.
Unfortunately, even after the engineer visit, there are still ridiculously low speeds and regular disconnects.
Called up plusnet today and whilst on the phone to them switched the plusnet router to the old BT Smart Hub 6. Did a test and I'm getting the same Wifi speeds I was with the Plusnet router of 5 meg with the laptop less than 2 metres from the router. In the position when the ISP was BT I was getting over 60meg.
Can anyone explain what on earth is happening with my broadband. I'm considering getting a Huawei Openreach modem and third party router, but don't think that its going to do anything to improve the situation given switching back to the BT router didn't do anything.
Anyone have any suggestions.
Thanks
K
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Would you be able to get us some line stats from either the Hub One or the Smarthub please.
I think they are available under the Advanced section somewhere (Troubleshooting/Helpdesk??) and will show connection speed, SNR figures and line attenuation etc.
:)
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Not sure what those access points support, but could you check they are set to N or Ac not B/G I’d be suspicious that the issue is within your network. Alternatively try a speed test with a wired connection, if possible.
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I've disconnected the old plusnet one, so will there even be any line stats on that. As for the BT one I only connected it today, so will there be any useful data on there. I will copy what's there in any case.
The two access points are the Linksys RE6500. The settings for the WiFi on them haven't changed since I originally set them up. They are dual band and the band is split. I get the same low speeds from them as I do from the main router. The problem is not the internal network. The access points are wired to the main router via CAT 6 and the wired speeds I get are consistent when testing. The problem is even the devices which are wired to the router, switch and access points all lose connection to the internet. If it was just a WiFi issue then my wired devices wouldn't experience the connection loss they do.
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Are the low speeds on ethernet as well?
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Are the low speeds on ethernet as well?
Hmm . . . Surely K360 has already answered that query in his very last sentence --
If it was just a WiFi issue then my wired devices wouldn't experience the connection loss they do.
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To clarify when I'm using a wired connection the speeds are around the 58 meg mark and thats whether I'm wired into the router, switch or access points. The problem as I said is the wired devices still lose internet.
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His tests were showing that 68meg was coming through the master socket. When the router got plugged in and did the test again, the speed dropped 10meg which the engineer thought was strange but it was still above the point of sale rate,
Bit puzzled by that remark - to clarify did the speed drop to 10Mbps or drop from 68Mbps to 58Mbps.
In your fault ticket, plusnet often paste a copy of any GEA tests they have run. Do you have any that you can let us see (make sure you remove any personal info such as tel no)
If the line is dropping out then it will show on Plusnets RADIUS report.
May be worthwhile asking if they will run a fresh GEA test and let you have a copy of their RADIUS log. They are one of the very few ISPs who will provide this info if you ask nicely.
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So the speed issues look like they wifi related then. (other than the 10mbps drop)
The disconnect issues will probably need to diagnose via modem stats.
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When you have a drop out on the wired connection have you tried pinging IP addresses? First you should check the routers's IP and then something on the internet (e.g. 8.8.8.8 which is Google's DNS server).
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Still not had a chance to get the line stats apologies will try to get them tonight.
The 10meg drop I mentioned relates to the drop after the speed is coming out of the router. So when the engineer tested the speed direct in the master socket, the reading was 68meg, when he tested the speed with the router connected the speed was was 58 meg ergo a 10meg drop. This is puzzling but because it is above the contracted/point of sale rate of 48meg or something there isn't anything that can be done or there are no grounds on which to complain to plusnet.
Plusnet have said there is nothing of note within the tests they have done on their side and everything seems normal.
Yes the speed issues are definitely WiFi related which makes no sense because there were never speed issues when the ISP was BT. The WiFi speed issues aren't because of the router because they occur on the Plusnet Router and the BT Router that I've put back in the other day. Furthermore, it has nothing to do with WiFi signal because the problem occurs whether I'm 2 metres from the source or 10 metres from the source (which I never am). My best guess it is plusnet throttling the connection somehow and it only affects the WiFi because we are a high usage household.
As for the dropouts, I've not done any ping tests, so I will set some off over the course of a few days using both a cable and the wifi.
Thanks for the responses so far.
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Hi
So finally got a chance to get the line stats. Not sure how much info is necessary. So I have attached notepad files. There's 3 sets of logs. BT Home Hub and then the two access points. The two access points will have logs from the plusnet router that I switched out as well. I switched the plusnet router for the BT one the date this thread originally started. The event log from the BT router seems to be too large to attach. Do I need to filter the BT log in some way?
The line stats are below:
Product name:
BT Hub 6A
Serial number:
+084316+NQ70217441
Firmware version:
SG4B1000B540
Firmware updated:
14-May-2018
Board version:
1.0
Gui version:
1.64.0
DSL uptime:
5 Days, 8 Hours 15 Minutes 0 Seconds
Data rate:
14.39 Mbps / 63.27 Mbps
Maximum data rate:
14391 / 65552
Noise margin:
6.4 dB / 6.3 dB
Line attenuation:
18.3 dB
Signal attenuation:
VPI / VCI:
0/38
Modulation:
G_993_2_ANNEX_B
Latency type:
Fast Path
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Any help on this one?
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I can't see anything obvious . . . perhaps others may spot something. :-\
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Hmm . . . Surely K360 has already answered that query in his very last sentence --
Come on BC, a disconnection is different from slow speed :P
@K360 You need to be careful your not muddying the waters by how you are testing and explaining things.
First of all if you suspect poor supply speed then ONLY test via a wired connection, using Wi-Fi will complicate things, and leave it open for the ISP to blame your WiFi no matter how sure you are that it's OK. Concentrate on one problem at a time, thus isolating things.
So plug the modem/router directly into the test socket on the master socket, turn off Wi-Fi, disconnect any network cables, turn off WiFi on your laptop and connect it via a network cable. So now you have only the laptop connected you can run speed tests, but make sure nothing on the laptop is downloading or uploading as this will affect the results.
The logs /stats we need to see are what the modems connecting at, not access point logs.
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....
So plug the modem/router directly into the test socket on the master socket, turn off Wi-Fi, disconnect any network cables, turn off WiFi on your laptop and connect it via a network cable. So now you have only the laptop connected you can run speed tests, but make sure nothing on the laptop is downloading or uploading as this will affect the results.
The logs /stats we need to see are what the modems connecting at, not access point logs.
We can see from the logs provided that the Hub 6 has been up for over 5 days with a connection speed of 63/14. If the line connection was poor I think DLM would have taken action in that time and it clearly has not.
Agree that any speed tests must be run wired to ensure consistency.
If wired checks are consistently ok then you need to look at the wireless config. Although the BT Hubs claim to have 'smart wireless' - ie pick the best channels themselves - I don't believe this always works well in practice, and here are plenty of free wireless analysis apps out there that can quickly tell you which are the best channels to use.
If the wired checks are inconsistent then this is perhaps pointing at congestion on the PlusNet network, and I'm not sure what you can do about that one.
:)
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Thanks Tubeman, I was on my tablet earlier and must have missed the logs/stats from the hub :-[
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Hi,
Thanks for the responses
So to provide a degree of clarification on the matter.
There appear to be two issues that I am experiencing.
The first and most annoying is the internet speed when a device is connected via WiFi is reading less than 10meg consistently. This is the case no matter what transmitter I am connected to. So when I'm connected to the main router less than 2 metres between the router and laptop with no obstructions the speed is less than 6meg and it is the case whether using the Plusnet hub one or the BT Smart Hub 6. The same is true if I'm connected to one of the access points which is connected to the main router via CAT 6.
The second issue, is that the internet drops out regularly and this occurs on devices, whether they are connected via WiFi or wired. I know the dropouts occur on the wired devices because the light on the access point turns orange which indicates there is no internet. Also devices that are wired lose their internet connection randomly. When speaking to Plusnet about this, the problem does not appear on their logs, An engineer has been out and tested the line and found no problems. This is why I attached the logs for the access points because I would have thought they should show the dropouts that have occurred.
The speed tests I have run are varied but all use the same device (a laptop). They are as follows:
When testing directly through the master socket via a cable the download speed I get is 68meg, this was shown to me by the BT engineer and repeated on my own device.
When the router gets plugged in and the test is done via cable with no other devices linked to the router the download speed drops to 58meg.
The next test was to connect the device via a switch and the download speed again was 58meg
I removed the switch and then linked access point 1 via CAT 6 and run a test again via cable and the speed is also 58meg, disconnected access point 1 and repeated the test for access point 2 again no other devices connected and the speed is consistent 58meg.
I then connected all the wired devices to the router and ran the tests again via cable and the speeds came back as 58meg on all connection points. Based on the wired tests there is nothing wrong with my internal network.
I repeated the tests 3 or 4 times to ensure they weren't blips and the results were consistent.
The next set of tests involved repeating the tests for the router and access points but using the WiFi and always situated less than 2 metres from the router or access points with no obstruction. Same procedure, testing with no other devices attached. Prior to testing I used the WiFi analyser app on android to check the WiFi signal and optimised the channels each time I added WiFi access points. The WiFi Analyser showed nothing unusual with the signal. The speed I got when testing via WiFi was totally different the download speed was less than 6 meg and the upload speed was over 10meg The upload speed is the same as what I was getting when wired. I check the WiFi signal strength and it always rates as excellent.
Again the tests on the WiFi were repeated and they are consistently poor download speeds.
Before switching to Plusnet the above tests were done and the download speeds were always towards the top end around 50 - 60meg on both WiFi and Wired. There is nothing affecting the WiFi connection internally because that would have appeared on my WiFi Analyser. Based on my tests the problem is with Plusnet but I don't know what they are doing to affect the speed coming out of the WiFi.
As for the internet dropping out, there is no way for me to test this.
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There is absolutely zero I can think of that changing to Plusnet would suddenly cause issues on WiFi.
If wired speeds are fine (they are) and the line remains in sync (it does) that shouts out internal hardware to me.
The fact that you also experience this on the BT Homehub which worked with BT leaves me at a loss.
Changing ISP and using the same modem/router can't suddenly cause WiFi issues. This is not a Plusnet issue.
The connection completely dropping is another matter.
No idea if you can set up a BQM on either of those ISP devices.
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Have a few different wifi channels actually been tried?
There are plenty of things that can affect wifi but will not show on a wifi analyser app. Personally I think most wifi apps are largely worthless and may well be worse than simply trying out different channels. Most wifi analyser apps just show the signal strength from each AP and what channel they are on. They don't show how heavily used each network is, a channel with one busy network will be a lot busier than a channel with several mostly idle networks. They don't show the strength of the signals from any of the devices connected to the network, just the access point. They don't show non-wifi signals / interference on the frequencies. Some people might then argue that a wifi analyser app is still better than nothing, but even that is questionable. An automatic channel selection system on an access point should have more data available to it than what a wifi analyser app has.
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EJS beat me to it.
When testing directly through the master socket via a cable the download speed I get is 68meg, this was shown to me by the BT engineer and repeated on my own device.
When the router gets plugged in and the test is done via cable with no other devices linked to the router the download speed drops to 58meg.
I'm rather confused by the above two statements, to test direct through the master socket surely you're using your router? The engineer would of used his own equipment, which you wouldn't have been able to plug into. So statement two surely using the same equipment as statement 1, but something must be different to get the different results.
In statement two are you still using the test socket? This means removing the front of the master socket and using the socket behind? When you remove the front of the master socket it should isolate all other sockets in the house, they should no longer work - if they do this will be affecting things. Hopefully the engineer would of checked this.
Prior to testing I used the WiFi analyser app on android to check the WiFi signal and optimised the channels each time I added WiFi access points. The WiFi Analyser showed nothing unusual with the signal. The speed I got when testing via WiFi was totally different the download speed was less than 6 meg and the upload speed was over 10meg The upload speed is the same as what I was getting when wired. I check the WiFi signal strength and it always rates as excellent.
......
There is nothing affecting the WiFi connection internally because that would have appeared on my WiFi Analyser. Based on my tests the problem is with Plusnet but I don't know what they are doing to affect the speed coming out of the WiFi.
Unfortunately a wi-fi analyser app on Android is not going to show things that could be affecting your wi-fi, you need dedicated hardware to show that. For instance get the app on your phone, go and microwave something and see if it shows on the app. What you need is something like the Wi-Spy (very expensive) which will actually display the signal from things like microwaves, baby monitors, remote control transmitters etc. These could all be affecting you're wi-fi, especially 2.4Ghz. Are you using 2.4Ghz or 5Ghz?
Watch this video, especially from 6:28 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tr0AfBO1O20
One thing I'm certain of is Plusnet are not slowing your broadband just when you use wi-fi.
As for the internet dropping out, there is no way for me to test this.
Well there is, but you'd need a modem that allows you to collect stats.
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The only reason I can think for the wi-fi being so slow is that it is set to the wrong protocol - you haven't accidentally managed to set it to 802.11b as that would run at about 10Mbps maximum?
:)
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One of the easiest ways to solve wifi problems is to separate the 2.4 and 5G (I suffix the network name with the frequency). I put all the stuff I don't want cluttering 5G on 2.4 (kids things, Alexa's, cameras). The things I want to run faster won't know about the 2.4Ghz networks and won't fail over to them when the signal is poor and visa versa for the things allocated to 2.4Ghz. I have essentially the same as you with two access points at either end of the house, so there's always a 5Ghz and 2.4Ghz available. Laptops and mine and the boss' phones get 5Ghz and most everything else gets 2.4Ghz. Everything in a fixed position with an ethernet port gets a wired connection (although senior management will kill me if I put another hole in the ceiling, so I'm going to have to get creative with the infrastructure cabling).
With 4 networks being available you can deal with any internal congestion easily e.g. changing channels or promoting a device to the 5Ghz network (although I've not needed to). The only problem is when you still have a 5Ghz connection to the other end of the house - but that's fairly rare as the internal walls are brick and flicking wifi off an on sorts this. If you are dual banding the APs (like most come out of the box), you have no idea what's going on without logging in to them and checking.
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My 2 pence worth:
SMART WI-FI
I can confirm that SMART WI-FI (auto channel swap) is poor in my experience, every time I've tested such a feature across various routers on various connections (not just my own - which I've tested many routers on) it seems to always pick one that doesn't appear optimal? (i.e. switching to an active channel when there are clear channels on 1, 6 or 11 on the 2.4Ghz spectrum). I know someone has already mentioned that the router/hub may have more information when choosing a channel, but the only thing I can think of is RF Spectrum Analysis and I may be wrong but aren't these types of devices expensive? and therefore unlikely to be installed in a cheap ISP router?
PLUSNET HUB ONE
I will also add (even though its probably irrelevant at this point) that the Plusnet Hub One is absolutely DIRE in my honest opinion, I had 2 from Plusnet as the first would drop its throughput from 36Mb to 15-25Mb every 4-5 days and only a reboot would fix it, the 2nd Plusnet Hub One done the exact same.. I resolved this by using my own.
THROTTLING
Your 100% not being "throttled" by your ISP, there is no way for an ISP to manipulate what goes on in your internal network, also what gain is there for Plusnet to pump 65Mb down to the router and then to throttle it and cause you issues at your end? it just doesn't make sense and can not and does not happen.
NTE5C+Mk4 SSFP
There are loads of bad reviews about these, I myself just 3 days ago tested various SSFP's/setups including the one you have even after hearing this as I wanted to find out for myself, I had loss of speed (2MB) and errors went up 10 fold (and strange readings from DSL-stats), you would have been better leaving the NTE5A and Mk2 SSFP in to be honest, its looks nice, but is cheaply made (no circuit boards, just metal strips) in comparison to the older one
CONCLUSION
After reading your thread I have to say that it sounds like its an internal configuration issue or the device(s) your testing have issues. You mention having switches and routers etc, maybe if you could supply more information about your setup and the devices connecting to it?
What routers/switches do you have?
How are they connected?
How are they configured?
Same again for devices.
- sometimes a mockup drawing in paint or a photo can help.
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SMART WI-FI
I can confirm that SMART WI-FI (auto channel swap) is poor in my experience, every time I've tested such a feature across various routers on various connections (not just my own - which I've tested many routers on) it seems to always pick one that doesn't appear optimal? (i.e. switching to an active channel when there are clear channels on 1, 6 or 11 on the 2.4Ghz spectrum). I know someone has already mentioned that the router/hub may have more information when choosing a channel, but the only thing I can think of is RF Spectrum Analysis and I may be wrong but aren't these types of devices expensive? and therefore unlikely to be installed in a cheap ISP router?
The automatic channel selection will probably be software provided by the wifi chip manufacturer, which will have low level access to the wifi hardware. This will be able to measure the amount of signal and the amount of noise on each channel, and measure the amount of data traffic rather than merely count the number of wireless networks. There's nothing wrong with being on the same channel as another network anyway. You claim some channel with no networks on is the optimal one, but how could you possibly know it is? Maybe all the routers are avoiding it for good reason, if they can see a lot of non-wifi noise which you won't see on a wifi analyser app.
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The automatic channel selection will probably be software provided by the wifi chip manufacturer, which will have low level access to the wifi hardware. This will be able to measure the amount of signal and the amount of noise on each channel, and measure the amount of data traffic rather than merely count the number of wireless networks. There's nothing wrong with being on the same channel as another network anyway. You claim some channel with no networks on is the optimal one, but how could you possibly know it is? Maybe all the routers are avoiding it for good reason, if they can see a lot of non-wifi noise which you won't see on a wifi analyser app.
Actually, now I think on I remember when I set up my new Zyxel 8924 the wi-fi page had a channel scan feature, the screen below in my router seems to confirm what you say about Low-Level 'Channel Noise' detection...
(https://i.imgur.com/0K5L3m1.jpg)
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Actually, now I think on I remember when I set up my new Zyxel 8924 the wi-fi page had a channel scan feature, . . .
All the ZyXEL VMGnnnn CPEs have that feature. :)
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NTE5C+Mk4 SSFP
There are loads of bad reviews about these, I myself just 3 days ago tested various SSFP's/setups including the one you have even after hearing this as I wanted to find out for myself, I had loss of speed (2MB) and errors went up 10 fold (and strange readings from DSL-stats), you would have been better leaving the NTE5A and Mk2 SSFP in to be honest, its looks nice, but is cheaply made (no circuit boards, just metal strips) in comparison to the older one
A bit off-topic, but are the NTE5C & Master Socket 5C the same thing?
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@Vultura, welcome to the forums. Yes, the NTE5 is the master socket, and there are multiple versions of it with the NTE5C being the latest I believe.
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@Vultura, welcome to the forums. Yes, the NTE5 is the master socket, and there are multiple versions of it with the NTE5C being the latest I believe.
Thanks for reply and the welcome, from such a well-known name too, I feel honoured.
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A lot of posts to respond to so I will do my best to respond in full. I've attached a picture of my network map with the name of the devices.
There is absolutely zero I can think of that changing to Plusnet would suddenly cause issues on WiFi.
If wired speeds are fine (they are) and the line remains in sync (it does) that shouts out internal hardware to me.
The fact that you also experience this on the BT Homehub which worked with BT leaves me at a loss.
Changing ISP and using the same modem/router can't suddenly cause WiFi issues. This is not a Plusnet issue.
The connection completely dropping is another matter.
No idea if you can set up a BQM on either of those ISP devices.
The issues started when I switched to Plusnet, nothing else has changed and there were no problems before switching ISP's. That leaves me to the conclusion that the problem is ISP related no idea how but its the only logical conclusion to draw.
What's a BQM?
Have a few different wifi channels actually been tried?
There are plenty of things that can affect wifi but will not show on a wifi analyser app. Personally I think most wifi apps are largely worthless and may well be worse than simply trying out different channels. Most wifi analyser apps just show the signal strength from each AP and what channel they are on. They don't show how heavily used each network is, a channel with one busy network will be a lot busier than a channel with several mostly idle networks. They don't show the strength of the signals from any of the devices connected to the network, just the access point. They don't show non-wifi signals / interference on the frequencies. Some people might then argue that a wifi analyser app is still better than nothing, but even that is questionable. An automatic channel selection system on an access point should have more data available to it than what a wifi analyser app has.
Noted but what else is there to use if the router doesn't have an analysis tool.
EJS beat me to it.
I'm rather confused by the above two statements, to test direct through the master socket surely you're using your router? The engineer would of used his own equipment, which you wouldn't have been able to plug into. So statement two surely using the same equipment as statement 1, but something must be different to get the different results.
In statement two are you still using the test socket? This means removing the front of the master socket and using the socket behind? When you remove the front of the master socket it should isolate all other sockets in the house, they should no longer work - if they do this will be affecting things. Hopefully the engineer would of checked this.
Unfortunately a wi-fi analyser app on Android is not going to show things that could be affecting your wi-fi, you need dedicated hardware to show that. For instance get the app on your phone, go and microwave something and see if it shows on the app. What you need is something like the Wi-Spy (very expensive) which will actually display the signal from things like microwaves, baby monitors, remote control transmitters etc. These could all be affecting you're wi-fi, especially 2.4Ghz. Are you using 2.4Ghz or 5Ghz?
Watch this video, especially from 6:28 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tr0AfBO1O20
One thing I'm certain of is Plusnet are not slowing your broadband just when you use wi-fi.
Well there is, but you'd need a modem that allows you to collect stats.
The engineer plugged the cable into my laptop and showed me the reading from the master socket without the router which gave 68meg. When the router was plugged in the speed dropped to 58 meg. I don't know why there would be a difference between the speed coming out of the master socket and the speed being output by the router.
According to the Engineer using the test socket is largely unnecessary if you have a VDSL faceplate fitted which I do. In any case the engineer did all his tests and is pretty certain there are no issues with the master socket at least nothing his equipment could detect.
I will have a look at the video, however, I don't understand how one day there were no issues with the WiFi and when I switched ISP's suddenly there were, with no change to equipment or devices. Also any interference on the WiFi would impact the signal quality as well as the internet and the speeds between the devices on the network but speeds between the devices is fine.
Can I collect stats on the BT Smart Hub 6 and if so what filters do I need to set.
The only reason I can think for the wi-fi being so slow is that it is set to the wrong protocol - you haven't accidentally managed to set it to 802.11b as that would run at about 10Mbps maximum?
:)
No change to the protocol settings they are all the same as what they were. Double checked this in case I did do something by accident.
One of the easiest ways to solve wifi problems is to separate the 2.4 and 5G (I suffix the network name with the frequency). I put all the stuff I don't want cluttering 5G on 2.4 (kids things, Alexa's, cameras). The things I want to run faster won't know about the 2.4Ghz networks and won't fail over to them when the signal is poor and visa versa for the things allocated to 2.4Ghz. I have essentially the same as you with two access points at either end of the house, so there's always a 5Ghz and 2.4Ghz available. Laptops and mine and the boss' phones get 5Ghz and most everything else gets 2.4Ghz. Everything in a fixed position with an ethernet port gets a wired connection (although senior management will kill me if I put another hole in the ceiling, so I'm going to have to get creative with the infrastructure cabling).
With 4 networks being available you can deal with any internal congestion easily e.g. changing channels or promoting a device to the 5Ghz network (although I've not needed to). The only problem is when you still have a 5Ghz connection to the other end of the house - but that's fairly rare as the internal walls are brick and flicking wifi off an on sorts this. If you are dual banding the APs (like most come out of the box), you have no idea what's going on without logging in to them and checking.
WiFi bands are already split and always have been.
My 2 pence worth:
SMART WI-FI
I can confirm that SMART WI-FI (auto channel swap) is poor in my experience, every time I've tested such a feature across various routers on various connections (not just my own - which I've tested many routers on) it seems to always pick one that doesn't appear optimal? (i.e. switching to an active channel when there are clear channels on 1, 6 or 11 on the 2.4Ghz spectrum). I know someone has already mentioned that the router/hub may have more information when choosing a channel, but the only thing I can think of is RF Spectrum Analysis and I may be wrong but aren't these types of devices expensive? and therefore unlikely to be installed in a cheap ISP router?
PLUSNET HUB ONE
I will also add (even though its probably irrelevant at this point) that the Plusnet Hub One is absolutely DIRE in my honest opinion, I had 2 from Plusnet as the first would drop its throughput from 36Mb to 15-25Mb every 4-5 days and only a reboot would fix it, the 2nd Plusnet Hub One done the exact same.. I resolved this by using my own.
THROTTLING
Your 100% not being "throttled" by your ISP, there is no way for an ISP to manipulate what goes on in your internal network, also what gain is there for Plusnet to pump 65Mb down to the router and then to throttle it and cause you issues at your end? it just doesn't make sense and can not and does not happen.
NTE5C+Mk4 SSFP
There are loads of bad reviews about these, I myself just 3 days ago tested various SSFP's/setups including the one you have even after hearing this as I wanted to find out for myself, I had loss of speed (2MB) and errors went up 10 fold (and strange readings from DSL-stats), you would have been better leaving the NTE5A and Mk2 SSFP in to be honest, its looks nice, but is cheaply made (no circuit boards, just metal strips) in comparison to the older one
CONCLUSION
After reading your thread I have to say that it sounds like its an internal configuration issue or the device(s) your testing have issues. You mention having switches and routers etc, maybe if you could supply more information about your setup and the devices connecting to it?
What routers/switches do you have?
How are they connected?
How are they configured?
Same again for devices.
- sometimes a mockup drawing in paint or a photo can help.
I don't use the smart WiFi because it was poor originally.
Switched the modem to the Smart Hub 6.
That's the only conclusion I can draw - When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth. The only reason I can think is because of heavy usage.
I hope I have covered everything here.
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Have you tried using something like iperf to measure speed across wireless devices on your internal network? This would clarify if the wireless is being affected by something or not?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iperf
BQM = https://www.thinkbroadband.com/broadband/monitoring/quality
If Plusnet were throttling your connection they would also be throttling others and the forums would be awash with people complaining, and I highly doubt they would be able to just throttle your WiFi data.
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The engineer plugged the cable into my laptop and showed me the reading from the master socket without the router which gave 68meg. When the router was plugged in the speed dropped to 58 meg. I don't know why there would be a difference between the speed coming out of the master socket and the speed being output by the router.
The engineer showed you the sync speed.
Can I assume the 58Mb is a speed test?
I wouldn't expect a speed test to have as high a number as the sync speed as there are overheads.
Your BT Hub showed
Data rate:
14.39 Mbps / 63.27 Mbps
You are connecting at 63Mb.
The reason the engineer may have got 68Mb is likely his tester uses a different DSL chipset to your modems.
Most modems sync at different levels.
The issues started when I switched to Plusnet, nothing else has changed and there were no problems before switching ISP's. That leaves me to the conclusion that the problem is ISP related no idea how but its the only logical conclusion to draw.
That conclusion would be incorrect though. It isn't possible.
Plusnet do not even know that you are using WiFi or wired. It is 100% impossible for them to throttle your WiFi speeds.
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Have you tried switching off your access points and running the wireless tests connected to the Hub6 (or PlusNet hub). I ask just to make sure there are no conflicts going on between the various pieces of equipment - not that I can think why there would be if you've not changed any of the setup.
This really is a very unusual problem and I think we're all struggling to get our heads around what is causing it.
:)
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Have you tried switching off your access points and running the wireless tests connected to the Hub6 (or PlusNet hub). I ask just to make sure there are no conflicts going on between the various pieces of equipment - not that I can think why there would be if you've not changed any of the setup.
This really is a very unusual problem and I think we're all struggling to get our heads around what is causing it.
:)
Yeah I'v tried that, didn't make any difference. I'm glad you guys are as confused as I am, I feel considerably less stupid if the pros on this board find it difficult to diagnose.
The engineer showed you the sync speed.
Can I assume the 58Mb is a speed test?
I wouldn't expect a speed test to have as high a number as the sync speed as there are overheads.
Your BT Hub showed
You are connecting at 63Mb.
The reason the engineer may have got 68Mb is likely his tester uses a different DSL chipset to your modems.
Most modems sync at different levels.
That conclusion would be incorrect though. It isn't possible.
Plusnet do not even know that you are using WiFi or wired. It is 100% impossible for them to throttle your WiFi speeds.
My only thought is that somehow Plusnet can see that my laptop has heavy usage and throttles based on the MAC address of the WiFi card in my laptop, which according to the Engineer can be done but would be very naughty of them.
Have you tried using something like iperf to measure speed across wireless devices on your internal network? This would clarify if the wireless is being affected by something or not?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iperf
BQM = https://www.thinkbroadband.com/broadband/monitoring/quality
If Plusnet were throttling your connection they would also be throttling others and the forums would be awash with people complaining, and I highly doubt they would be able to just throttle your WiFi data.
I was thinking of using iPerf to test the speeds but didn't think it would show me anything I don't already know from Speedtest.net which is the site I've been using. I will need to spend some time getting my head around using iPerf because I've never used it.
I will give the BQM a go and see what it throws out. Do I need to keep it running all night or something.
Depends if they have made the throttling algorithm more sophisticated, so it only throttles heavy usage. I don't know.
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My only thought is that somehow Plusnet can see that my laptop has heavy usage and throttles based on the MAC address of the WiFi card in my laptop, which according to the Engineer can be done but would be very naughty of them.
This engineers comment is incorrect and leading you on to incorrect assumptions and conclusions, what he talks about amounts to no less than 'hacking' and I don't think any ISP has a 'hacking' department that throttles on the 'other side' of the customers hub/router (internal network) and I work for sky in the broadband tech team, they would simply throttle the connection TO the hub, I know it's hard to swallow when you don't know much about how it all works, you just have to trust us with years of experience that it is not the case.
I agree with what has already been said about turning on each device one at a time working up/away from the hub, test the hub on its own, then connect one access point, test the speed to that, connect the next AP and test the speed to that etc etc etc... I would also be looking at the testing devices, use only one, one that gets full (or reasonable) speed to the hub over wifi, then you know you have a working test device, any other device that reports a slow speed on the same network is faulty or incorrectly configured (this is in reference to single device usage for testing, not in general multi-use scenariosl) .
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My only thought is that somehow Plusnet can see that my laptop has heavy usage and throttles based on the MAC address of the WiFi card in my laptop, which according to the Engineer can be done but would be very naughty of them.
The engineer is wrong. That's not how it works.
The MAC address is only used on your local network.
Your router assigns your device an internal IP and uses NAT to direct traffic to the device.
I cannot stress this enough, Plusnet do not and cannot throttle WiFi devices.
If you have an issue that only effects wireless devices it must be something on your side of the network.
The ISP do not know, or care, what device is using the connection.
They absolutely cannot tell the difference between you using your PC wired or wireless.
The fact this happened as soon as you switched to Plusnet is either
1. a coincidence
2. the hardware they provided.
3. something you changed.
4. any other reason someone else can think of that isn't Plusnet throttling wireless devices.
I will give the BQM a go and see what it throws out. Do I need to keep it running all night or something.
It runs on ThinkBroadbands end, they simply ping your router.
Your router needs to be able to respond to ICMP pings and I have no idea if either of your 2 devices can do this.
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There is one thing that can cause this behaviour, potentially. Not sure if it's been mentioned.
Have you ever had to manually specify the interface speeds on your access points? 10FULL? 100FULL?
If, for whatever reason, they are negotiating half-duplex or 10base then that would probably cause all these issues, including putting the original equipment back in place.
The only other explanation is significant airwave interference that coincided with you switching ISP. Did next door get a new access point at the same time? Does it sit on the other side of the wall (or above/below) from where ever your kit is, perhaps?
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The engineer is wrong. That's not how it works.
The MAC address is only used on your local network.
Your router assigns your device an internal IP and uses NAT to direct traffic to the device.
I cannot stress this enough, Plusnet do not and cannot throttle WiFi devices.
If you have an issue that only effects wireless devices it must be something on your side of the network.
The ISP do not know, or care, what device is using the connection.
They absolutely cannot tell the difference between you using your PC wired or wireless.
The fact this happened as soon as you switched to Plusnet is either
1. a coincidence
2. the hardware they provided.
3. something you changed.
4. any other reason someone else can think of that isn't Plusnet throttling wireless devices.
It runs on ThinkBroadbands end, they simply ping your router.
Your router needs to be able to respond to ICMP pings and I have no idea if either of your 2 devices can do this.
Like I said, I have run out of options as to what it could be. Nothing has changed on the network other than the Plusnet Hub which I changed back to the Smart Hub 6, none of the settings were changed and anything default was set back to the settings that originally worked. If it was a device on my network then the problem would only occur when connecting to the faulty device not every device. I know my Laptop isn't faulty given that none of the recent updates affected the wireless drivers and the wireless connection works fine apart from the Internet speed.
I have literally tested my network in every way I have been able to when I added anything to it to ensure everything worked which it did prior to switching to Plusnet and repeated the tests when switching over to Plusnet.
This engineers comment is incorrect and leading you on to incorrect assumptions and conclusions, what he talks about amounts to no less than 'hacking' and I don't think any ISP has a 'hacking' department that throttles on the 'other side' of the customers hub/router (internal network) and I work for sky in the broadband tech team, they would simply throttle the connection TO the hub, I know it's hard to swallow when you don't know much about how it all works, you just have to trust us with years of experience that it is not the case.
I agree with what has already been said about turning on each device one at a time working up/away from the hub, test the hub on its own, then connect one access point, test the speed to that, connect the next AP and test the speed to that etc etc etc... I would also be looking at the testing devices, use only one, one that gets full speed to the hub over wifi, then you know you have a working test device, any other device that reports a slow speed on the same network is faulty or incorrectly configured (this is in reference to single device usage for testing, not in general multi-use scenariosl) .
I'm not doubting what anyone is saying about throttling, like I said I thought it was a thing of the past but every response about something else causing the problem is something I have eliminated from the equation through a test of some sort or the fact that it was working before the switch over to Plusnet and nothing has changed to suddenly cause a fault.
I have done the test one device at a time and the results are the same. In terms of faults on the test device itself as I say nothing has changed to cause such a fault on the laptop. I have checked the configurations etc and there has been no change to the drivers etc which could cause a problem.
Furthermore the wireless issue is one problem, it doesn't account for the fact the internet drops out despite still being connected to the access points or router through the WiFi and through cable.
There is one thing that can cause this behaviour, potentially. Not sure if it's been mentioned.
Have you ever had to manually specify the interface speeds on your access points? 10FULL? 100FULL?
If, for whatever reason, they are negotiating half-duplex or 10base then that would probably cause all these issues, including putting the original equipment back in place.
The only other explanation is significant airwave interference that coincided with you switching ISP. Did next door get a new access point at the same time? Does it sit on the other side of the wall (or above/below) from where ever your kit is, perhaps?
No, it hasn't been mentioned. I haven't ever had to specify anything like that and there isn't anything on the access points or the router that have that setting from what I can remember.
Nothing has been done by the neighbors that coincided with the ISP switch and if that was the case, the results would be different on the router and the two access points because they are in different locations but the results are the same across all 3. Also any interference like that wouldn't cause such a huge drop would it.
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Is there any network configuration explicitly set on any of the devices, like manually setting the DNS server addresses, that might somehow have been appropriate for your previous ISP but is no longer appropriate on Plusnet?
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I would be putting the old NTE5A and Filter back in place (regardless if it was fine before), because those NTE5C master sockets are known to have issues, I myself have seen this, it is well documented that they are poorly designed and have had negative effects on end users connections, on mine the speed dropped 2Mbit, errors went up 10x and the 'upstream' had erratic SNRM behaviour, elevated 'Bit-Swapping' activity reflected this too. Soon as I put my old NTE5A back the problem went away.
Are you using the Plusnet Hub One as the modem or the BT router? If you are using the Plusnet Hub One (Lantiq chipset) then I would swap it as it is poor, I have already mentioned the reasons why I think that (speed dips by 50%+ every few days and only a reboot resolved it, two PH1 done this.) The preferred units of choice by most 'broadband techies' are ones that have Broadcom chipsets, This is for 2 main reasons:
1) the majority of them come with an unlocked modem that allows xDSL monitoring software to be run on them: this helps massively for detecting problems with your broadband connection and can assist as evidence to ISPs/BTo if needed to resolve an issue, I have had such an opportunity too and if I didn't have the evidence it is almost likely that the problem would not have been resolved as the ISP was pushing to leave it.
2) they are excellent for long, noisy and/or poor quality telephone lines: these modems tend to be great at preventing constant dropouts because of noise levels, they also tend to give out favourable sync speeds (for that lines characteristics).
I know none of the above helps much in your situation as your hub is getting 65Mbit, it is your internal setup configuration that is the problem, possibly the settings or how its setup? I'm not 100% sure, but it may help with the dropouts your experiencing.
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I was thinking of using iPerf to test the speeds but didn't think it would show me anything I don't already know from Speedtest.net which is the site I've been using. I will need to spend some time getting my head around using iPerf because I've never used it.
I think maybe your testing is flawed as you don't think testing internal wireless speeds will show you anything different from a speed test to an external site. What it will show is how well your internal network can shift data, whether it's up to the job or not.
I thought I had used Iperf before, but just checked and it turns out it was Lan Speed Test Sever https://totusoft.com/lanspeedserver
Install the server on one device and run speed tests across your network, thus revealing how fast your internal network is, both wired and wireless.
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I suppose I should give up asking if different wireless channels have been tried.
I can think of a couple of different things that would affect wireless throughput but wouldn't necessarily affect the displayed wireless signal quality. Other wireless traffic wouldn't be classed as noise, so wouldn't reduce the signal quality, so wireless congestion could give slow speeds while showing a good signal. The other would be what legacy protection mechanisms have been enabled. Again, it wouldn't show in the signal strength/quality, because it's nothing to do with that. It doesn't matter that you might not have any legacy 11g / 11b devices in your network, the protection is to protect anything on the same channel.
If you really want to investigate what's going on with the wireless, you need to capture the wireless traffic in monitor mode. This would be easy to do on a Linux computer, but less convenient on Windows (there were a couple of different programs that could do it, but both of those are now old and either unavailable or might not work on the current version of Windows - in one case the feature was removed from later versions of the free edition, due to it being too good).
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I suppose I should give up asking if different wireless channels have been tried.
I can think of a couple of different things that would affect wireless throughput but wouldn't necessarily affect the displayed wireless signal quality. Other wireless traffic wouldn't be classed as noise, so wouldn't reduce the signal quality, so wireless congestion could give slow speeds while showing a good signal. The other would be what legacy protection mechanisms have been enabled. Again, it wouldn't show in the signal strength/quality, because it's nothing to do with that. It doesn't matter that you might not have any legacy 11g / 11b devices in your network, the protection is to protect anything on the same channel.
If you really want to investigate what's going on with the wireless, you need to capture the wireless traffic in monitor mode. This would be easy to do on a Linux computer, but less convenient on Windows (there were a couple of different programs that could do it, but both of those are now old and either unavailable or might not work on the current version of Windows - in one case the feature was removed from later versions of the free edition, due to it being too good).
Yes please because I've said it a few times I've tried different channels and get the same outcome.
Whenever I'm testing I make sure to disconnect all other wireless devices so congestion shouldn't really be an issue.
Legacy protection, I'm not sure what this is, I assume it is set to default on my laptop.
How would I capture the wireless traffic without a linux machine, is there an app for android?
I think maybe your testing is flawed as you don't think testing internal wireless speeds will show you anything different from a speed test to an external site. What it will show is how well your internal network can shift data, whether it's up to the job or not.
I thought I had used Iperf before, but just checked and it turns out it was Lan Speed Test Sever https://totusoft.com/lanspeedserver
Install the server on one device and run speed tests across your network, thus revealing how fast your internal network is, both wired and wireless.
Flaw in my testing - potentially yes because I haven't used a proper testing programme to test the internal network just sent a couple of files of varying size between my laptop and another laptop and it seemed to work fine and well within reasonable transfer speeds.
I'll have a look at Lan speed test and report back.
I would be putting the old NTE5A and Filter back in place (regardless if it was fine before), because those NTE5C master sockets are known to have issues, I myself have seen this, it is well documented that they are poorly designed and have had negative effects on end users connections, on mine the speed dropped 2Mbit, errors went up 10x and the 'upstream' had erratic SNRM behaviour, elevated 'Bit-Swapping' activity reflected this too. Soon as I put my old NTE5A back the problem went away.
Are you using the Plusnet Hub One as the modem or the BT router? If you are using the Plusnet Hub One (Lantiq chipset) then I would swap it as it is poor, I have already mentioned the reasons why I think that (speed dips by 50%+ every few days and only a reboot resolved it, two PH1 done this.) The preferred units of choice by most 'broadband techies' are ones that have Broadcom chipsets, This is for 2 main reasons:
1) the majority of them come with an unlocked modem that allows xDSL monitoring software to be run on them: this helps massively for detecting problems with your broadband connection and can assist as evidence to ISPs/BTo if needed to resolve an issue, I have had such an opportunity too and if I didn't have the evidence it is almost likely that the problem would not have been resolved as the ISP was pushing to leave it.
2) they are excellent for long, noisy and/or poor quality telephone lines: these modems tend to be great at preventing constant dropouts because of noise levels, they also tend to give out favourable sync speeds (for that lines characteristics).
I know none of the above helps much in your situation as your hub is getting 65Mbit, it is your internal setup configuration that is the problem, possibly the settings or how its setup? I'm not 100% sure, but it may help with the dropouts your experiencing.
I didn't change the master socket the engineer did and according to him the one he installed was the newest version which didn't have the niggles. The problems were present on the old master socket with the filter in any case.
Switched out the Plusnet Hub One for the BT Smart Hub 6.
When I originally posted I did ask whether the BT Openreach HG612 would make any difference to the problems I'm experiencing because I was thinking of purchasing one on ebay.
One of the reasons I posted on this site was to try and get as much evidence as possible to establish my network isn't at fault, so Plusnet don't keep fobbing me off which is what I feel like they are doing.
SO course of action for me to take to establish that my internal network isn't at fault - Test using LAN test and report the results back. Is there anything I should be looking out for?
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Yes please because I've said it a few times I've tried different channels and get the same outcome.
Well I haven't seen where.
Whenever I'm testing I make sure to disconnect all other wireless devices so congestion shouldn't really be an issue.
But you can't stop everyone else in the vicinity using their wireless.
Legacy protection, I'm not sure what this is, I assume it is set to default on my laptop.
It's lots of extra overhead that gets added to the wireless so that it can interoperate with older devices. If you have one 11n device wanting to talk to another 11n device, but there are 11g or older devices present, then they have to transmit extra signals that the older devices can understand first. I think it can be up to about 80% of the reported wifi bandwidth ends up being used for all the overheads. It's not really a setting that you can change, but it gets enabled automatically based on the what's operating in the environment.
How would I capture the wireless traffic without a linux machine, is there an app for android?
With difficulty. I don't know of any app, an app probably wouldn't have the necessary access to the hardware. I only use Linux.
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I decided to check the User Guide for a Linksys RE6500 (http://downloads.linksys.com/downloads/userguide/1224702174282/MAN_RE6500_LNKPG-00125_RevA01_EN.pdf). The copy I obtained is dated 2014 and is described as "LNKPG-00125 Rev. A01".
The first thing I noticed was the description: "Linksys AC1200 Max Wi-Fi Range Extender". All the way through that guide the unit is described as a "Wi-Fi Range Extender" and not a "WiFi Access Point".
I might have downloaded an incorrect document but alarm bells have started to ring. :-\
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OK, now I'm confused too :D
Home Set-Up: Multiple devices wired to a Switch and 2 x Linksys RE6500 access points wired via CAT 6 to the router.
The ethernet ports appear to be edge ports? I'm guessing they're not actually meant to be used as uplinks because the only way to connect is via specifying an SSID as an uplink?
Can you confirm/deny this, K360?
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OK, now I'm confused too :D
So it is not just me in a kerfuddle? :-\
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Disconnect the cables from the extenders to the router and watch your problems disappear, along with whatever broadcast storm you created.
Thank b*cat profusely once done.
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. . . broadcast storm . . .
Ah, yes, broadcast storm. That is the exact phase I could not bring to mind, earlier. :-[
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If I was an isp I would never accept a low speed report that relied on wifi. Far too many variables that can affect performance. In my own setup 2.4ghz on "any" channel cannot consistently avoid bottlenecking my internet, 5ghz is required for that, but even then I would never rely on it as a means of diagnosing my internet connection.
Aside from the technical barriers involved in identifying your laptop as high usage and throttling it, there is also legal barriers in that an isp cannot sell an unlimited broadband service and then apply throttling.
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I think in this situation I would be going back to basics.
1. Turn off (at the mains) every device on the network.
2. Default either the PlusNet router or the Hub 6 and connect back to the line.
3. Run wired speed tests on one device only, ensuring that said device has any wireless capability switched off.
4. If that works ok then try the same device again in wireless mode.
5. Start connecting devices back one at a time and retest at each point.
As other have said, PlusNet neither know nor care if you are connecting wired or wireless, and will not (indeed cannot) be throttling wireless connections.
Something is causing conflicts on the network - there is just no other plausible explanation.
:)
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This thread implies it does support access point mode with the latest firmware at that time.
The recent RE6500 firmware 1.0.07.009 or newer supports access point mode. It needs to be reset to factory default settings after firmware upgrade is complete.
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While I was setting up a spare router as a WAP (https://forum.kitz.co.uk/index.php/topic,23093.0.html) I had a similar issue. The wireless speed from the router downstairs (20ft and several walls/floors) was about 40Mbps and from the WAP router I was sat next to about 6Mbps. As the WAP router had spare Ethernet ports I tried a wired test with similar results. In my case it was because I connected it to the switch which then connected to the downstairs router using LAN4 which had previously been configured as the WAN port. Using a different LAN port and/or turning off the WAN on LAN4 fixed it.
The point is all sorts of things can cause weird results and you have to step back and test things from basics. Do as tubaman has recommended starting with only a router and confirm the wired speed on that, then the wireless speed, then add components one at a time to find out what causes the issues. When you add a range extender first test the wireless speed you are now getting from the router, then test the speed you get from the extender wired then wireless.
Edit: If adding the second access point causes the issue, turn off the first to check if it is just that one or the combination of the two.
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I would also make sure the firmware on the Re6500's is up to date, once updated they are reset to default and any required settings re-entered. Access point mode may also have to be selected. Access point mode is mentioned as being added in the release notes of the firmware updates.
https://www.linksys.com/us/support-article?articleNum=148460
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I would go even more basic than that. The OP thinks Plusnet is throttling all wireless clients.
Disconnect the WAP completely.
Connect only the ISP supplied device.
Run a few wireless speed tests.
If the issue persists then it's possibly a signal problem of some kind.
If you get deceent speeds then start diagnosing the WAP.
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@ K360 - The engineer is clearly unaware of the problems with the NTE5C (mk1 or mk2) just spend some time researching it and you will see, there are plenty of BT engineers on this forum who also agree it is of rubbish quality and can have negative effects, it may not resolve your issues but it doesn't detract from the fact and is worth trying as it may stop your dropouts...I couldn't even imagine having an NTE5C and Plusnet Hub One on my line - DLM would be going crazy!!
It truly has nothing to do with Plusnet what is going on here, it is not the ISP's responsibility for what goes on beyond the NTE5, the speed to the hub IS 65MB, why would they (if they could) slow down your connection on the other side of the hub? your reasoning for 'Heavy Usage' does not make sense because the speed to the hub is still 65Mbit, when ISPs throttle connections it is done TO the hub... this is like saying the highway is so busy they closed the exiting slip road to ease congestion ... just doesn't make sense, do you not think it would be easier, cheaper and legal to throttle the HUB and make the cmr aware of what's happening? or to pay more for complex, expensive and illegal operations that throttle the device that's the 'cause' of the congestion? I know if I were an ISP which option I would choose.
When I switched from BE* (BE* SMPF) to Sky (Sky MPF) circa 2011, the engineer made a balls up at the exchange/PCP reducing my speed by =>half (split pair), at the time I was like you, convinced it was the ISP having me off...but after months of work and education I learned it was Openreach who was the cause of my fault, after 3 months, 20-30 phone calls lasting 60+ minutes each to Sky Network Services and 7 BTo visits I eventually got assigned a competent BTo engineer (no offence to the very competent engineers on here) who could find and rectify the issue that the first engineer caused. I bring this up as evidence that not ALL BT Openreach engineers are competent and therefore their advice should not be taken as 'gospel' (again, no offence to the obviously very competent engineers on here).
Read through the previous submissions since your last post, there have been some suggestions that your AP's are actually Wireless Repeaters and not AP's at all, is this the case?
I do hope you get sorted
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I haven't said this yet. So I'm going to say it now. Thank you for your responses and the time you have taken to respond. It is greatly appreciated because I'm learning a tremendous amount albeit the problems haven't gone but at least I can try other ways to ensure my internal network is bullet proof. If I have come across as a bit unpleasant I apologise as that is not my intention however it can come across that way after reading back through my posts.
To answer the question raised about the access points, as someone mentioned the latest firmware on the Linksys devices turn them into an access point and they are updated to the latest firmware. They have been in place since before the switch to plusnet and weren't causing any problems.
I have ensured that all devices were powered off and rebooted one at a time, although I didn't switch off the wireless.
I have signed up to the BQM and will perform the LAN tests across my network when I get the chance to and report the results here.
As for the master socket, I'm not competent to change this over to the old one and I don't have the old one to even try unfortunately. I will be speaking to Plusnet again and ask for another engineer to come out.
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I haven't said this yet. So I'm going to say it now. Thank you for your responses and the time you have taken to respond. It is greatly appreciated because I'm learning a tremendous amount albeit the problems haven't gone but at least I can try other ways to ensure my internal network is bullet proof. If I have come across as a bit unpleasant I apologise as that is not my intention however it can come across that way after reading back through my posts.
To answer the question raised about the access points, as someone mentioned the latest firmware on the Linksys devices turn them into an access point and they are updated to the latest firmware. They have been in place since before the switch to Plusnet and weren't causing any problems.
I have ensured that all devices were powered off and rebooted one at a time, although I didn't switch off the wireless.
I have signed up to the BQM and will perform the LAN tests across my network when I get the chance to and report the results here.
As for the master socket, I'm not competent to change this over to the old one and I don't have the old one to even try, unfortunately. I will be speaking to Plusnet again and ask for another engineer to come out.
You will be hard pushed to get an engineer to come out if Plusnet can't detect a fault, it's not impossible, but the staff member dealing with it will probably have to get an override from a manager to get an engineer sent out, if the manager is told there is no fault and the hub gets 65-Mbit then its very unlikely they will 'green-light' an appointed visit, situations similar to this are usually dependant on the resilience of the manager & customer, managers may cave in with threats to leave...but not always... if a fault is found internally by BTo they will inform the ISP who will in-turn forward the circa £130 £65 bill from BTo to yourself, whether its fixed or not.
Its really quite easy swapping NTE's, plenty of videos & guidance online and you can pick them up cheaply off ebay or other sites. The wires are coloured and the NTE's labelled, its literally 2 wires, A wire and B wire, write down which colour wire goes into A and B, then remove the NTE5C, pop in an NTE5A..A-to-A / B-to-B, the wires just push down into the IDC slot. Any extensions you may have around the home are fitted to terminals 2 and 5 on the front plate, bell wire (should be avoided if not needed) goes into terminal 3, it may or may not resolve your dropouts but it is worth a try, out of simple curiosity...it would have been interesting to know just what your 'Error Rate' (such as CRC, FEC, ES over time) was before and after an NTE5C install! I know its not going to fix your problem, but if you get the same symptoms as I did from the NTE5C then its possible that DLM could later at some point intervene and increase the SNRM and/or your error protection values (and thus lower your sync speed) to make it more stable (less errors), I'm not saying it will happen, but could.
[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5UxkSUaMVM8[/youtube]
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if a fault is found internally by BTo they will inform the ISP who will in-turn forward the circa £130 bill from BTo to yourself, whether its fixed or not.
Its really quite easy swapping NTE's, plenty of videos & guidance online and you can pick them up cheaply off ebay or other sites. The wires are coloured and the NTE's labelled, its literally 2 wires, A wire and B wire, write down which colour wire goes into A and B, then remove the NTE5C, pop in a NTE5A..A-to-A / B-to-B, the wires just push down into the IDC slot.
Plusnet pass on a charge of £65 should no fault be found or if the fault lies within your premises/equipment. In order to get an engineer visit arranged you have to agree to the possibility of being charged.
Of course you are talking about the theory of altering NTE's as they are the demarkation point between the Openreach network and your internal wiring, so should not altered by an unauthorised person.
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I can't see what an Openreach engineer is supposed to do about a wireless speed issue.
I would completely forget about the NTE5C not being everyone's favourite NTE.
I was thinking if there is any way that Plusnet's lack of IPv6 could somehow only affect wireless, but I cannot think of any way it would.
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I would completely forget about the NTE5C not being everyone's favourite NTE.
I only mention it because the OP reports regular disconnects and the NTE was changed to the 'iffy' 5C
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I gather all of the problems started before the NTE5C was installed.
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I know I am not authorised to change the master socket and won't. I saw the video posted a while back and had considered it until finding out it can only be done by an authorised person. The guy on the videos is really good, I actually bought a CAT 6 ADSL cable on ebay thanks to him lol I need to put a new RJ45 on it because the original one didn't seem to fit into the old faceplate bit of a tangent.
The connection dropouts were present pre 5C and they haven't changed in frequency since the 5C was installed. I am actually curious how much of a difference its made and would be interested in the numbers but sadly can't happen.
I have signed up for BQM and need to set ICMP ping on the BT modem. Hopefully I can run the LAN tests tomorrow and then post the results for analysis.
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Tried the BQM and I can't seem to enable an ICMP ping on the BT modem. That is fine. Need to work out how to use iPerf to test the LAN.
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The stats previously posted showed the DSL connection being up for over 5 days, so I suspect the dropouts are either on the PPP side or the internal network and not the connection to the DSLAM.
:)