Kitz Forum
Broadband Related => Broadband Hardware => Topic started by: BigBunny on March 08, 2016, 07:16:59 PM
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I hope I have posted this in the correct subject area of the forum if not please accept my apology.
I have had 40/20 fibre for about 18 months now and have been using an OR ECI MODEM and a 582N locked down router. It looks like I am on an ECI cabinet. Internally all my wireless kit is N though I will at sometime upgrade to AC as the prices come down.
I have been looking a definitely replacing the router and possibly purchase a combined unit to replace both of them. I came across the TP-Link Archer D5 at sub and just above £60, but thought that I would get input from others here as I cannot find any mention of this particular unit on Kitz and wondered if there was a reason? Secondly some adverts for the D5 unit state version 1 while others make no mention to version at all. I looked on the TP-L website and though they show firmware for version one and two they don't actually say, but appear to indicate that this refers to the various countries where it is sold.
I know the D5 is an 812.11ac router but it is the improved N abilities that I am looking for and maybe to assist initially when I eventually upgrade. Any input, advice, or other recommendations will be greatly appreciated.
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40/20
Hmm, I never knew there was a 40/20 product...
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40/20 was a Plusnet package, using 80/20 with Plusnet limiting download speeds to 40 (the modem might still be connected at 79999k, Plusnet limit their copy of the IP profile).
The TP-Link Archer D5, and I think all the Archer DN models, are ADSL only, they do not support VDSL2, so couldn't replace the ECI modem. If you're going to keep using the ECI modem, you might as well get something which is just a wireless router (has no modem at all), which should be slightly cheaper, although high 11ac wireless speeds would probably make it still fairly expensive.
Also, is there any chance you're thinking about replacing the 582n because it's recently been given a remote firmware upgrade, and you're hitting the DNS issues (https://community.plus.net/forum/index.php/topic,148555.0.html)? If so, that should be fixed for everyone soon.
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Thanks guys, and that is the generic guys meaning M & F.
BTW that should have been 40/10 and was a typo. When I originally contracted for fibre I actually got about 60 down and close to 20 up and that lasted for many months. I think they suddenly realised as it suddenly went to where it should have been. I actually get about 12 up, but who's complaining. :)
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possibly purchase a combined unit to replace both of them.
Once you move to ac, the price tends to go up a fair bit. :/
Off the top of my head, the TP-link archer VR900 and Zyxel VMG8924 are possibly about the cheapest. There may also be a few Billion 8800AXL knocking around for sale, but that is being replaced by a much more expensive model and may be hard to get hold of now. The Netgear D7000 is another vdsl modem to look at. They all have rrp somewhere around the £150 mark. Although kcom do sell the Zyxels for iirc £99 which is about the cheapest price, if you cant pick up an ex-isp one up on ebay. Thompson also have one, but I dont really know a lot about it . Favoured AC units on here seem to be Billion 8800AXL or Zyxel VMG8924.
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but it is the improved N abilities that I am looking for
Ooops sorry, with talk of wireless AC, I at first thought that was what you were looking for.
Before advising it would probably be useful if we know how important the following two aspects are to you:-
1) Is GbE a must have. (Some wireless N models only have 10/100)
2) Are you bothered about full line stats for monitoring.
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Hi Kitz,
Yes GbE is really essential. I have a network and server background and I must have updated every switch to Gigabit where I then worked, and not just the uplinks. I have servers and a Netgear NAS box here at home, and I also do some web development so need to upload as well as download. The slowest point should be the fibre and the few Zyxel Powerline adapters I have.
The AC is not important as I have not got anything that currently uses it, though just nice if indeed I do get anything with it. Really good N is though. However like anything IT prices drop pretty quickly, and technology improves so what costs £150 today is probably half of that in 2-3 years time on the open sellers market.
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Yes GbE is really essential. I have servers and a Netgear NAS box here at home, and I also do some web development so need to upload as well as download.
Same as me, and unfortunately limits choice somewhat as it rules out the Billions.
Really good N is though.
Options at <£100 :-
- TP-Link TD-W9980. circa £75 at most places. Dual Band wireless N 2.4GHz and 5Ghz. Lantiq chipset. Limited line stats and no monitoring.
- Zyxel VMG8324. circa £55+VAT @ Eclipse. 2.4 GHz 11n (2x2). BCM chipset full line stats and monitoring.
- TP-Link Archer VR200 - circa £80 at most places. Dual Band Wireless AC750. Lantiq VR9 chipset.
- Zyxel VMG8924. £99 @Kcom Mytech. BCM chipset full line stats and monitoring. Dual band wireless AC.
- Thomson TG799VAC- circa £85. Wireless AC.
Note.
Ive got a VMG8324 and TD-W9980. Although both are wirless N, the TD-W9980 is 5Ghz, but to be perfectly honest I didnt find it any better than the VMG8324.. and especially when it came to range the VMG8324 IMHO performed the better of the two. (The 5Ghz signal soon dropped out of range.) Others have also been impressed at the range of the VMG8324.
The other 3 are AC and you may be able to stretch your budget as they all come in at under £100. Dont know much about the VR200 other than its little brother to the VR900 main difference is using a Lantiq rather than BCM modem chip. The Archer series tend to have a good rep for wifi.
TBH theres only 3 out of all of the above that I'd contemplate and the fact that I like to see line stats actually only narrows it down to 2.. but the choice is yours.
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- TP-Link TD-W9980. circa £75 at most places. Dual Band wireless N 2.4GHz and 5Ghz. Lantiq chipset. Limited line stats and no monitoring.
- Zyxel VMG8324. circa £55+VAT @ Eclipse. 2.4 GHz 11n (2x2). BCM chipset full line stats and monitoring.
- TP-Link Archer VR200 - circa £80 at most places. Dual Band Wireless AC750. Lantiq VR9 chipset.
- Zyxel VMG8924. £99 @Kcom Mytech. BCM chipset full line stats and monitoring. Dual band wireless AC.
- Thomson TG799VAC- circa £85. Wireless AC.
To add, the Billion BiPAC 8800NL.
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To add, the Billion BiPAC 8800NL.
Im afraid not: - as "GbE is really essential".
Same reason why I never bought a 8800NL - I have a NAS box so needed GbE... and didnt want to have to use a separate switch.
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Really useful information Kitz. Many thanks.
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To add, the Billion BiPAC 8800NL.
Im afraid not: - as "GbE is really essential".
Same reason why I never bought a 8800NL - I have a NAS box so needed GbE... and didnt want to have to use a separate switch.
Really? I have a GbE port on my Billion BiPAC 8800NL...
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Yes, there is one
Ethernet: 3-port 10/100M and 1-port Gigabit auto-crossover (MDI/MDI-X) switch
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One is probably not much use as the devices on the other 3 ports will still be restricted to 10/100M
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One is probably not much use as the devices on the other 3 ports will still be restricted to 10/100M
Nods. It means I cant backup to my NAS (or any other networked device) using GbE as both devices need to be attached to a GbE port.
A full backup can take long enough as it is using GbE, so would take hours using 10/100 :/
GbE is now one of the important things for me when it comes to choosing a router. Years ago and before GbE routers, I had to use a separate network switch for data transfers... but my trusty Negear switch died after many years use and Im all about keeping the clutter down these days.
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Yes GbE is really essential
There's always Ebay for a cheap 2nd hand BT HH5. These are locked to the BT network but if you're on Plusnet they will work there too. They work on TalkTalk as well where they don't use authentication.
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And welcome to the forums, BigBunny!
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And welcome to the forums, BigBunny!
Thank you :)
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Options at <£100 :-
- TP-Link TD-W9980. circa £75 at most places. Dual Band wireless N 2.4GHz and 5Ghz. Lantiq chipset. Limited line stats and no monitoring.
- Zyxel VMG8324. circa £55+VAT @ Eclipse. 2.4 GHz 11n (2x2). BCM chipset full line stats and monitoring.
- TP-Link Archer VR200 - circa £80 at most places. Dual Band Wireless AC750. Lantiq VR9 chipset.
- Zyxel VMG8924. £99 @Kcom Mytech. BCM chipset full line stats and monitoring. Dual band wireless AC.
- Thomson TG799VAC- circa £85. Wireless AC.
<SNIP>
TBH theres only 3 out of all of the above that I'd contemplate and the fact that I like to see line stats actually only narrows it down to 2.. but the choice is yours.
There are plenty of the 9980's around for just over £60. I do like stats and years gone by I used to buy the Solwise routers and use the Routertech software that gave loads of information. Eventually I ended up with a Plusnet ADSL router that wasn't locked down so you could still see the stats and could also get in via CLI, and also updated firmware. It was with the 582N that I noticed they were virtually all locked down. I digress.
Looked for the Zyxel and the first one in the list I can't find anywhere even on Amazon and ebay. The only one I could find was the second and that was only on BB and they are out of stock. I assume that these two have been replaced by later models.
However I have found the VR200 sold and fulfilled by Amazon for £64 that is a really good price as everywhere else it is between £78 and £84. I tried to find a review in the brief time I had but could only find the VR200 so assume that it is too new.
The Thomson I haven't looked at yet, but unless it has really something to offer then the VR200 looks a better option.
That is unless you know something I don't. :)
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Zyxel and the first one in the list I can't find anywhere even on Amazon and ebay.
Last time I looked Eclipse was the cheapest place to buy them - £54.17 + VAT (http://www.eclipse.net.uk/index.cfm?id=wap_olorderproductwizard&entrypoint=%2B23A%3AO3E%3DK%259SEJ%24%20&purchaselogicstep=!%2F%40%20%20&relocate=1). Just in case that link doesnt work - start here (https://www.eclipse.net.uk/products/connect/broadband/broadband-hardware/). You dont have to be with eclipse to purchase - theres a couple of people on these forums who bought from there.
years gone by I used to buy the Solwise routers and use the Routertech software that gave loads of information.
The VR200 has a lantiq chip, & doesnt do full line stats. There isnt a right lot of info about them atm. They may work with ejs's statPOSTer to get some more data. I might try get my hands on one at some point to do a review, but I personally wouldnt keep it on my line, purely because of lack of linestats. Its why I said "theres only 3 out of all of the above that I'd contemplate and the fact that I like to see line stats actually only narrows it down to 2.. but the choice is yours."
I didnt want to sway your decision - but you do seem to have very similar requirements to me.. and if you want to stick below £100 then the 2 Zyxels are the only ones that push my buttons. If you want GbE, decent wireless N and linestats in an all-in-one box, then it about only leaves the Zyxels. If youre not bothered about monitoring your line then the VR200 should be fine :)
The TG799VAC may also fit your requirements. Thompson normally use their own CLI, which gives a lot more info than the tp-link cli... and you can [usually] get them working dslstats as long as they have BCM chips. I dont think anyone has tried it yet though -link (http://forum.kitz.co.uk/index.php/topic,15582.0.html).
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The VR200 should be basically the same as the 9980 but with low-end 11ac wireless. It has the same or similar DSL chip, but the VR200 has vectoring enabled firmware, whereas the 9980 does not. The config file trick should work on the 9980 and it might be possible to make it work in the VR200, then there are fairly comprehensive stats available, but they are not supported by the stats monitoring programs, so you'd have to create your own scripts or something like that.
You could also wait and see what the Broadcom based TP-Link VR600 will be priced, although of course it will start off at its highest price when it's launched.
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Just thought that I would update the thread on what I eventually did. I listened to all of you and thank you for all of the advise and information. I was able to get a second hand Zyxel VMG8924-B10A. I say second hand as the seller stated that they had only taken it out of the box and it certainly looked that way as the only things missing was cables, and I have some of those so no problem. Even the front film was still in place. Using Kitz instructions on configuring the VMG8324-B10A I got it up and going and currently using it to compose this post. Looking at the specification etc I am impressed.
Now the only thing that I need to find out from is it worth updating from the 1.00(AAKL.6)_20150126 firmware installed. I know that the latest on the Zyxel UK site is seven, but on the Italian site listed by Kitz for firmware there are two instances of V100AAKL10C0 one dated June and the other September 2015, and then V100AAKL12C0 dated December 2015. In a posting by another elsewhere in the forum they mention V100AAKL11C0 however that is now in a folder named old stuff on the Italian site.
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Hi
The newest version is 13 available from here ftp://ftp2.zyxel.com/VMG8924-B10A/firmware/
If all is working then no harm staying with what you have.
Best Regards
Phil
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After a couple of days or so it locked up and I did a reset to even be able to access it. I then found that the ISP user was different to mine so must have reverted. I restored from the configuration I had taken and then decided to update to the firmware I had downloaded previously, which was 12 and had no issues since. I will probably update to 13 in due course. I note that the Zip file for 13 includes a ROM. Is there anything special that I need to know about that?