Kitz Forum

Broadband Related => FTTC and FTTP Issues => Topic started by: Sunzz on December 20, 2016, 03:04:37 PM

Title: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Sunzz on December 20, 2016, 03:04:37 PM
So after loads of power cuts, me messing around with my routers,cables etc i messed up internet up pretty badly. I was interleaved but luckily im back on fastpath, and im now using a zyxel vmg8924-b10a. Iv included some images of my current speed and the adsl checker, 2 bt engineers said my lines are fine but im suffering from crosstalk, will i ever get better upload speed? do my stats look ok? the best iv got recently before all the power cuts etc was 50/6.


VDSL Training Status:   Showtime
                    Mode:   VDSL2 Annex B
            VDSL Profile:   Profile 17a
                G.Vector:   Disable
            Traffic Type:   PTM Mode
             Link Uptime:   1 day: 0 hour: 14 minutes
====================================================================================
       VDSL Port Details       Upstream         Downstream
               Line Rate:      4.439 Mbps       44.051 Mbps
    Actual Net Data Rate:      4.296 Mbps       43.983 Mbps
          Trellis Coding:         ON                ON
              SNR Margin:        6.3 dB            6.3 dB
            Actual Delay:          0 ms              0 ms
          Transmit Power:      - 3.2 dBm         - 3.2 dBm
           Receive Power:       -7.7 dBm          -1.1 dBm
              Actual INP:        0.0 symbols       0.0 symbols
       Total Attenuation:        0.0 dB          18.2 dB
Attainable Net Data Rate:      4.767 Mbps       44.009 Mbps
====================================================================================
  VDSL Band Status        U0      U1      U2      U3      U4      D1      D2      D3
  Line Attenuation(dB):    1.2    23.8    36.1     N/A     N/A    12.9    30.7    49.0   
Signal Attenuation(dB):    1.0    23.7    35.3     N/A     N/A    12.2    30.5    49.1   
        SNR Margin(dB):    6.4    6.3    0.0     N/A     N/A    6.3    6.3    6.3   
         TX Power(dBm):   -6.8   -19.9   -5.9     N/A     N/A    11.0    7.2    6.9   
====================================================================================

            VDSL Counters

           Downstream        Upstream
Since Link time = 14 min 23 sec
FEC:      0      954
CRC:      228      296
ES:      187      277
SES:      0      0
UAS:      0      0
LOS:      0      0
LOF:      0      0
LOM:      0      0
Latest 15 minutes time = 14 min 48 sec
FEC:      0      16
CRC:      7      5
ES:      4      3
SES:      0      0
UAS:      0      0
LOS:      0      0
LOF:      0      0
LOM:      0      0
Previous 15 minutes time = 15 min 0 sec
FEC:      0      7
CRC:      1      2
ES:      1      2
SES:      0      0
UAS:      0      0
LOS:      0      0
LOF:      0      0
LOM:      0      0
Latest 1 day time = 14 min 48 sec
FEC:      0      16
CRC:      7      5
ES:      4      3
SES:      0      0
UAS:      0      0
LOS:      0      0
LOF:      0      0
LOM:      0      0
Previous 1 day time = 24 hours 0 sec
FEC:      0      938
CRC:      221      291
ES:      183      274
SES:      0      0
UAS:      24      24
LOS:      0      0
LOF:      0      0
LOM:      0      0
Total time = 1 days 14 min 48 sec
FEC:      0      954
CRC:      228      296
ES:      187      277
SES:      0      0
UAS:      24      24
LOS:      0      0
LOF:      0      0
LOM:      0      0
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Sheepie on December 20, 2016, 03:33:12 PM
I think unless you can figure out why the U2 band is missing you will not get much improvment in upstream sync. Since your Downstream tones either side of U2 band look ok then it's probably something to do with the low power on the upstream.

My attenuation is 12.7dB, so closer the the cab than you (or better quality line in any case), yet my power is a lot higher (12.6dbm down 4.2dbm up)



Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Ronski on December 20, 2016, 03:40:58 PM
I've switched back to my HG612 from the Zyxel, I've lost 7.2Mbps on the downstream (attainable was slightly lower than the sync on the Zyxel), but have gained 2Mbps on the upstream (attainable was pretty much the same as the sync). I shall probably stick to using the HG612 given the boost in upstream, and it makes for a tidier set up.

My upstream had been steadily dropping over the last year or so and got down to 4.5 Mbps.
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Sunzz on December 20, 2016, 03:44:27 PM
I think unless you can figure out why the U2 band is missing you will not get much improvment in upstream sync. Since your Downstream tones either side of U2 band look ok then it's probably something to do with the low power on the upstream.

My attenuation is 12.7dB, so closer the the cab than you (or better quality line in any case), yet my power is a lot higher (12.6dbm down 4.2dbm up)

Yeh iv noticed that before in previous posts, im complete missing bit tones in that area. Bt engineers said my line is fine so i dont really know what to do :(
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Sunzz on December 20, 2016, 03:46:00 PM
I've switched back to my HG612 from the Zyxel, I've lost 7.2Mbps on the downstream (attainable was slightly lower than the sync on the Zyxel), but have gained 2Mbps on the upstream (attainable was pretty much the same as the sync). I shall probably stick to using the HG612 given the boost in upstream, and it makes for a tidier set up.

My upstream had been steadily dropping over the last year or so and got down to 4.5 Mbps.

Hmm i wonder if i should use the hg612 as my modem and the zyxel as my router then, as the wifis pretty good which has stopped the women of the house moaning lol
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Sheepie on December 20, 2016, 04:57:21 PM
I think you should listen to ejs from your other post.....

See if you can get openreach to check the upstream power against attenuation on other customers into the same cab see if anyone is breaking the rules on UPBO.

"the use of UPBO has to be mandatory for all players, otherwise it will not be effective"


Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Sunzz on December 20, 2016, 10:57:16 PM
I think you should listen to ejs from your other post.....

See if you can get openreach to check the upstream power against attenuation on other customers into the same cab see if anyone is breaking the rules on UPBO.

"the use of UPBO has to be mandatory for all players, otherwise it will not be effective"

They would probs look at me like wtf? lol knowing my luck the guy wont even know what UPBO is.
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Sunzz on December 22, 2016, 03:25:37 PM
Would it be worth trying to contact openreach on the problem? if thats even possible?
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Sunzz on January 02, 2017, 09:33:45 AM
Heres my stats now, i really need to stop changing routers and stuff lol. Does my connection look good or bad? i think im getting too many errors for DLM to improve my connection right?

xdslcmd info --stats
xdslcmd: ADSL driver and PHY status
Status: Showtime
Retrain Reason:   0
Last initialization procedure status:   0
Max:   Upstream rate = 4478 Kbps, Downstream rate = 48372 Kbps
Bearer:   0, Upstream rate = 4334 Kbps, Downstream rate = 48836 Kbps

Link Power State:   L0
Mode:         VDSL2 Annex B
VDSL2 Profile:      Profile 17a
TPS-TC:         PTM Mode(0x0)
Trellis:      U:ON /D:ON
Line Status:      No Defect
Training Status:   Showtime
      Down      Up
SNR (dB):    6.3       6.3
Attn(dB):    18.1       0.0
Pwr(dBm):   -1.7      -1.7
         VDSL2 framing
         Bearer 0
MSGc:      18      33
B:      239      135
M:      1      1
T:      64      5
R:      14      16
S:      0.1564      0.9959
L:      12992      1221
D:      1      1
I:      254      152
N:      254      152
         Counters
         Bearer 0
OHF:      36026040      409219
OHFErr:      205      232
RS:      2305641149      2699361
RSCorr:      2760      739
RSUnCorr:   2835      0

         Bearer 0
HEC:      1731      0
OCD:      73      0
LCD:      73      0
Total Cells:   4199425682      0
Data Cells:   117934338      0
Drop Cells:   0
Bit Errors:   0      0

ES:      134      214
SES:      0      0
UAS:      23      23
AS:      90508

         Bearer 0
INP:      0.00      0.00
INPRein:   0.00      0.00
delay:      0      0
PER:      2.51      16.24
OR:      76.42      19.20
AgR:      48912.55   4352.89

Bitswap:   30900/30901      45/47

Total time = 1 days 1 hours 8 min 51 sec
FEC:      2760      739
CRC:      205      232
ES:      134      214
SES:      0      0
UAS:      23      23
LOS:      0      0
LOF:      0      0
LOM:      0      0
Latest 15 minutes time = 8 min 51 sec
FEC:      2      4
CRC:      0      1
ES:      0      1
SES:      0      0
UAS:      0      0
LOS:      0      0
LOF:      0      0
LOM:      0      0
Previous 15 minutes time = 15 min 0 sec
FEC:      15      3
CRC:      2      1
ES:      2      1
SES:      0      0
UAS:      0      0
LOS:      0      0
LOF:      0      0
LOM:      0      0
Latest 1 day time = 1 hours 8 min 51 sec
FEC:      54      35
CRC:      7      11
ES:      8      10
SES:      0      0
UAS:      0      0
LOS:      0      0
LOF:      0      0
LOM:      0      0
Previous 1 day time = 24 hours 0 sec
FEC:      2706      704
CRC:      198      221
ES:      126      204
SES:      0      0
UAS:      23      23
LOS:      0      0
LOF:      0      0
LOM:      0      0
Since Link time = 1 days 1 hours 8 min 27 sec
FEC:      2760      739
CRC:      205      232
ES:      134      214
SES:      0      0
UAS:      0      0
LOS:      0      0
LOF:      0      0
LOM:      0      0
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Ronski on January 02, 2017, 12:31:11 PM
They look fine to me, stop worrying and leave it alone.

Previous 1 day time = 24 hours 0 sec
FEC:      2706      704
CRC:      198      221
ES:      126      204
SES:      0      0
UAS:      23      23
LOS:      0      0
LOF:      0      0
LOM:      0      0

ES is the one that matters the most I believe, and 126/204 in a 24 hour period is nothing.

If you really must keep looking I suggest you have a read of this page, it covers both VDSL & ADSL

http://www.kitz.co.uk/adsl/DLM.htm
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: NewtronStar on January 02, 2017, 04:14:10 PM
when I look at those stats the line shows an uptime of 1 hour 8 mins and it is showing 134 ES in that hour so if those errors stayed constant during 23 hours 134ES X 23H = 3082 ES  that is above the DLM speed profile of 2880.

But I don't know if 1 hour 8 mins and 51 secs snapshot was a noisy time of the day  :-\
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: ejs on January 02, 2017, 04:36:17 PM
@NewtronStar

I think you've misread the stats. The 1h 8m 51s has 8 ES, this is 1 hour and 8 minutes into the start of the current 24-hour period. The 134 ES is for the total link uptime, of 1 day 1 hour 8 mins.
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: NewtronStar on January 02, 2017, 05:00:51 PM
Are you sure I ran my own stats for 1H and 3min 26 sec a few days ago have a look.

Edit I see now it says total time = 1 day not 1 hour  :-[  :paperbag:

Code: [Select]
adsl info --stats
adsl: ADSL driver and PHY status
Status: Showtime
Last Retrain Reason:    0
Last initialization procedure status:   0
Max:    Upstream rate = 6424 Kbps, Downstream rate = 38565 Kbps
Bearer: 0, Upstream rate = 6424 Kbps, Downstream rate = 32444 Kbps

Link Power State:       L0
Mode:                   VDSL2 Annex B
VDSL2 Profile:          Profile 17a
TPS-TC:                 PTM Mode(0x0)
Trellis:                U:ON /D:ON
Line Status:            No Defect
Training Status:        Showtime
                Down            Up
SNR (dB):        6.2             6.1
Attn(dB):        24.7            0.0
Pwr(dBm):        11.2            3.8

                        VDSL2 framing
                        Bearer 0
MSGc:           18              26
B:              51              191
M:              1               1
T:              64              40
R:              12              14
S:              0.0510          0.9488
L:              10040           1737
D:              635             1
I:              64              103
N:              64              206

                        Counters
                        Bearer 0
OHF:            959254          331411
OHFErr:         62              0
RS:             245491668               366968
RSCorr:         80095           3
RSUnCorr:       4073            0

                        Bearer 0
HEC:            937             0
OCD:            2               0
LCD:            2               0
Total Cells:    196099755               0
Data Cells:     10966           0
Drop Cells:     0
Bit Errors:     0               0

ES:             19              0
SES:            0               0
UAS:            662             662
AS:             3144

                        Bearer 0
INP:            3.00            0.00
INPRein:        0.00            0.00
delay:          8               0
PER:            3.27            9.52
OR:             58.59           26.87
AgR:            32503.03        6450.60

Bitswap:        2158/2158               28/28

Total time = 1 hours 3 min 26 sec
FEC:            80095           3
CRC:            62              0
ES:             19              0
SES:            0               0
UAS:            662             662
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
Latest 15 minutes time = 3 min 26 sec
FEC:            9440            0
CRC:            5               0
ES:             3               0
SES:            0               0
UAS:            0               0
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
Previous 15 minutes time = 15 min 0 sec
FEC:            17165           0
CRC:            25              0
ES:             7               0
SES:            0               0
UAS:            0               0
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
Latest 1 day time = 1 hours 3 min 26 sec
FEC:            80095           3
CRC:            62              0
ES:             19              0
SES:            0               0
UAS:            662             662
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
Previous 1 day time = 0 sec
FEC:            0               0
CRC:            0               0
ES:             0               0
SES:            0               0
UAS:            0               0
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
Since Link time = 52 min 23 sec
FEC:            80095           3
CRC:            62              0
ES:             19              0
SES:            0               0
UAS:            0               0
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
 >

Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Sunzz on January 02, 2017, 05:19:18 PM
when I look at those stats the line shows an uptime of 1 hour 8 mins and it is showing 134 ES in that hour so if those errors stayed constant during 23 hours 134ES X 23H = 3082 ES  that is above the DLM speed profile of 2880.

But I don't know if 1 hour 8 mins and 51 secs snapshot was a noisy time of the day  :-\

yeh i think u may be mistaken Newtron :P Where does it says 2880 ES on the dlm page? i thought it was <345 errors per day to be classed as Green/Good?

Latest 1 day time = 1 hours 8 min 51 sec
FEC:      54      35
CRC:      7      11
ES:      8      10
SES:      0      0
UAS:      0      0
LOS:      0      0
LOF:      0      0
LOM:      0      0
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: ejs on January 02, 2017, 05:31:29 PM
The DLM profiles are usually given in terms of MTBE rather than ES count per day.
MTBE = uptime/ES
ES = uptime/MTBE
(24*60*60)/30 = 2880

So 2880 ES in 24 hours would work out as an MTBE of 30.
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: NewtronStar on January 02, 2017, 06:33:31 PM
I never look at MTBE section just the ES at the bottom

ERRORS over 24hr speed profile

                ACTION   Ignore     GOOD
1s           30s        300s       86400s
86400       2880        288       1 ES


ERRORS over 24hr standard profile


                ACTION   Ignore     GOOD
1s           60s        300s       86400s
86400       1440        144       1 ES
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: j0hn on January 02, 2017, 06:40:56 PM
You're in the Speed profile, so anything less than 288 ES per 24 hours is ILQ green.

I don't understand what you mean by DLM improving the connection? Your line is on fastpath. Your line isn't banded. It's running as good as it can. DLM isn't limiting your line in any way, so can't "improve it". Actions by DLM can limit a line, but your line isn't affected by DLM at all.
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Sunzz on January 02, 2017, 11:07:13 PM
You're in the Speed profile, so anything less than 288 ES per 24 hours is ILQ green.

I don't understand what you mean by DLM improving the connection? Your line is on fastpath. Your line isn't banded. It's running as good as it can. DLM isn't limiting your line in any way, so can't "improve it". Actions by DLM can limit a line, but your line isn't affected by DLM at all.

Well before some power cuts and changing routers trying to get a bit more speed i was on 50/6. Now im on 45/4 as my speed was knocked down, but i know my line can handle a bit more upstream. My line attention is only 18 and should handle alot more, also im missing a big chunk of bit tones so im praying something magic happens lmao :P
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: j0hn on January 03, 2017, 05:59:27 PM
I think you should listen to ejs from your other post.....

See if you can get openreach to check the upstream power against attenuation on other customers into the same cab see if anyone is breaking the rules on UPBO.

"the use of UPBO has to be mandatory for all players, otherwise it will not be effective"
This ^^^
Just read some of your previous posts and noticed the UPBO posts. I need to change my signature as I got rid of the monstrosity that is the Asus DSL-AC68U. I now own the lovely RT variant. I'm amazed OpenReach don't ban the Asus's, and even more amazed some ISP's actually supply the things.  The WebUI allows you to set your own snrm target & disable UPBO, and Asus dish out a 3rd party tool that can override certain DLM settings on the DSLAM.

If I were you I would send a very detailed email to the CEO. It's probably the best bet for something technical like this. I can see difficulties getting the average ISP to take this up and know what UPBO even is. Add images of your current bits/tone, and images from the Asus with UPBO disabled. Hopefully somebody in OpenReach can see who's using that device on your DSLAM and who's overriding UPBO.

That's if someone is even disabling UPBO on your DSLAM. It could be something else affecting your upload. The fact turning off UPBO gives you better upload doesn't mean someone else is.

What firmware is your ECI DSLAM running on? We've seen a firmware change impact another users upload on an ECI cab recently.
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Ronski on January 03, 2017, 07:18:54 PM
I'm in a similar situation to Sunzz where my upload has deteriorated a lot over the last year or so, but my download has stayed around the same, or even improved depending on how far back you go.
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Sunzz on January 03, 2017, 11:51:09 PM
This ^^^
Just read some of your previous posts and noticed the UPBO posts. I need to change my signature as I got rid of the monstrosity that is the Asus DSL-AC68U. I now own the lovely RT variant. I'm amazed OpenReach don't ban the Asus's, and even more amazed some ISP's actually supply the things.  The WebUI allows you to set your own snrm target & disable UPBO, and Asus dish out a 3rd party tool that can override certain DLM settings on the DSLAM.

If I were you I would send a very detailed email to the CEO. It's probably the best bet for something technical like this. I can see difficulties getting the average ISP to take this up and know what UPBO even is. Add images of your current bits/tone, and images from the Asus with UPBO disabled. Hopefully somebody in OpenReach can see who's using that device on your DSLAM and who's overriding UPBO.

That's if someone is even disabling UPBO on your DSLAM. It could be something else affecting your upload. The fact turning off UPBO gives you better upload doesn't mean someone else is.

What firmware is your ECI DSLAM running on? We've seen a firmware change impact another users upload on an ECI cab recently.

Which Asus RT router do you own now? Do you mean the CEO of Openreach? I wonder if the CEO would even reply to me lol as this is just a small residential problem, id assume he would be interested in bigger things :(. I believe my firmware is 206.
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Chrysalis on January 04, 2017, 12:07:25 AM
Why not? he replied to me and others, he will pass on your case to a senior member of openreach management team I expect, what happens after that point who knows, but its better contacting the openreach upper management instead of basic low trained CP tech support staff on this issue.
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: j0hn on January 04, 2017, 12:14:07 AM
He has a team who read/reply to his emails from disgruntled customers. He replied to mine personally, forwarding my email to the Head Office HLC department (high level complaints). Then a couple hours later his team replied saying he was "in meetings all day" and duplicated what Clive had already done. They will pass on your case to the right department.

206 is the expected firmware. That rules the DSLAM firmware out as the problem. Looking for UPBO issues would be my avenue.
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Sunzz on January 04, 2017, 09:44:05 AM
Wow, so like you guys said i wrote out a huge email to the CEO at 4 am this morning and he replied at 5 am lol. He said hes going to ask his director of network quality to investigate my line and service, fingers crossed! :D
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Ronski on January 04, 2017, 10:20:07 AM
Keep us updated, it will be very interesting to hear what results you get.
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Sunzz on January 04, 2017, 03:02:01 PM
Hey ron, i know youre going through the same problems as me so il update you as fast as possible, i think openreach are working on my internet right now! check my webdslstats, iv had about 15 disconnections in the last hour, stats going crazy, and a few times iv even noticed green tones where the big empty gap normally is! but they it disconnects and its gone again lol

sorry my internet is going as i type this, so if i double post etc my bad
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Sunzz on January 05, 2017, 02:08:37 AM
so my missing bit tones came back, but sadly they are now gone. For a few hours i had 48/ 7-8 which is much better on my upload, now its even worse at 38/3 :P. iv got it all recorded on mydslwebstats as well.

If anyone could have a look and tell me what they think that would be greatttt :D they havent contacted me though, so im wondering, was it them or was my connection just going crazy?
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: j0hn on January 05, 2017, 04:45:13 AM
Sounds like someone was remotely playing with lines on the DSLAM, possibly trying to identify any offender. Or it's a huge coincidence that the day you reported the issue, is the 1st time in months those tones have been in use.

If UPBO is the cause and they have indeed identified any offending line, I suspect they've allowed it to reconnect and the EU will be contacted directly about their offending equipment.

Must say if that is what's happened then I'm astonished at the speed of response from OpenReach. You'll find out soon enough. Keep us posted.

edit: looking on MDWS quite a bit changed during the 3 hours your U2 band bits/tone returned. Power levels went from -4.3dBm up to 6.8dBm, it made U2 line/signal attenuation jump.
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Sunzz on January 05, 2017, 11:35:02 AM
fingers crossed they will figure out whats wrong. Right now my connection is completely screwed, i havent touched my router at all as i dont really know if they are testing stuff, and im now interleaved, lost 6 meg down and my down sng margin is super low at 5.1, back to 3 mb upload.

It sucks because i cant run dsl stats when im asleep, as my closed loop CPU water cooler has been playing up, and i dont want to leave it on unattended lol.
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Ronski on January 05, 2017, 01:28:50 PM
What you need is a Raspberry Pi to install DLStats on  ;)
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Sunzz on January 06, 2017, 12:26:43 PM
What you need is a Raspberry Pi to install DLStats on  ;)

:P true i do, god my connection is so p00 right now lol, 34 down 2.5 up .

They emailed me and said someone should of been in contact as they want to send someone out, nothing for 3 hours so i emailed back and they said they were doing some tests at the cabinet to double check everything on there end before they need to send someone round. im shocked at how fast they are! i assumed it would be at least a week before i got an email back.
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Ronski on January 06, 2017, 01:27:56 PM
Many years ago I resorted to emailing the CEO after PN had failed to get BTOR to fix my brothers broadband after 3 months. Emailed Sunday afternoon,  fixed Thursday morning. If only the service was that good all the time.
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Sunzz on January 06, 2017, 02:44:27 PM
Many years ago I resorted to emailing the CEO after PN had failed to get BTOR to fix my brothers broadband after 3 months. Emailed Sunday afternoon,  fixed Thursday morning. If only the service was that good all the time.

True, im guessing openreach realize emailing them directly is a last resort and its important.Havent herd anything yet, sucks because the other day them bit tones returned for the first time ever, and now they're gone :(
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Sunzz on January 09, 2017, 11:22:52 AM
So a lil update on whats been happening. We had openreach come round this morning even though we had no phone call to let us know or anything :P he was doing loads of checks outside and was using these huge wooden poles that connect together to find our duct thing or something?

I'm a bit confused on what he was telling me but him and another openreach engineer are coming back tomorrow as they need to dig up a section of mud just outside our neighbours house, he said other lines were getting around 10 mb upload or more yet we are getting 3, and that they think we dont have ducting or something line that? and i believe they are putting a new line in from our house to just outside my neighbours, where they are going to dig up.

Wish i wasn't so stupid and understood everything lol

Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Chrysalis on January 09, 2017, 02:56:55 PM
Hmm

Whilst this may get you a better connection, I think they have still misunderstood the problem.

They are still looking at it in a very simplistic way which is they looking at the upload speed you get, but not the reasons why you get that speed.  The reason been the U2 is not populated.  Now could bad ducting mysteriously only affect the U2 range and not the D2 and D3 ranges either side of it? I suppose its possible but I find it a very remote chance.

I suppose end of the day you wont care how it gets fixed as long as its fixed, it could be fixed simply with a pair swap e.g. as a pair swap could get you moved away from the rogue line in the bundle and the extra US power then doesnt crosstalk onto your line (which also explains why your neighbours cannot be affected).  Let this play out as their work may well improve things anyway in both ways not just the US, and see if it needs further action afterwards.
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: j0hn on January 09, 2017, 05:37:29 PM
Chrysalis is spot on here. Sounds like the UPBO angle is being ignored, but any work that could remove your line from the rogue line will achieve what you want. I can't imagine that if this is down to UPBO that you're the only impacted EU, and this could just move the problem onto someone else. They really should be trying to detect the offending modem, and remove it from their network. It's surely going to be cheaper, quicker, and more effective than ducting sections of buried cables.

Sounds like progress either way. If the planned work doesn't fix the poor upload make sure to ask for a pair swap.
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Sunzz on January 09, 2017, 06:13:47 PM
Chrysalis is spot on here. Sounds like the UPBO angle is being ignored, but any work that could remove your line from the rogue line will achieve what you want. I can't imagine that if this is down to UPBO that you're the only impacted EU, and this could just move the problem onto someone else. They really should be trying to detect the offending modem, and remove it from their network. It's surely going to be cheaper, quicker, and more effective than ducting sections of buried cables.

Sounds like progress either way. If the planned work doesn't fix the poor upload make sure to ask for a pair swap.

They tried a pair swap last time an engineer was here with the same results. Its weird because i sent them so much evidence, including pictures of my stats when openreach were remotely playing with my connection and actually fixed the problem for a few hours.

How could they of temporally fix the problem remotely?

Also i think he said something about il have my OWN ducting? only for 12 metres or so though. up to the front of my next door neighbours house.

Heres my pbparams right now and theres also a picture below of when the problem was temporarily fixed. The tx power and snr margin changed big time on the U2 band

                  VDSL Port Details               Upstream                Downstream
Attainable Net Data Rate:            3161 kbps              38428 kbps
Actual Aggregate Tx Power:         -   4.4 dBm            -   4.4 dBm
====================================================================================
  VDSL Band Status   U0   U1   U2   U3   U4   D1   D2   D3
  Line Attenuation(dB) 1.2   23.7   36.0   N/A   N/A   12.9   30.6   49.0
Signal Attenuation(dB):1.1   23.5   34.9   N/A   N/A   12.2   30.4   48.9
        SNR Margin(dB):6.7   6.3   0.0   N/A   N/A   6.2   5.9   6.1
         TX Power(dBm):-4.6   -19.5   -128.0   N/A   N/A   11.1   7.1   5.9
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Sunzz on January 12, 2017, 04:11:39 PM
Hey guys, so a lil update on the upstream problem etc

so 2 Openreach engineers came tuesday at 9 am and started digging, they was actually here for over 6 hours as they was having trouble getting the cable through the ducts as they were blocked, at one point there was 3 guys!.

After all them hours the new cable did nothing and my speed was exactly the same. He then started doing changes at the cabinet etc and boom my speed is now soo much better and my missing bit tones have returned! he said he changed me onto a different circuit or something like that?

weird because i got similar results when openreach where remotely playing with my connection last week, which only lasted for 2 hours.

Got an email from a high up guy asking how the connection was and i said i was worried it mite revert back like last time but he assured me its fixed and wont revert back. so pbparms before

xdslcmd info --pbParams
xdslcmd: ADSL driver and PHY status
Status: Showtime
Retrain Reason:   0
Last initialization procedure status:   0
Max:   Upstream rate = 3655 Kbps, Downstream rate = 48604 Kbps
Bearer:   0, Upstream rate = 3615 Kbps, Downstream rate = 48836 Kbps

Discovery Phase (Initial) Band Plan
US: (6,31) (882,1193) (1984,2770)
DS: (33,857) (1218,1959) (2795,4083)
Medley Phase (Final) Band Plan
US: (6,31) (882,1193) (1984,2093)
DS: (41,857) (1218,1959) (2795,4083)
     VDSL Port Details        Upstream        Downstream
Attainable Net Data Rate:        3655 kbps          48604 kbps
Actual Aggregate Tx Power:      -   3.6 dBm        -   3.6 dBm
====================================================================================
  VDSL Band Status       U0   U1     U2         U3   U4      D1   D2   D3
  Line Attenuation(dB): 0.6   23.3   35.6     N/A   N/A   12.8  30.1 47.4
Signal Attenuation(dB):0.5   23.1    0.0      N/A   N/A   12.0  29.8 47.4
        SNR Margin(dB):  6.9   6.1     0.0       N/A   N/A     6.4   6.4   6.4
         TX Power(dBm): -4.5  -18.9   -11.3   N/A   N/A   10.6   7.3   7.3


and pbparms

adsl: ADSL driver and PHY status
Status: Showtime
Last Retrain Reason:    1
Last initialization procedure status:   0
Max:    Upstream rate = 16557 Kbps, Downstream rate = 65961 Kbps
Bearer: 0, Upstream rate = 16547 Kbps, Downstream rate = 65941 Kbps

Discovery Phase (Initial) Band Plan
US: (6,31) (882,1193) (1984,2770)
DS: (33,857) (1218,1959) (2795,4083)
Medley Phase (Final) Band Plan
US: (6,31) (882,1193) (1984,2770)
DS: (41,857) (1218,1959) (2795,4083)
                  VDSL Port Details               Upstream                Downstream
Attainable Net Data Rate:           16557 kbps              65961 kbps
Actual Aggregate Tx Power:             6.8 dBm                6.8 dBm
====================================================================================
  VDSL Band Status     U0    U1    U2   U3   U4   D1   D2   D3
  Line Attenuation(dB): 1.2   23.0   37.2   N/A   N/A   12.8   29.8   47.0
Signal Attenuation(dB):1.0   22.8   37.1   N/A   N/A   12.2   29.6   47.0
        SNR Margin(dB):  7.7    6.1    6.0   N/A   N/A   6.1   6.1   6.2
         TX Power(dBm):-4.7   -20.0  6.4   N/A   N/A   10.6   7.1   7.5

Lets hope it stays like this :D
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Chrysalis on January 12, 2017, 04:47:24 PM
Sounds like a malfunctioning port?  New port working correctly.

good news and glad its fixed.

Ronski I think you should do the same ;)

Also you got a nice jump on the DS as well so the new cable may have still helped. :)
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Ronski on January 12, 2017, 08:27:16 PM
@Chrysalis Tempting, but with hopefully a Huawei cab being installed this week, I might just get a new connection when I'm sure it's live.
@Sunzz Great result  ;D
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: j0hn on January 12, 2017, 08:34:34 PM
From 48/3 to 65/16
That's an incredible difference!
A bit ridiculous that you need to go through the CEO to get anything done, but that's a great response.
Hopefully it lasts for you.

Was it HLC department who you were in contact with? Keep hold of that guys email address. I've found that the person dealing with my case high up in OpenReach is more than happy to deal with any follow up enquires I've had and has even opened up a 2nd case for me on an unrelated problem.
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Sunzz on January 12, 2017, 09:14:51 PM
Could it really of been a bad port? wouldny stuff like that be checked first before putting in a new cable lol

@Ronski good luck with ur new cab mate i really hope u get hooked up to it :)

@j0hn i was passed to the director of network quality so yeh il keep that email for sure! :)

Contacting openreach directly was amazing it really was. I think when you report a problem to ur ISP they just say something to openreach like "bad speed" and thats it. no other info. Unless thats the only info they have.

I'm worried that when it resyncs its going to go back lol
Title: Re: Will my Internet Service Recover?
Post by: Chrysalis on January 12, 2017, 10:36:28 PM
shows how things could be if CPs were removed as the middle man? :)

on the 48/3 "but its best efforts its the best you can get, we cannot do anything about the laws of physics".