Kitz Forum

Broadband Related => ISPs => Topic started by: Broadband1 on February 22, 2008, 05:08:34 PM

Title: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on February 22, 2008, 05:08:34 PM
Kitz as you said heres my Line Stats as requested.

DSL Connection   

   Link Information
         
Uptime:   1 day, 2:30:24
Modulation:   G.992.1 Annex A
Bandwidth (Up/Down) [kbps/kbps]:   288 / 576
Data Transferred (Sent/Received) [MB/MB]:   8.40 / 126.10
Output Power (Up/Down) [dBm]:   11.5 / 9.0
Line Attenuation (Up/Down) [dB]:   13.0 / 26.0
SN Margin (Up/Down) [dB]:   24.0 / 30.5
Vendor ID (Local/Remote):   TMMB / TSTC
Loss of Framing (Local/Remote):   0 / 0
Loss of Signal (Local/Remote):   92 / 0
Loss of Power (Local/Remote):   0 / 0
Loss of Link (Remote):   0
Error Seconds (Local/Remote):   111 / 0
FEC Errors (Up/Down):   0 / 0
CRC Errors (Up/Down):   0 / 337
HEC Errors (Up/Down):   0 / 22

I called bt anyway same old same old wait 3 days for IP and bRas Profile to change. Strange thing is when I use the kitz Broadband checker i type my postcode with no phone number and this is what i get.

Exchange: Southbank.     BT Code: WRSTHBK
Location: Blackfriars Road,    SE1 8NZ.
   ADSL enabled :    March 30, 2000
   dsl Max enabled:    March 30, 2006
   SDSL enabled :    Enabled
   21CN due :    Phone No Required

Distance:-    Direct:          966 metres
          (appx)*    By Road:    1.77 km
BT Line Speed Estimation    

adsl button    Fixed ADSL:     2048 kbps    (2 Mb)
adsl button    DSL Max :      6000 kbps    (6 Mb)
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: kitz on February 22, 2008, 05:40:22 PM
>> I called bt anyway same old same old wait 3 days for IP and bRas Profile to change

Same old old from BT :/   :wall:
.....  and why I think the frustration in your other thread.

The IP/bRAS profile has nothing what so ever to to do with having an effect on what the maximum speed you will sync at.
The IP profile follows your sync speed - not the other way round.

They really need to send an engineer out to look at your line to see why you are getting such a low connection speed, that isnt in line with the line stats that you are outputting.

>> when I use the kitz Broadband checker i type my postcode with no phone number

Thats an indication of what speeds other users in your immediate vicinity are getting.

>>
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on February 22, 2008, 06:23:08 PM
I have tried requesting an Engineer still trying to stall me by saying check cables and use TEST socket which i have been using for 2weeks to no avail. Luckily I know a BT engineer who would be upto this Challenge and he will do it free soo Screw BT!!  :shoot:
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: kitz on February 22, 2008, 06:52:10 PM
hmmm

If I were you I'd be screaming at BT by now threatning that if they cant help fix my problem then give me a MAC key so I can go to an ISP that at least half understands how the adsl system works  :(
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on February 23, 2008, 12:46:36 AM
By the way i have run the BTw speed test and another on BTw my speed is 499kbps on 500kbps IP Profile and on www.speedtest.net my speed is 502kbps on 500kbps IP Profile are these correct.
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: kitz on February 23, 2008, 01:16:55 AM
Possibly both.

The IP profile is an indication of the Maximum throughput that you will receive.   The Max throughput depends on the amount of overheads carried with your data throughput.  Different speedtesters can estimate the ATM + TCP overheads slightly differently - hence why you will see different speeds on different speedtesters. 

Read this for a bit more info
http://www.kitz.co.uk/adsl/speeds2.htm
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on February 23, 2008, 08:49:26 PM
Ok thanks for that mate really helped  :thumbs: i checked out my speed on speedtest.net it jammed at about 507-512k error or real ?
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: kitz on February 24, 2008, 04:06:50 PM
>> i checked out my speed on speedtest.net it jammed at about 507-512k error or real ?

If your IP profile is set at 500..   possibly anything between about 480 - 510 could be correct..   it just depends on what calculations they allow for overheads.   
I cant find it now - but going from memory iirc  TBB used to say on their site that they made an allowance of 8% for ATM overheads.
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Ezzer on February 25, 2008, 04:57:45 PM
downstream attenuation @ 26db is good. (I'm still curious why you had in the past this figure jumping up to the low 50's before ? :hmm:)

Your on a fixed 0.5mb so an snr of 30.5 is very good (fixed speed dsl the higher the snr the better <9 uh-oh, teens= average. 20's good, 30's very good, 40's hello

the only thing, what time period did you get those errors and are they stable now ? if you got that many in just a few mins then here could be the area to look at.
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: mr_chris on February 25, 2008, 05:16:36 PM
Ezzer, I don't know why your post showed up as a new topic rather than as a reply... but I've merged them together. Very odd!

I agree. Downstream attenuation of 26dB is good.

HOWEVER.... this is still an ADSL Max line which has been identified as so bad that it's gone down to a fixed 512 connection speed.

Broadband1 - a few of us have said to you in your other thread, that the Sync speed is nothing to do with your IP or bRAS profile.

Please don't confuse the two... in fact forget about IP / bRAS profile for the moment, they are totally irrelevant to this problem you're having, so there's no point even talking about them until your sync speed has risen again.

I'll explain it.

Your sync speed... i.e. the speed your router and exchange have decided to connect at, has fallen and now appears to be permanently stuck at 512k (576k).

This is because the system known as "DLM" (dynamic line management) has counted so many errors on your line that it has put emergency measures in place and restricted you to 512k to see if that helps to keep it from re-syncing too frequently.

We never really got to the bottom of whether the line was now stable or not.

If it is now stable, BT needs to reset the DLM settings for your line i.e give it a second chance!
If it is STILL NOT stable, BT needs to send an engineer round to you.

Next time you speak to BT (i don't know how often you ring them to try and get it sorted), don't accept anything related to "bRAS or IP Profiles... waiting x days for the profile to update". Stress that this is the actual SYNC speed that is limited to 512 and has done so after a line fault. They should be able to see that your line is on DSL Max and it isn't just a simple case of re-submitting an order for a DSL Max upgrade!
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Ezzer on February 25, 2008, 06:14:03 PM
I had a download on the pc which caused me to "time out" at about the time I posted, soz my fault.

Otherwise, the inital profile may be max but as the stats show 1/4 meg upstream I was looking at the stats from a fixed speed perspective. Sorry about that, it's just with my backround I never look at what the profile is ment be (Openreach engineers don't get this info on any broadband faults any more :paperbag:. someone should tell Ofcom if everyone was psycic, phones wouldn't have been invented). We just look at what the lines doing at that moment.

Your spot on with with the fobbing off by the isp, all too common unfortunately   
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on February 25, 2008, 10:38:03 PM
Ok now I understand what i need to do. I have to call BT THD and get them to Reset the DLM. But one thing back in the first 2 months of my BT Contract my broadband speed was flying high in the high 6mbps - low 7's. then all of a sudden out of nowhere my HomeHub started re-syching at 1am then i was slowly dropped to 576k :o Anyways ill give BT a buzz in the morning dont think they'll be open at 10:30pm.

PS. My line has been stuck on 26db attenuation and 35.5db SNR Margin for 2weeks now approximately. and I only get errors while I play online on my Xbox360 and download anything over 55MB
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Ezzer on February 25, 2008, 11:03:34 PM
with the errors over that sort of usage i'll say no problem there.

Although are you still getting the loss of sync at 1am or that stable now ?
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: mr_chris on February 26, 2008, 01:53:31 AM
But one thing back in the first 2 months of my BT Contract my broadband speed was flying high in the high 6mbps - low 7's. then all of a sudden out of nowhere my HomeHub started re-syching at 1am then i was slowly dropped to 576k :o

Yeah, because of something causing lots of re-syncs - as I explained in my post earlier on - although where I said "DLM has counted so many errors" - I should have said re-syncs, not errors. My mistake.

Glad to hear your line is now stable at 512k. Let's hope BT actually understand what you're trying to get them to do... and let us know how you get on :)
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on February 27, 2008, 07:36:29 PM
New Update: Rang BT this afternoon absolutely no luck at all  :no: BT refuse to do anthing even just to look at my line stats. Even though the BT Engineer who lives on my street (How lucky) even said that I need them to reset the DLM on my line i'm not sure how to put it but people as intelligent as you guys should know I hope :P.

Right now me and my house-mate are considering switching to Satellite broadband we already have 3 Satellite ISP's jamming their offers down the door.

Another option is Virgin Media now offering Fibre Optic in my Area. Soo looking to get a MAC and say 'Bon Voyage' to BT if you dont know french bon voyage means Good Bye  ;D

By the way what is Output Power all about Eg. Output Power (Up/Down) [dBm]:   11.5 / 9.0
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: NickG on February 27, 2008, 08:17:33 PM
Broadband1
Do you have any dimmer switches in your house? If so, I know it will be annoying, but try not to turn ANY of them on at all for a couple of days and see if you still get disconnects. My father had similar issues to you but after a year or so, he noticed that the problem only seemed to occur when they were using the dining room lights, which were on a wall dimmer.

Have you tried "the orange wire trick"? Ie, disconnecting the orange ring wire from terminal 3 in the master socket? This wire serves no purpose for modern phones, but can act like a giant aerial. When I disconnected mine, my broadband speed increased by about 30%.

Nick...
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on February 28, 2008, 06:54:19 PM
I have just tried that orange wire thing but no luck there isnt a wire in my phone line. all there is, is just a test socket and on white wire leading off into the wall soo sorry mate  :no:
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Ezzer on February 28, 2008, 09:03:18 PM
Just a thought, NickG did state quite rightly the wire in termination3 (the bell wire)

Also this wire isn't required on SOME modern phones in an extention socket to ring during an incomming call.
There are still plenty of modern phones which still rely on the bell wire. If this is disconnected at the master socket then as long as you have a micro filter in an extention that's being used then the phone will still ring as microfilters all seem to have a capacitor within them. Other wise if you revert to using phones without a microfilter you may find you and any answering machine may keep missing calls.

If an one is trying this an find a cable with just an orange and white wire, don't disconnect these wires, that's your incomming phone line
should be on terminations 2 & 5

If you have an NTE5, the one with a seam running across the front where the face plate comes away with a test socket underneath, don't worry these wires will behind the next part of the socket on the a & b terminations)
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on February 28, 2008, 11:24:33 PM
ok soo thats a no can do. I ran a speed test my line shows 513kbps :P off www.speedtest.net . By the way NickyG i don't have any dimmer switches in my house, me and house mate cant be asked to get them :P
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Azzaka on March 03, 2008, 05:16:45 PM
ok soo thats a no can do. I ran a speed test my line shows 513kbps :P off www.speedtest.net . By the way NickyG i don't have any dimmer switches in my house, me and house mate cant be asked to get them :P

Speedtest.net will only run as far as your pc will allow.

You should run the bt speedtester and the thinkbroadband testers for actual speed results. Any tests run by the BT speedtester will sit in the archives for a spell so you can access the information when you call your ISP.

http://speedtester.bt.com/ - no more than once every 3 hours

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest.html

Post the results from these.

Leo
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on March 03, 2008, 10:09:29 PM
Ok i have just run these test and i couldn't use the BT Tester but here are the results from the Think one

Speed Test Results
Date    03/03/08 22:06:24
Speed Down:    482.33 Kbps ( 0.5 Mbps )

Speed Up:   171.02 Kbps ( 0.2 Mbps )
Port    80
Server    speedtest1.adslguide.org.uk
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: kitz on March 04, 2008, 03:28:53 AM
ok soo thats a no can do. I ran a speed test my line shows 513kbps :P off www.speedtest.net .

I'm confused by that statement  ???

I thought it had been established ages ago (http://forum.kitz.co.uk/index.php?topic=1541.msg52807#msg52807) that the reason why you arent getting anymore - nor will you get- speeds much higher than 500 kbps - is because your IP profile is set at 500kbps.

It would appear that there is an intermittent fault on occasions causes your line that causes it to sync in those regions... which is why your speed is continually low. 
Whilst your line has an IPprofile of 500 - then theres no way your throughput speed is ever going to be much above that.
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Ezzer on March 04, 2008, 04:41:44 PM
Definately appears stuck a 0.5mb fixed, a call to your ISP me thinks
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: mr_chris on March 04, 2008, 11:07:37 PM
I thought it had been established ages ago (http://forum.kitz.co.uk/index.php?topic=1541.msg52807#msg52807) that the reason why you arent getting anymore - nor will you get- speeds much higher than 500 kbps - is because your IP profile is set at 500kbps.

Yes. Remember it's gone one stage further, and the line sync has been reduced to 576/288 by the DLM as it's been classed as a bad line.


Broadband1, I think there has been enough messing about here. This is going round in circles, and is starting to waste people's time who have been good enough to spend a lot of time try and help you out.

For everyone's benefit, and for the last time, I will summarise the fault up to now, and then give a detailed explanation of what you need to do.



Summary




Detailed Explanation - Broadband1, please take the time to read this in full

Your line was initially good, as you say, it was originally syncing at around 6-7Mbps.

Due to a fault which I don't know the reason for, which meant your attenuation was fluctuating badly, the DLM has flagged the line as a bad line, and DLM has restricted the sync to a FIXED 576/288 connection.

The original fault may have now been fixed, it may not. I can't say, since I haven't seen any line stats since Feb 22nd. Those stats at the beginning of this post looked promising (30.5dB downstream SNR at 576kbps sync)

So, if the attenuation is now stable (or just varies by 1dB or 2dB at a push), and the SNR does not drop too much during the course of the day, then that's a good start, and indicates that the line may be ok now.

But if it isn't stable, you need to get the ISP to get the line sorted out before you can even begin to think about speed tests.


So, when, AND ONLY WHEN, the line is stable, your next course of action is to try and get your ISP to reset the DLM and put the line back into ADSL Max training.

I will repeat what I said to you ages ago... there is nothing more we can help with on this forum, at least until your sync speed rises to more than 576/288. By all means keep us informed of your progress with BT, but don't keep asking what to do as several of us have told you countless times what you need to say to them.

Here's what I would say to BT in your situation:

"My line sync speed is stuck at a fixed 512k, because my upstream is 288kbps.
"It used to be much higher, but there was a problem with my line which now seems to be ok. However I am now stuck with a 512k fixed speed connection because of the DLM."
"I have been using the master test socket and the line is totally stable, but my sync speed has not increased despite being promised that it would"
"Please will you reset the DLM for my line and put my line back into training mode"

If you get no luck with BT one day, then phone them again the next day... and phone them every day, until you get through to someone who will actually do something for you. Yes I know it's a pain to keep ringing them and getting nowhere, and I agree, you shouldn't have to. But unfortunately you do, if you want your problem sorting out.


But, whether your line is OK now or not, either way, while you are still syncing at 576/288, there is NO POINT WHATSOEVER running a speedtest - at all. I know Azzaka asked you to do one, but he probably hadn't read your previous thread where I, and others, kept telling you that the problem was with the sync speed and that speedtests weren't going to prove anything.

So, you need to keep a watch on the sync speed in your router. Running speedtests is wasting your time. Posting them up here is wasting our time. Please don't post any more speedtests here until your sync speed changes to something higher than 576 downstream or 288 upstream.

When you ring BT, the helpdesk person will probably say to you something about waiting a few days - that is a standard response, but your problem is different. If the helpdesk bod actually does reset DLM and put your line back into training mode, it should take effect that same night, and by the following morning you should be seeing sync speeds of a lot higher than 576.

If it hasn't increased in the morning after restarting your router, you need to ring again, and again until someone does something. Keep stressing that it is not just your IP profile that is low, that your SYNC SPEED is 576 down, 288 up.


Then see how you get on.

But I will say it again... until your sync speed increases, speedtests are TOTALLY USELESS and posting results is a waste of everybody's time, including yours.

If this has come across as a bit harsh, it is purely out of frustration with repeating the same questions and answers over and over again.

The bottom line is, if you actually want to get your line sorted out, you need to contact BT on a daily basis until something happens. If you get no joy after trying for say 10 days EVERY DAY, then you have the option of complaining higher up within BT. But at the moment, you will need to be more persistent with the helpdesk if you are to stand a chance of getting anywhere.
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on March 09, 2008, 04:24:25 PM
Thanks guys i took your advice and heres the responce i recieved (Written as closely as possible)

I have conducted a test on your line and the results indicate a fault. I have escalated this matter to our Line Fault Helpdesk. You can expect a response from them within two working days. Alternatively if you would like an update on your fault or have any further concerns, you may contact them on 0800 7310 8578 (open from 09:00-21:00 hours), quoting the VOL reference number above.

Please bear with us as a line upgrade is already under process and your line speed will be upgraded soon from your exchange. Please check the above mentioned link to get the latest updates regarding Line upgrade.


I think this might be the response I've been after :D
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: roseway on March 09, 2008, 06:41:45 PM
That sounds hopeful. :)
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: kitz on March 09, 2008, 08:02:18 PM
>> I think this might be the response I've been after

Hopefully - Fingers crossed for you :)
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Drefsab on March 10, 2008, 12:05:30 PM
Basically your line is suffering an intermittent fault, when lines become intermittent to a certain extent the BT system will "CAP" the line at what it believes  to be the most stable fixed rate ADSL profile. Your ISP should have been able to check this from the capped circuit report they get.

Doing this can help fix really bad connections but all it does is plaster over the greater problem. I would ask your ISP to check the capping report and have the cap removed so that you can diagnose the problem correctly because as long as your line remains capped you wont really know if you have fixed the issue.
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: mr_chris on March 10, 2008, 04:17:17 PM
That's what we decided ages ago :P

It's taken this much to get his ISP to recognise there is a fault - lets see what happens before we confuse them any more!!
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on March 10, 2008, 04:18:22 PM
BT are taking action now as I called the Faults line for my BroadBand and they're sending an engineer to the Exchange and to my house to sort things out  :thumbs: i might stay on BT if things get sorted out as It would kill me if I had to go through this again, maybe ill take this into consideration, The Cheapest is never ever ever the best  :wall:

Oh one last thing I know many of you guys have spent many a minute  :P helping me so a big thank-you is due

                                                                 :clap2:   !! THANKS !!  :clap2:

And does anyone know where I can buy the legendary DreamCast Console :P
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: mr_chris on March 10, 2008, 04:26:16 PM
Well, your problem is because your ISP, BT Internet, were fobbing you off all the time, instead of realising you actually did have a line fault, and pushing it through to BT Wholesale.

If you were with an ISP with better tech support, they would have pushed it through to BT Wholesale a lot quicker, and this would probably have been sorted weeks ago!!

So I would still consider changing ISPs when your BT contract is up. Just to put your mind at rest, if you move ISPs, it won't affect anything to do with your phone line, or the DLM or anything like that! :)
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Drefsab on March 10, 2008, 04:32:57 PM
Its good that they are going to be looking into it for you, if you do encounter any problems just post and im sure there will be a a lot of good advice offered :)
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on March 10, 2008, 05:17:41 PM
One last question where can i buy a DreamCast game console :D:D
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: The Power on March 10, 2008, 08:46:16 PM
Hi Broadband1,

this is my first post so be easy on me.

I have to agree with Ezzer, you stats look very much like a fixed rate 0.5mb profile. This is strengthed by the fact your downstream SNR is 30db. This is the highest it can/should go and that should only be in the case of a fixed rate line. I would be a little worried about an engineer coming round. Openreach engineers can not and will not test for performance. All they will do is check that you are synced (not bothering with the actual speed) and auth'd, if that is the case you run very close to being charged.

What you need to be is for BT to check your profile on the DSLAM, maybe see if you can push them to remove and re-create you VP? The change in the VP can have been created by BT "capping" the line as suggested by Drefsab. Push BT to go over the DSLAM with a fine tooth comb.

Good Luck

"The Power"
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on March 10, 2008, 09:35:50 PM
I think thats what BT are doing atleast I hope my thoughts a right  :hmm:  they say they are sending an Engineer over to the Exchange and hopefully sort it out so i can play my Football Manager without lagging :D
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: kitz on March 11, 2008, 11:00:38 AM
>>> I have to agree with Ezzer, you stats look very much like a fixed rate 0.5mb profile.

Weve been saying this for well over a month - its been getting BTBroadband to recognise this.

It was first mentioned on the 5th of Feb and weve been going round in circles since then trying to get the ISP to at least do something.


I dont think its BT (your ISP) that has done this.
I strongly suspect you are on Max (why else would there have been a few recorded FEC errors last night) .... and been rate limited by the DLM if your line has been detected as a "cronic flapper" at some point.

.../snip/ ...

What I would do is contact your ISP and tell them:-

~ Your line stats of Attenuation 27dB and SNR Margin of 30.5dB indicate that your line should be capable of the full 8Mb.
~ It is evident that your line is being rate limited at some point to 576Kbps.

You need to stress to the ISP that you suspect it could be some sort of restriction placed by BTw's Dynamic Line Management system that is stopping you attain sync any higher than 576kbps...  and could they please check to see if your account has been incorrectly capped by the BTw system.



Since then there must have been numerous posts clarifying this was the case and telling the OP exactly what to say to BT broadband - such as this one (http://forum.kitz.co.uk/index.php?topic=1464.60) on the 6th of Feb.

It later transpired that the line also had a fault at one point caused by a power surge from EDF  which caused a fluctuating atten figures up to 50dB.
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on March 12, 2008, 07:20:44 PM
Well i recieved a call on my mobile from a BT Tech Desk / Line Faults saying "they have sent an engineer to my exchange to sort things out and i should soon see a difference in BB performance"  hopefully they are right :)
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: kitz on March 12, 2008, 07:43:18 PM
Fingers crossed for you broadband1.   
Although tbh they should be able to request that your line is reset remotely to get rid of the fixed rate profile  ???
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on March 12, 2008, 08:17:05 PM
Well thats BT for you
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: soms on March 12, 2008, 09:23:55 PM
Unfortunately this is how it is with big companies... especially when overseas call centres are involved  ::)
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on March 12, 2008, 10:35:29 PM
I know the prefer cheap labour rather than giving customers the full Enchilada :P
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Drefsab on March 14, 2008, 12:12:47 PM
Did you see any improvement in your service?
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on March 14, 2008, 05:29:52 PM
Well an engineer just came round the same one they sent to the Exchange. Apparently he couldn't find any problems from the Exchange so he reqested my line be remotely reset which was a few days ago. He came today to test my line same old results

Uptime:   0 days, 0:05:33
Modulation:   G.992.1 Annex A
Bandwidth (Up/Down) [kbps/kbps]:   224 / 576
Data Transferred (Sent/Received) [KB/MB]:   409.00 / 121.98
Output Power (Up/Down) [dBm]:   11.0 / 15.5
Line Attenuation (Up/Down) [dB]:   13.5 / 24.5
SN Margin (Up/Down) [dB]:   26.0 / 31.5
Vendor ID (Local/Remote):   TMMB / TSTC
Loss of Framing (Local/Remote):   0 / 0
Loss of Signal (Local/Remote):   125 / 0
Loss of Power (Local/Remote):   0 / 0
Loss of Link (Remote):   0
Error Seconds (Local/Remote):   692 / 0
FEC Errors (Up/Down):   0 / 0
CRC Errors (Up/Down):   0 / 3
HEC Errors (Up/Down):   0 / 0

He said " these stats a really good he couldnt understand why this was happening " and now hes off back to the Exchange to play around with the line

Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: kitz on March 14, 2008, 05:58:01 PM
DOH   :wall: :wall: :wall:

Here we got again..  they still havent done what we said needed doing way back early Feb   :angry:

You need to tell them.

Quote

YOU ARE ON A CAPPED RATE MAX DSL Product

That isnt your Line
Its NOT your IP Profile its Not your bRAS profile.
It CANT be changed by attempting to  reset your IPprofile /bRAS profile.
Its not capped by your ISP
- Its been capped by the Dynamic Line Management system at some point in the past due to your line having been a "Cronic Flapper" when you had the power surge.

Someone needs to pull out BTs Handbook and look up

BT IPStream DSL Max Capped Rate Profile 500

They need to submit an order to BT wholesale to change your product from BT IPSTream Max Capped to BT IPStream Max.



Give the above info to your ISP - do not change any information or the wording.

Dont waffle dont say anything else be firm with the IPStream DSL Capped Rate Product but do stress that failure to comply with your request will result in you requesting your MAC Key without financial penalty so that you can go to an ISP that will understand and be able to undertake such a request.
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on March 14, 2008, 08:26:48 PM
Ill have to contact BT through e-mail as the engineer has messed up my line  :no:
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Ezzer on March 14, 2008, 09:22:45 PM
the main stats you just posted indeed look really good :thumbs:

BUT............

Uptime 5:33 with errored seconds 692 ! (big neon sign of an arrow flashing needed here)

Previous stats showed errors but based on a much longer time, if that was even over that time then no problem. Errors are best reviewed over a shorter space of time. in 5 min's 33 thats a hell of a lot. seems to suggest events occuring in bursts which if you were running on rate adaptive would alert the dlm which explains the throttle back. if thats the case then going back on to rate adaptive will put you back to square one again until this can be cleared.

Treat errors in the same way as SNRM in diagnostics, they can also be caused by equipment problems typicaly the router/modem (excessive heat in the router can cause this as well).

When you get a throttle back situation its like driving along a motorway when you come across what felt like black ice, then you know you can do 70mph, but you dawdle at 20 until you feel confident things are ok and you drive at then drive at typical speeds. If there's still black ice around, you'll have an accident. The system throttles speeds back for a reason, no good in getting it reset if the cause is still lurking.

Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on March 14, 2008, 11:43:22 PM
thats just made me think of the Excessive heat thing my router is next to a radiator thaats on 89% of the time whether I want it or not.
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Ezzer on March 15, 2008, 02:06:55 AM
I've always found hot routers to be troublesome. my general rule of thumb, place your palm on the router, if it's a bit warm- thats normal. If the heat is on the verge of: If it were a cup of tea or coffee at that temperature, could you drink it ? if yes, thats either the problem or a contributry factor. :flamer:

resite the router and monitor those errors (actualy thinking about it, at last a possible explanation of the dramatic change in the downstream attenuation you were getting before :idea:)

Avoid sitting a router on carpet if you can because that can act like an insulator unless you can site the router on it's edge, quite a few routers have feet or stands giving this as an option. Mainly to save desk/shelf space. but also to allow good air circulation. if you don't get those errors mounting up in a short space of time then that may prove the problem and you will be safe to have your service back as a rate adaptive dsl again.
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on March 16, 2008, 07:21:46 PM
I moved it to a slightly more Temprate part of the Living roon aka the Dining Table or in my case The Table :) and no disconnections today.
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Ezzer on March 16, 2008, 09:08:57 PM
Sounds promessing  ;D

Hows the errors ?
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on March 16, 2008, 10:02:13 PM
I'll show you:

Link Information
         
Uptime:   0 days, 2:51:21
Modulation:   G.992.1 Annex A
Bandwidth (Up/Down) [kbps/kbps]:   288 / 576
Data Transferred (Sent/Received) [MB/MB]:   18.29 / 124.42
Output Power (Up/Down) [dBm]:   11.5 / 8.5
Line Attenuation (Up/Down) [dB]:   13.0 / 26.0
SN Margin (Up/Down) [dB]:   25.0 / 30.5
Vendor ID (Local/Remote):   TMMB / TSTC
Loss of Framing (Local/Remote):   0 / 0
Loss of Signal (Local/Remote):   252 / 0
Loss of Power (Local/Remote):   0 / 0
Loss of Link (Remote):   0
Error Seconds (Local/Remote):   1,109 / 0
FEC Errors (Up/Down):   0 / 0
CRC Errors (Up/Down):   0 / 0
HEC Errors (Up/Down):   0 / 0

I called BT about the IPStream Max and apparently my line isn't being capped which I don't think is as true as that guy wants it to be
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: kitz on March 16, 2008, 10:37:27 PM
The problem with saying capped is that BT helpdesk will thing that you mean that they as your ISP is capping you.  Which certainly isnt the case

However this is a specific type of adsl product similar to the old fixed rate product.  Thats why I suggested copying what I typed and it may actually get through to someone.
Its a BTWholesale account type NOT the ISP account.


Its like banging your head against a brick wall

Ive said several times, Ezzer who is a BT Engineer has said.. mr Chris had said..  and about 3 reps from other ISPs have also said.. along with several others along the way.
Several times youve been told what to say to the ISP...

-  yet BT the ISP just dont seem to be getting it.  :no:
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on March 17, 2008, 04:00:16 PM
Ok some more Progress i just got off the phone and BT have put through an order to BTw to switch from IP Stream Max Capped 500k to IP Stream Max and I should call again in case no improvements are made.
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: kitz on March 18, 2008, 04:10:35 AM
 I need a "fingers crossed" smiley.
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Drefsab on March 18, 2008, 02:50:11 PM
I hope this goes well for you, I cant belive they are taking so long to resolve what should be such a simple issue.
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: kitz on March 18, 2008, 04:22:49 PM
me neither - hence why so many of us are getting so frustrated over BTs failure to understand what is going on  :no:
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on March 20, 2008, 11:52:09 PM
After 2days of Heavy Duty Swearing, A broken PSP don't even ask, 3.50 in call fees, 22 cans of Pepsi and 0 showers :vomit: In the end all I got was a MAC Code and i think it's Either SmallWorld Media Cable upto 20Mbps or Virgin Media Cable 20Mbps. To be honest BT should be paying people to give them a crappy service rather than people paying BT hopefully none of you will buy ANYTHING off BT Hopefully  :)
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: kitz on March 21, 2008, 12:46:02 AM
  :( :no: 
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on March 21, 2008, 10:35:54 AM
well a Virgin Engineer Man is coming round on Tuesday to install the Fibre Optic Cabling and stuff 'upto' 20 Megs here i come :D:D

Oh and if you're wondering I was just soo Angry over the phone that the guy just gave me the MAC Code free of charge And who said violence doesn't solve anything  :shoot: :lol: 
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: kitz on March 21, 2008, 01:20:12 PM
btw you wont need a MAC to transfer to Virgin Cable.  Different technology.
Therefore make sure you do a full cancellation of the service with your ISP when you have a date for cable.

Good luck with Virgin :)
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: soms on March 21, 2008, 02:40:22 PM
Its all well and good when your in the half of the population who can receive cable  :no:
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on March 21, 2008, 08:37:56 PM
Thanks  ;D

By the way is it possible to have cable broadband and ADSL in the same house ?
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: soms on March 21, 2008, 08:44:49 PM
Quote
By the way is it possible to have cable broadband and ADSL in the same house ?

Indeed it certainly is.

ADSL requires a BT phone line and cable broadband requires a cable connection, both of which are supplied completely seperately.

I know little about cable since I don't know anyone who has it, but i believe is uses a hybrid coax/copper pairs cable to supply services into the customer premises.

The coax supplies the cable TV and broadband and the copper pair is used to provide a phone line.

All of that then connects onto some kind of a fibre network in the street somewhere. The cable network is fibre to curb, not sure if it is fibre to the premises yet? You mentioned an engineer coming to install fibre?
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on March 22, 2008, 12:42:34 AM
Yup an engineer is coming round maybe Virgin might gimme good speeds but I always wandered how Cable works as I understand how ADSL1/2/2+ works but not Cable I understand how Sattelite works expensive its expensive and has high latency. :P
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: kitz on March 22, 2008, 02:41:14 AM
Yep different technology and possible to have both - hence me saying make sure you cancel rather than using a MAC key (which you cant anyhow).. or you could find yourself landed with 2 bills.

As soms says cable is where you connect to the cable network, rather than it having to go over your telephone wires.. therefore doesnt suffer the kind of problems associated with the copper pair.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cable_modem
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cable_modem_termination_system

Unfortunately though cable services isnt something thats available to a large proportion of the UK, and since cable telecoms mostly  stopped laying new cable in or around 2001ish then its meant that for an awful lot of people they dont have this choice.
I won't bore you with a lecture on that and how once upon a time there used to be quite a few cable cos..  and now how theres only really Virgin (or Smallworld if you're in Scotland)  :(
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on March 30, 2008, 04:47:38 PM
Well as a final report on Vigin Media Cable out of 20Mb I can proudly say I'm recieving approximately 12.3Mb which is aprroximately 25x faster than what i recieved on BT's ADSL which I still use oh and i saw a pretty sharp improvement in speeds on ADSL in 2or 3days speeds shot from 500k to 5500k
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: kitz on March 30, 2008, 09:41:20 PM
>> I can proudly say I'm recieving approximately 12.3Mb

Thats good news :)

With cable though because of the different technology you should perhaps be able to get a bit more than that?
Have you tried doing a speed test during a "quieter part of the day".
I believe VMs speeds can vary depending on time of day and other peoples usage.

However since this is a vast improvement from what you were previously getting I should imagine you are happy :)
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on April 03, 2008, 03:36:24 PM
Of course im happy :D I did a test this morning It showed as 15.8Mbps so thats a speed boost and a bit more :P thanks guys and on the ADSL side i decided to keep BT on as the speed is now at 6.9Mbps which isn't too bad compared to Cable (what am i saying !!)
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: oldfogy on April 03, 2008, 10:21:34 PM
Of course im happy :D I did a test this morning It showed as 15.8Mbps so thats a speed boost and a bit more :P thanks guys and on the ADSL side i decided to keep BT on as the speed is now at 6.9Mbps which isn't too bad compared to Cable (what am i saying !!)

Meh I seen faster, I get almost 17Megs on Virgin Media upto 20Meg Cable Fibre
?
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on April 07, 2008, 10:46:48 AM
Maybe an over exaggeration there Sorry matey  :no:
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on April 07, 2008, 03:15:36 PM
By the way do these line stats look good:

Uptime:   0 days, 0:09:03
Modulation:   G.992.1 Annex A
Bandwidth (Up/Down) [kbps/kbps]:   448 / 8,096
Data Transferred (Sent/Received) [KB/MB]:   439.00 / 2.23
Output Power (Up/Down) [dBm]:   12.0 / 19.5
Line Attenuation (Up/Down) [dB]:   13.0 / 26.0
SN Margin (Up/Down) [dB]:   21.0 / 12.0
Vendor ID (Local/Remote):   TMMB / TSTC
Loss of Framing (Local/Remote):   0 / 0
Loss of Signal (Local/Remote):   96 / 0
Loss of Power (Local/Remote):   0 / 0
Loss of Link (Remote):   0
Error Seconds (Local/Remote):   660 / 0
FEC Errors (Up/Down):   0 / 480
CRC Errors (Up/Down):   0 / 2
HEC Errors (Up/Down):   0 / 2
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: roseway on April 07, 2008, 04:50:29 PM
Yes, they look good. :)
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Broadband1 on April 07, 2008, 05:14:40 PM
My line is getting FEC and CRC errors for fun now :P

And is it normal for my SNR to go down after a sync speed increase ?

And do I need to wait 3days for my IP Profile to catch up to my new Sync Speed.
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: mr_chris on April 22, 2008, 07:06:40 PM
> And is it normal for my SNR to go down after a sync speed increase ?

Yes

> And do I need to wait 3days for my IP Profile to catch up to my new Sync Speed.

Yes, anything up to 5 days
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Jameseh on April 23, 2008, 09:12:07 AM
This might border on being a cunning plan, but I don't think there would be any harm in getting BT to place a modify order on your line to move you to a fixed rate 512Kbps service and then to move you back to the IPStream Max service.

A good ISP would be more than happy to do that for you.
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: mr_chris on April 25, 2008, 09:32:32 AM
It would cost the ISP two lots of 5+VAT of course...

Incidentally, what would/could that achieve... a reset of a stuck BRAS profile?
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Jameseh on April 28, 2008, 02:00:12 PM
Which years pricing are you working on?  ;)

Afaik, modify orders are now done FOC.
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: kitz on April 28, 2008, 05:09:29 PM
Fixed to Max is now free - they dropped that last year to try and encourage ISPs to transfer all their accounts to Max.
AFAIK all other fees still stand including Max to Max Premium

See BT Price list Section 44
Sub part 6.1

eg

Code: [Select]

Re-grade to BT IPstream Home 500 From - Operative Date   Single Payment   Exc VAT
BT IPstream Max Premium
BT IPstream Max
BT IPstream Office Products                   30.06.2006 5.00

Which is (one of)  the supposed reason why some ISPs dont like putting their customers back on a fixed rate product.
The other being the higher port rental fee for fixed rate (91.56 ex VAT) compared to Max (84.12 ex VAT)
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Jameseh on April 28, 2008, 05:35:19 PM
Thing is though fixed to max and vice versa is a modify order now, not a regrade.  Wonder how that factors into the pricing.
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: kitz on April 28, 2008, 10:57:27 PM
Not sure - The way I read it suggested that they were doing.

The price list states

Quote
All the BT IPstream product re-grades shown in the tables below can be initiated using the `Modify' order type.
Title: Re: BT Broadband Continuation
Post by: Jameseh on April 29, 2008, 12:24:43 PM
Ah, good spot.