Kitz Forum
Computers & Hardware => Networking => Topic started by: Weaver on January 16, 2017, 11:37:54 AM
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Since one of my greatly beloved ZyXel WAPs has decided to go _all weird_ on me following visible damage to one of the antenna, I've finally decided to buy a Cisco Aironet 1850 to replace it. Does anyone know anything about these devices? (Apologies if I've asked this question before.)
Another thing, does anyone know anything about getting hold of tech support from Cisco for these units? I wouldn't know where to start. Fell into website and drowned.
Unless I've misunderstood, I can't seem to see any MAC address filtering whitelist capability in the Cisco Mobility Express docs, although I've only had a very brief look at it. I must have got that wrong? Assuming for a moment that there is no MAC address whitelist, I suppose I would have to either live without it, one maintenance chore less, or else go to 802.1x.
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First of all make sure you specify the standalone version, part number for UK would be AIR-AP1852I-E-K9C. We've not used Mobility Express ourselves, only the IOS standalone APs or the "lightweight" APs in conjunction with a controller. Mobility Express is sort of half-way between with a less sophisticated controller function co-hosted on one AP. I can't see where you configure MAC address filtering either. On a controller it's under the WLAN properties.
Regarding Cisco support, this is via Cisco's services, either the Smartnet family where service delivery is direct from Cisco to end user, or via shared support services where a Cisco partner fronts the service. These services provide technical support, entitlement to software upgrades and hardware repair/replacement. Whoever you buy the AP from should be able to sell the support contract as well.
Informal support is available on the Cisco forums, open to any registered user with or without a support contract.
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I’ve just noticed that I’ve been conned by Amazon. I ordered a WAP from them listed as 1850. There is a long wait time for the item to come in, which I was happy enough about. Today I happened to look at the item listing again and noticed that it says 1830 in the body of the blurb and so too in the part code which is AIR-AP1832I-E-K9. So that's why it was a lot cheaper than I was expecting. It is probably an 1830 then.
What's the difference between an 1830 and an 1850 (apart from ~£100)? Do they both have the same higher-level software feature set?
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Access point comparison is here .. http://www.cisco.com/c/en/us/products/wireless/access-points/product-comparison.html
Quick skim through gives the differences in the radio - 3x3:2 MU/SU-MIMO vs 4x4:4 (SU-MIMO) 4x4:3 (MU-MIMO), one Gigabit Ethernet port instead of two. Part number should be AIR-AP1832I-E-K9C. The "C" on the end indicates the standalone Mobility Express variant rather than requiring external controller. There is a process to convert if the worst comes to the worst and the get wrong version.
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Thank goodness you were on the ball, thank you very much. I have instantly cancelled the order.
I have no way of knowing what was going to be delivered by Amazon.
1. The link in the list of my outstanding orders points to a page whose text doesn't match that which I remember from the time of sale - as the seller now shown is not Amazon themselves, but I had specifically bought an item direct from them.
2. The title now shows 1850 and "1830" in the part code, as I mentioned earlier.
3. The title has no K9C in it yet the blurb both mentions Mobility Express and talks about controlerless operation, the latter luckily being something I knew I had to be on the lookout for.
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Luckily, thanks to aesmith, I started looking around again from scratch. Looking on eBay I found qty 2 of the 1830 WAPs for 2 × £200 less:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Cisco-Aironet-1830-Series-With-Mobility-Express-/262781803895?_trksid=p2047675.l2557&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&nma=true&si=bEFQ0eFmAQ2vFi68FtzaFyl8a1U%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc
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Would anyone have an email address for a human at Cisco?
I'd like to find out where / whether I can buy some direct tech support, or at least get an idea how much that might cost p/a (shudder to think).
I just wasted another half hour roaming round in the labyrinthine website full of marketing speak and gigantic glossy images, amongst pages which don't fit even in an iPad Pro's massive display. I just gave up exhausted in the end, after the web-based chat apps that don't work at all and links that take you to the wrong page or round in circles. And this is with me at my best. Grrr.
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For reference and configuration information I'd start from here ...
http://www.cisco.com/c/en/us/support/wireless/aironet-1830i-access-points/model.html
From that page the AP hardware installation doc is here ..
http://www.cisco.com/c/en/us/td/docs/wireless/access_point/1830/quick/guide/ap1830getstart.html
Mobility Express Configuration and User Guide
http://www.cisco.com/c/en/us/td/docs/wireless/access_point/mob_exp/83/user_guide/b_ME_User_Guide_83.html
Both can be downloaded as PDF, the Mobility Express also available as ePub and Mobi.
Regarding support, let's just say that you're not a typical Cisco customer in that you're technically capable but not familiar with their products. Most Cisco sales go to more complex networks where it wouldn't be practical to provide direct end-user instruction, and these customers would either use a Cisco partner or would have their own personnel.
The Cisco community forums (supportforums.cisco.com) are good for end user and basic questions, and there are also no doubt other Cisco people on this forum.
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Perhaps too good to be true, as the ebay 1830s have never turned up. Hope to goodness I will have some recourse with ebay if I have been had. Can't remember if Mrs Weaver paid ebay by credit card or not.
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Ebay's pretty good in these cases, tending to side with the buyer. Raise a dispute on Ebay.
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I find paying by PayPal with a credit card to be the safest option for purchases over £100 on eBay. It gives both PayPal buyer protection and your credit card protection. Under £100 I use PayPal with my debit card. Unless there's proof of delivery they always side with the buyer so no worries. That's if you used PayPal of course. EBay disputes can be trickier if you paid with a card direct.
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I've had two or three occasions with eBay purchases either not arriving or being something other than what was advertised.
Payment, in all cases, was by PayPal and the relevant funds were swiftly returned once the case, opened with eBay, was (promptly) decided in my favour.
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Why go for Cisco over say over Ubiquiti - which are very popular. The enterprise companies simply aim to tie you into support contracts and licences - I used to run Cisco and Juniper routers at home. But there's not a good argument for that on cost/benefit.
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I did think about ubiquiti but it doesn't work with Apple kit - see Revk's blog, who sells ubiquiti.
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Still no joy from ebay seller. Mrs Weaver is chasing it.
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Looks like I've been conned. Reporting to ebay, here's hoping.
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Thanks to ebay, the Cisco WAPs have finally turned up, presumably only when ebay threatened the seller. Here's hoping to goodness that they are kosher, haven't seen them yet. Ebay suspended this dodgy guy's account. So possibly a happy ending, too soon to tell.
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Cisco WAPs are here, after a month's delay. Opened the box, and, guess what, each is an 1832ixxxK9 not a K9C, so it is the correct hardware, but doesn't have the firmware that I need preinstalled. That firmware is called "Mobility Express", which is essential for me. God no, aargh - I thought I had checked. I'm sure I did after kitizen aesmith kindly warned me about this. In fact, that link to the ebay page even has "Mobility Express" in the url.
Anyway, so I'm screwed without some help getting the software updated. I could of course get my money back from ebay, but I want to keep the units. Need to check they power up even next, to make sure I haven't been given dead ones. Q: Not sure how to do that?
* So. If anyone with the required tools might like to rescue me then I will of course make it worth your while, or make a donation to wherever. I am sorry for being such a pest.
(Reason: I'm effectively bed-bound although I can (thank god) make it as far as the bathroom. But I lack the necessary tools, and in any case I'm too heavily drugged up / confused / in pain to be able to concentrate these days. For those not familiar with severe CFS, it's like being very drunk, not sure how much is the condition and how much the intensive drugs.)
This would involve re-flashing the two WAPs to put the Mobility Express s/w into them. I might have seen the webpage with the instructions on how to update the software.
http://www.cisco.com/c/en/us/td/docs/wireless/access_point/mob_exp/1/user_guide/b_ME_User_Guide/getg_start.html#task_7588F4C009744AEFBB9EB754A713E390
I'm assuming the software is accessible and free.
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(I'm assuming that Cisco, or a dealer would understandably tell me to take a running jump, because I didn't buy them direct from <x> and I don't know how to buy a support contract. But I would be happy to pay them to do it for me unless the cost is more than the cost of replacement devices. Mind you, I wouldn't even know where to start looking.)
If anyone does have a contact who could _definitely_ sort me out, then that would be great, not asking for freebies by any means. The problem about giving up and just buying some replacements is that exactly the same thing might happen again next time, and the vagueness of a lot of the for-sale descriptions means that I have had to try and nail sellers down to be precise, yet still got stuffed anyway.
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If they are anything like other Cisco kit I've firmware updated (routers and switches) then you can do it by connecting to the console port using an RJ45 -> RS232 adaptor and pulling down the file via TFTP from your PC (you would have to setup a local TFTP server on your PC and connect to the WAP via ethernet but that's fairly easy with something like Open TFTP) some kit you could push the firmware over the console port but it was incredibly slow.
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Does anyone know where the software can be downloaded from (for a U.K. 1830 - part 1832xxxk9c I think aesmith said)? I think I have seen PC to Cisco console cables on Amazon, and I could get one of those if I can only find a volunteer to help with the physical and brain work.
If I can't get anyone to help me, and I have a couple of people I can still try, then I am thinking about getting hold of a console cable for the iPad, and I think there is an iPad TFTP server too, but I will have to hope that my mind clears sufficiently one day, and at this rate that won't be soon.
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Depending on if the seller was an authorised re-seller Cisco TAC might be able to help you with the firmware (even if not they might help anyway). If not you will have to look at other less legitimate sources. I think the firmware you are after is air-ap1850-k9-me-8-2-100-0.zip
Generally you would log in to the AP via the console cable using something like putty and then use the command line to connect to a TFTP server to pull the file down.
The process to convert is covered in some detail in this post on the cisco forum:
https://supportforums.cisco.com/discussion/12886396/aironet-1850-standalone-mobility-express-master
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Oh sod, then I've completely had it, if I can't even get hold of the software. The seller was some guy on eBay, so no help there. I think it's time to just give up and write this off, as I simply can't use these units now. They were brand-new sealed in proper packaging, never been opened.
I can't physically do the procedure as I can't even sit upright in a chair for many minutes, nor do I have the tools. And I've had absolutely no luck trying to find a volunteer to help me with the physical aspect of it thus far.
Could someone confirm that there's no chance of me getting hold of Mobility Express?
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Here is a link (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FTDI-USB-Cisco-Rollover-RS232-to-RJ45-cable-USB-serial-to-RJ45-adapter-cable-/112119458859) to a Cisco Serial Management Port to USB Adapter.
The vendor's shop, G0OYQ - Steve (http://stores.ebay.co.uk/g0oyq-steve), has lots of useful adapters, leads, connectors, etc.
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Hi weaver
Here is the link for software, which I think is your but double check it, as I did it in a hurry
Many thanks
John
https://software.cisco.com/download/release.html?mdfid=286285791&flowid=75342&softwareid=286289839&release=8.3.111.0&relind=AVAILABLE&rellifecycle=&reltype=latest
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I tried Cisco's website chat thing. They said 'we don't have access to part codes' ! I thought 'clueless' was an Andrews and Arnold server, Cisco seem to have stolen the concept but taken it literally. I felt sick when I cut them off at that point.
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Many many thanks to Burakkucat and d2d4j. Life saver.
Mrs Weaver will kill me for being so utterly useless thus far in my attempts to blanket her world with Apple-friendly, MU-MIMO goodness.
I need the 1830 one btw, this thread started off being about the 1850, but then changed model later on, so the original title, which keeps getting propagated, is very misleading.
I tried to download a .tar file, having navigated to what looks correct for the 1830, and was told where to go by the web server. I need to buy a service contract to be able to get hold of the s/w it seems, but I have no clue where to even start with that.
So now all I need is
(1) a service contract,
(2) possibly a huge pile of cash but then I would probably want a service contract anyway
(3) and a pair of hands plus brain to do the conversion work, as I am so nauseous at the moment. Mrs Weaver discovered that she had screwed up (xxx) and accidentally doubled up on my opiates [pain] a couple of days ago, so perhaps that's why I feel awful.
* Anyone have any clue how to buy a service contract? Any rough idea of costs?
I should be able to get a refund out of eBay, but I really really don't want to. In any event, if I would find a service contract highly useful anyway, I don't want to start all over again and pay £400 more for a replacement pair of units that (hopefully) have the correct firmware load, since these were such a good deal.
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I need the 1830 one btw, this thread started off being about the 1850, but then changed model later on, so the original title, which keeps getting propagated, is very misleading.
Two paw-pushes on the keys and the job is done. Every post now has a "Cisco 1830 WAP" subject line.
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Many thanks to the god-like powers of the admins.
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Hi weaver
I would email Cisco with your eBay proof of purchase and you should receive a time listed link to download. I believe this only applies if they were brand new, unopened
I would ask for all versions of download, tar and zip, for both controller and express, so you can set a controller up and slave the others.
One of the aspects of a service contract is to get the latest software, which as with every software, would contain bugs and resolutions to previous bugs
I hope that helps a little
Many thanks
John
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@d2d4j - I did indeed as far as I can tell get brand new unopened kit in what looked like the correct genuine packaging. I myself had to open them to check the part code on the items matched that on the outside of the box.
Do you have any idea about an email contact as I just got told don't know don't care by the Cisco minion I talked to on the web chat?
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You could try this:
tac@cisco.com
Pulled it from here:
http://www.cisco.com/c/en/us/support/web/tsd-cisco-worldwide-contacts.html
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Hallelujah- I very much hesitate to speak to soon, but Mrs Weaver has a contact with a Cisco engineer, who indicated willingness to pitch in and help. Here's hoping.
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Hi weaver
Good news
You may not be able to receive the latest update if no contract but should be able to receive the 2 different files for controller and slave
Many thanks
John
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Can't afford a hardware controller, and couldn't justify it just for two or three WAPs.
Daft question: Does a h/w controller become a bottleneck, in that all data passes through it? Surely not.
Single point of failure two (unless more than one unit obviously)? Which might favour Mobility Express if that can adapt to one node going down (like Token Ring electing a new Master iirc). Don't know anything about Mobility Express or the Cisco WAP controllers.
I will still be wanting to find out about buying a contract, so as to get bug fixes and significant functionality upgrades, if any.
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Really sorry to hear of your problems Weaver but I'm afraid I can't offer useful help for your Cisco issues.
I was curious about the Apple issues you referenced with Ubiquiti. I've since read Rev K rant and it doesn't delve too deeply into the details of his problems. What I would say is that UBNT Unifi products are evolving very rapidly with bugfixes appearing weekly, usually for some obscure fault. I use their products including Unifi, at home, with a couple of iPads, many PCs, laptops, Linux servers, data acquisition devices, TVs, but no Macs. The iPads do tend to want to hold on to an AP once connected, but you can tweak the RSSI threshold, so an AP will drop a client if the received signal strength falls below a threshold. For that to be useful the AP distribution needs to minimise large overlap areas with neighbour APs at that threshold. Installing the controller into a virtual machine which is only needed during configuration is pretty trivial. Updates are readily available without jumping through hoops. In my view a better choice for a technical residential user but a non Cisco partner or regular Cisco installer.
I hope that wasn't too unhelpful, maybe of some use in the future.
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> In my view a better choice for a technical residential user but a non Cisco partner or regular Cisco installer.
It rather depends on what you want? And on whether or not you are a residential user. Cisco are a complete nightmare in terms of unhelpful unapproachable labyrinthine god knows xxx
I took a lot of interest in Ubiquiti was high up on my list until thank goodness I found out that the combination of their kit plus Apple's iOS is known to be completely and utterly broken when used with Apple gear unless you have only one AP. So this is an almost all iOS shop, then they are completely out. As much use as a chocolate teapot. Or knitted condom.
I'm installing kit for my wife's business as well as residential use and it's quite a difficult environment physically. So it's a mixture of residential, Janet's office and a small hotel too.
There is also the fact that the existing ZyXel WAPs have a very full list of capabilities and so that sets a certain baseline otherwise it isn't worth me upgrading and I don't have to upgrade either. In this case I got the Cisco units for half the price of the existing old ZyXel WAPs.
Regarding ease of use of the product - from what I've read, I would have had no hassle had I not been stuffed by the dishonest and also possibly plain incompetent seller then shipping me the wrong part. The Cisco units promise to be no more difficult to set up than my ZyXels, once I can get the correct firmware in them.
I might be in luck, as I have received an offer of help from someone that Mrs Weaver knows. Here's hoping anyway.
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I feel the "utterly and completely broken" for Apple hardware is somewhat misplaced and maybe based on old or false information. The last reference I note Adrian makes is to rev 3.7.5.4969. Currently I'm running v3.7.49, but so far have not had any of the issues others have reported through quite a few upgrades. I really wasn't trying to sway you, your path is set, more trying to redress the balance.
For a commercial installation I think it's probably best to use a professional installer and go with their choice of kit and experience and backup. For a DIY installation I would choose Ubiquiti on grounds of cost and ease of access to documentation, firmware and support. No contracts in sight. They seem more approachable with good community support from experienced installers and UBNT employees.
I really hope your new lead works out and everything goes well.
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(I realised I had made a mistake with that post and so edited it before I saw your reply.)
> I feel the "utterly and completely broken" for Apple hardware is somewhat misplaced and maybe based on old or false information.
I am not at all convinced that it is Ubiquiti at fault, could very well be Apple. But the fact that no-one has sorted this quickly can not be forgiven.
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I suspect it's a more awkward joint interoperability issue. However it hasn't proved a problem with our two iOS devices across 3 APs. We might just have a more favourable AP distribution.
I do have a slight issue with a Dell laptop that manages 450Mbps upload, but only 20Mbps down, but I suspect that's more to do with a dodgy Atheros chip driver on the laptop.
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I am so very embarrassed. User aesmith has once again saved my bacon having reminded me to check the part code again. And guess what? My only poor excuse is that it is difficult fighting through the fog and drunkenness and freezing wind.
Mrs Weaver took a photo of the box that the Cisco APs came in. The identification on the box has two part codes. The first one says -"K9C" and explicitly says "with Mobility Express". The second says "base p/n" and "K9" (no C), well it would. I certainly looked at the identification plate on the actual units themselves as I wanted to check that what was in the box was what was supposed to be, but I don't remember looking at the box.
So I suspect that all of my bleating whimpering etc has all been over nothing. In the morning I shall ask Mrs Weaver if she would be kind enough to fire them up for me and we shall see if the expected setup-mode SSID is visible.
I have been more out of it than usual. More activity following the lightning strike may have taken its toll, I don't know. Everything has to be paid for.
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When I talked to the software inside the units, I couldn't make much sense of it. Its appearance didn't seem to be anything like the description of the product ‘Mobility Express’ as described in the Cisco manual. So I decided that they had possibly been reprogrammed with the wrong stuff despite the label on the kit saying -C which we believe means ‘contains Mobility Express software’, or else put into some weird mode that is not documented. Anyway I was out of my depth at that point.
After an absolute age, Mrs Weaver finally got them sent off to her Cisco friend who has now sent the units back to me, having hopefully put the correct software in them for me. I haven't managed to fire them up yet though because I now don’t have any power because the Mrs has now lost / buried the POE injectors somewhere and so I am having to buy two more. :-( When the replacements turn up from Amazon she will probably find the existing ones.
So still no idea what’s what yet.
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I just completely failed with this. It's as if I have the wrong software loaded in them or I have somehow caused them to revert back to some really weird behavioural mode.
I just wish I knew someone who could reset them for me, with the right special i/f cables and so fort.
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You really need a person with Cisco knowledge take a break at Skye Shepherd Huts.
Unfortunately I would be unable to travel up . . . "popping round the corner" is now difficult for me and I am without any significant Cisco knowledge.