Kitz Forum
Broadband Related => Broadband Hardware => Topic started by: loveextasy on May 23, 2017, 08:47:44 AM
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Hi all,
I have got a very annoying problem with my SBG3300 router....
It was fine a year ago, however after I used a Powerline adaptor to form a cabled network between up and down-stairs the problem happened and never ends (well, until now)
I realised the router reboot itself randomly after 1-2 days of the Powerline use, then I doubt it might be the issue so removed the Powerline, but not good, problem still there. Then I switched the ZyXEL power adaptor with another one that is the same spec but different brand, it seemed to improved a little bit - from 4 times' reboot to once per day (or might be less than once per day).
I then asked ZyXEL's customer support but they said they did not experience such problem before and asked for an RMA but the replace unit acting the same, slight improvement to 2-3 days per reboot, and I can live on with that.
However the last unit became faulty last month so I have to send it back to CS again for a replacement, and they give me a slightly different model: SBG3300-NB00 (Annex B) instead of the faulty's N000 (Annex A), then the problem become the worst, 1-2 reboots per day. I decided to buy an UPS trying to solve it.
Not really the solution though - Router still rebooting, but I noticed the Synology NAS which connected to UPS, reporting "Connection lost to UPS" and "Connected to UPS", only 1-5 seconds between these 2 status, and happened 3-4 times within a very short period of time (might be within 1 min).
By the way, even the NAS which connected to the same UPS is still running good (and that's why I can get the "UPS connections" logs/messages).
So, just wondering if anyone else has the same issue or can give any advice to it please? Also wondering if change the router to another brand and model would solve it (i.e. TP-Link VR600 or ASUS DSL-AC88)?
Thanks a lot in advance!
Regards,
Chong
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To update:
seems like it is the router's firmware problem..... contacted technical support of ZyXEL and they asked me to update the firmware to the latest 1.01 C6 and seems like the issue is gone - continuously running for more than a week now, so I believe it should be solved.
However did not understand that this issue kept happening to me for more than 1.5 years including the previous N000 and the replaced NB00 both if which were released more than 2 years ago but seems like the issue was just solved in 2017 (pretty sure the firmware release date is March or April 2017)....don't know if this issue was only discovered by me, or it is really hard to solve :(
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It looks as if it was a very specific problem and nobody here could think of anything to suggest for you to try. :(
I'm pleased to know that the problem does now appear to be solved. :fingers:
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It looks as if it was a very specific problem and nobody here could think of anything to suggest for you to try. :(
I'm pleased to know that the problem does now appear to be solved. :fingers:
Thanks for your post :)
Now the problem seems to be happening again. The reason I thought it was solved I think was because the WiFi did not work for some reason, and I failed to turn it back on without rebooting.
When I had to setup the wireless CCTV I had to reboot to actually allow the WiFi to be working, and after my reboot, it started to reboot itself randomly again, the 1st time I noticed was after 20 hours of my manual switch on and off....
So, I believe this would be because of WiFi or power adaptor issues?
Any ideas or past experience from any of you would be much appreciated.
Thanks a lot in advance!
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Now the problem seems to be happening again. The reason I thought it was solved I think was because the WiFi did not work for some reason, and I failed to turn it back on without rebooting.
I very much suspect you've got a problem with your mains electrical supply.
Please tell us which country/area you're in and what the standard AC mains voltage and frequency is.
Can you identify a pattern of regular times or gaps between events from the UPS/NAS logs you're capturing?
Do you live close to an industrial area where there may be large machines putting heavy load on your local sub-station (transformer) ?
Do you have any high-demand equipment switching on and off several times a day, e.g. air conditioning unit. If you're on a shared supply does one or more of your neighbours have such equipment operating when you experience problems?
Are your shared-supply neighbours also using network powerline equipment - that signal could be affecting your supply ?
Have you tried - as a test to rule in or out the mains electrical supply - operating the router from a 12 volt battery (e.g. a car battery) ?
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Surely the UPS should negate any power supply defects?
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Surely the UPS should negate any power supply defects?
It depends on which type of UPS is being used. Domestic ones are often of the 'Standby' type that only switch in the inverter when the power fails, so you are still running off of the raw mains.
:)
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I very much suspect you've got a problem with your mains electrical supply.
Please tell us which country/area you're in and what the standard AC mains voltage and frequency is.
Can you identify a pattern of regular times or gaps between events from the UPS/NAS logs you're capturing?
Do you live close to an industrial area where there may be large machines putting heavy load on your local sub-station (transformer) ?
Do you have any high-demand equipment switching on and off several times a day, e.g. air conditioning unit. If you're on a shared supply does one or more of your neighbours have such equipment operating when you experience problems?
Are your shared-supply neighbours also using network powerline equipment - that signal could be affecting your supply ?
Have you tried - as a test to rule in or out the mains electrical supply - operating the router from a 12 volt battery (e.g. a car battery) ?
Thanks for your reply :)
I am in the UK, Dartford area (Southeast to London, just outside M25), semi-suburban residential area.
The events are irregular, but only happen when the router restarts. It then reports 4 sets of repeated events (lost connection to UPS, restored connection to UPS), and interval will only be <5 seconds between any of them.
The closest industrial area is about 2 miles away crow-fly distance, but I'm not sure if we are sharing the local sub-station. But some of the evens are happening during the night, so I don't think it is the main reason.
I don't know whether the neighbours' are using powerline equipment :(
No, never tried on battery - and don't know if that can diagnose the problem - sometimes it can take up to 3 days for the next random rebooting to happen.
By the way, I am using a domestic APC Back-up ES550 UPS. I have had some power losses and the NAS hasn't lost power supply thanks to it, and during some of the mains power lost, the router managed to maintain power supply as well.
So it is really confusing, the only thing I can think of is the router's fault, but I have been replaced with ZyXEL for 3 units already, and all of them have the same issue...
Thanks again!
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Have you tried plugging the router directly into the mains to rule out any issues with the UPS?
:)
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Have you tried plugging the router directly into the mains to rule out any issues with the UPS?
:)
Yes - the UPS was bought to solve it, but apprently failed :(
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... but I noticed the Synology NAS which connected to UPS, reporting "Connection lost to UPS" and "Connected to UPS", only 1-5 seconds between these 2 status, and happened 3-4 times within a very short period of time (might be within 1 min).
These reports are presumably reporting the data-connection from the NAS to the UPS so are likely unrelated to the actual power outages. If they occur at the same time as power outages then the UPS is failing in some way.
I would strongly suspect the mains frequency is unstable (should be a nominal 50Hz +/- 1Hz). Some equipment (power supplies) can be very sensitive to such things.
The fact you've gone through three routers so far definitely points to some issue with your local wiring or incoming supply and a common design issue with the Zyxel power supplies.
If you have (or can borrow) a fully charged 12v car battery for a few days it would be well worth using it to try to prove the problem is on the power supply side rather than in the router itself.
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These reports are presumably reporting the data-connection from the NAS to the UPS so are likely unrelated to the actual power outages. If they occur at the same time as power outages then the UPS is failing in some way.
I would strongly suspect the mains frequency is unstable (should be a nominal 50Hz +/- 1Hz). Some equipment (power supplies) can be very sensitive to such things.
The fact you've gone through three routers so far definitely points to some issue with your local wiring or incoming supply and a common design issue with the Zyxel power supplies.
If you have (or can borrow) a fully charged 12v car battery for a few days it would be well worth using it to try to prove the problem is on the power supply side rather than in the router itself.
thanks for your advice :) and will try to borrow a car battery...
However as one of my above replies said, when the router is turning off WiFi (by itself for some reason), it run continuously for more than 60 days...until I found the Wifi is not working (I have another wireless router connected as WiFi extender) and restarted it, then the problem was back...
Do you have any ideas on this kind of issue?
Thanks
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However as one of my above replies said, when the router is turning off WiFi (by itself for some reason), it run continuously for more than 60 days
That infers power starvation; basically, under high demand the supply voltage drops below the critical threshold and causes the device to reboot (WiFi radio alters its power output depending on signal quality with connected clients - increasing power for clients with weak signals).
For that to be the reason it'd mean the nominal 12 volt DC supply from the power-supply adapter was not delivering sufficient current (amps).
But as you've gone through several routers and, I gather, associated power supplies, it is hard to accept them all spontaneously developing the same fault without some local mains power fault being the cause.
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That infers power starvation; basically, under high demand the supply voltage drops below the critical threshold and causes the device to reboot (WiFi radio alters its power output depending on signal quality with connected clients - increasing power for clients with weak signals).
For that to be the reason it'd mean the nominal 12 volt DC supply from the power-supply adapter was not delivering sufficient current (amps).
But as you've gone through several routers and, I gather, associated power supplies, it is hard to accept them all spontaneously developing the same fault without some local mains power fault being the cause.
Thanks for your reply.
The NAS is on the same UPS and previously same mains extension board with the router, and it sustained from power off/reboot when the router rebooted... also the rest of
Also used ECI fibre modem and Linksys EA6700 router while awaiting the replacement of current SBG3300, and it seems worked fine...
So really confusing, I would assume just the router's internal power supply is not compatible with my mains power :(
I have tried other brands' routers' power supplies as well (Huawei, Linksys etc) )and just a matter of how long between rebooting, i.e. 1 day for ZyXEL, 2-3 days for Huawei and Linksys. But it definitely rebooting...
Thanks again!
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I'm hesitant to put my oar in, but my memories of Dartford, having crossed many times from Essex to Kent and back, is a lot of power lines, also three railways routes running through, or maneuvering at frequent intervals; plenty of scope from the third rail power supply, signals and points motors.
All probably irrelevant!
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I have tried other brands' routers' power supplies as well (Huawei, Linksys etc) )and just a matter of how long between rebooting, i.e. 1 day for ZyXEL, 2-3 days for Huawei and Linksys. But it definitely rebooting...
One aspect we've not considered is 'the other end' of the router, in other words, what is connected to it?
- Are any devices connected to the Ethernet ports?
- Are any devices connected to the USB ports?
- Are any devices connected to the VoIP phone ports?
- Is the RJ11 phone line connection directly connected to an Openreach vDSL/ADSL Interstitial faceplate master socket (see illustration at http://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.php/2013/11/bt-openreach-set-uk-launch-date-self-install-fttc-superfast-broadband.html (http://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.php/2013/11/bt-openreach-set-uk-launch-date-self-install-fttc-superfast-broadband.html)) ?
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One aspect we've not considered is 'the other end' of the router, in other words, what is connected to it?
- Are any devices connected to the Ethernet ports?
- Are any devices connected to the USB ports?
- Are any devices connected to the VoIP phone ports?
- Is the RJ11 phone line connection directly connected to an Openreach vDSL/ADSL Interstitial faceplate master socket (see illustration at http://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.php/2013/11/bt-openreach-set-uk-launch-date-self-install-fttc-superfast-broadband.html (http://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.php/2013/11/bt-openreach-set-uk-launch-date-self-install-fttc-superfast-broadband.html)) ?
Yes, there are 2 devices connected to Etherports, one of them is the Synology NAS, and the other one is the extended router EA6700 as wireless AP upstairs.
No USB or VoIP connection.
The RJ11 is connected to the master socket without faceplate - in the "test socket" for more than a year. But before that it was connected to the master socket with faceplate with the same issue.
Cheers.
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I'm hesitant to put my oar in, but my memories of Dartford, having crossed many times from Essex to Kent and back, is a lot of power lines, also three railways routes running through, or maneuvering at frequent intervals; plenty of scope from the third rail power supply, signals and points motors.
All probably irrelevant!
Ok thanks for your opinion. In these cases I don't think I can do anything but switch to another brand of router :(
Cheers.
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The other possibility we've not asked about is over-heating. Is the device positioned where it cannot get sufficient ventilation? Maybe next to a radiator or other source of heat, or where sunlight falls directly on it for significant parts of the day, or it is in a restricted area or covered ?
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That's a good thought - with the wireless on it will be using more power and hence more prone to overheating.
You could try mounting it vertically which often improves the air flow.
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I remember a clients netgear modem/router (with a replacement PSU) would work fine untill connected to a long 20 metre LAN cable then the modem/router would just crash and shutdown.
Another replacement PSU sorted that issue.
Ian
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Could it be a cheap (faulty) laptop power supply causing the problem?
I've known iffy power supplies cause problems with other near by switch mode power supplies.
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Ok thanks for your opinion. In these cases I don't think I can do anything but switch to another brand of router :(
Cheers.
I hope you would not do anything on the basis of my opinion. My post was just saying how I saw Dartford just so our expert contributors could comment around that, if they thought fit.
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I remember a clients netgear modem/router (with a replacement PSU) would work fine untill connected to a long 20 metre LAN cable then the modem/router would just crash and shutdown.
That would suggest there was a difference in the ground reference voltages.
I had a similar experience with a Raspberry Pi 3 receiving Power over Ethernet (PoE) 802.3af via a TP Link TL-POE10R splitter. It worked fine headless but the moment I tried to connect it to a mains-powered monitor via HDMI it reset and rebooted. It turns out that the TLPOE10R output isn't isolated so the ground-reference voltage in it (relative to the mains ground) was actually at -48V rather than 0V.
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That's a good thought - with the wireless on it will be using more power and hence more prone to overheating.
You could try mounting it vertically which often improves the air flow.
Thanks both, that's one thing I haven't considered of, but it is in an isolated small room with the NAS, I will open the door trying to cool it down and see.
Cheers.
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I hope you would not do anything on the basis of my opinion. My post was just saying how I saw Dartford just so our expert contributors could comment around that, if they thought fit.
got you ;) Thanks.
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thanks for all your replies!
Now I reset it and kept almost all the default settings just changing the VDSL interface to connect, and now seems to be stable for more than 2 days already which is a positive sign.
by the way, I have opened the small rooms' door.
I will report back if anything happens or still stable :D
Thanks a lot!