Looks like something's gone wrong! BT have told us that there is an ongoing cease order for your landline.
The cease date is 19/07/2013. Please check with your telephone provider what the reason is and contact us on 0808 101 3430. Please bear in mind that if our service gets disconnected, we may need to charge you a £25 re-connection fee as we'd need to send a BT engineer to your local telephone exchange.
So hopefully no cease, and its just very misleading info from Be :fingers:
We're sorry to hear that you've changed your mind about your order for BE Broadband.
The other thing you should watch for is the spurious charges of £31.68 (if you were on Pro) which Be will automatically apply to your account when you leave - its an extra month's subs and it gets applied to everyone who leaves AFAIK. Again this is something they have always done (since 2005 anyway) and it has nothing to do with not giving proper notice. ...I think your memory is letting you down a bit here, Rizzla. I looked very carefully into this when I migrated to PN myself. What you call the 'extra month's subs' is for the period from when you give them the required 1 month's notice, and, it is clearly stated in it's T&C's. Of course you can actually leave anytime you want during the month period you have to give them and pay for, so for some, scheduling the move towards the end of the period will maximise the value you get for that. Having said that I did find that I was actually rebated some of the amount I had already prepaid that overlapped with the notice period. So, although I agree that their CS has gone down a rabbit hole somewhere (if, as you say, it ever was as great as some people thought), they didn't defraud me of a penny. Maybe that aspect has changed since your recollections of 2006?
Its fraud IMHO.
Edit - I remember now, its the express cancellation charge which gets applied to everyone, regardless of whether you used it or not. Been a "bug" in their system since 2005. Damn handy moneymaking bug mmmm?
The other thing you should watch for is the spurious charges of £31.68 (if you were on Pro) which Be will automatically apply to your account when you leave - its an extra month's subs and it gets applied to everyone who leaves AFAIK. Again this is something they have always done (since 2005 anyway) and it has nothing to do with not giving proper notice. ...I think your memory is letting you down a bit here, Rizzla. I looked very carefully into this when I migrated to PN myself. What you call the 'extra month's subs' is for the period from when you give them the required 1 month's notice, and, it is clearly stated in it's T&C's
Its fraud IMHO.
Edit - I remember now, its the express cancellation charge which gets applied to everyone, regardless of whether you used it or not. Been a "bug" in their system since 2005. Damn handy moneymaking bug mmmm?
To me it just kind of reeks a bit of we dont care now that youre leaving attitude.
Looks like something's gone wrong! BT have told us that your phone line has ceased.
Really sorry but we've had to suspend your BE service as we need an active BT line for our service to work; you'll need to get your BT line working soon (within 30 days) or we'll have to cancel your service.
Unfortunately your account has already been cancelled and you can no longer access it.
What a bunch of clowns. :(Who though? :-X
specifically ordered HWS, but he had no idea of thisAnything to do with this: http://www.openreach.co.uk/orpg/home/updates/briefings/super-fastfibreaccessbriefings/super-fastfibreaccessbriefingsarticles/nga02412.do ;) ?
D'oh! ::)Yes, B*Kat is correct. DLM will not interven until the NEXT day (assuming sync has been achieved).
As for the number of disconnects/reconnects that have happened today, they are not taken into account. According to the relevant SIN, the DLM will only intervene on the second day following service provision. Bald_Eagle1 will be the person to provide a 'fuller translation'. ;)
but the VDSL socket is nearly 4cm deeper.Yes, ridiculously big and ugly. Who needs it, really?
A competent jobbing builder or handyman should be capable of fitting a recessed backing-box into that wall and by doing so, will reduce the depth of the protuberance.Easier (and cheaper) to remove the SSFP and use a dongle! :-X
Yep. indeed. Quite a lot to do with that... and yes it was submitted by PN to BTw as HWS.
... and Im sorry but Im outa here now... Ive really had enough for today... but I'll leave you with this..
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/1000864_10151560499307734_1143828052_n.jpg)
which was the location of an old LJU1 - if you look closely you can still see what was its center hole slightly to the left.
This is connected by 25m of telephone cable - not CAT5 - to the site where the old NTE was. The drawer opened easily over the LJU, but the VDSL socket is nearly 4cm deeper. Bear this in mind when planning for vdsl.
I still need to tack the modem cable out of the way and put the suspension files back in the drawer.
There was a lot of syncs earlier in the day. I even tried a full reset of the router to factory settings :/
Ok Im online with the Huawei, cant seem to access the interface though
"The server at 192.168.1.1 is taking too long to respond"
Ive set this PC's IP to 192.168.1.100, have I missed anything?
Speedtest is (https://forum.kitz.co.uk/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.speedtest.net%2Fresult%2F2847605809.png&hash=7ef752e91c471a1aee6c48bdcb026c67a153f862), so I may have lost a bit of sync speed.
----
edited to add, cant get online (internet)at all if I use port 2
... and does it always take about 15mins to get ISP internet access after a change of setttings?
Okay Im trying to get some first day stats, before the day is over.
Not sure what Ive done wrong.
I can connect to the Huawei on LAN port 2 direct from my PC if the IP is static set to 192.168.1.100 - Huawei had no DSL at this point.
Now I have the Huawei -> PN router -> PC
Router is plugged in Lan1 of the modem.
Router IP 192.168.1.254
PC IP 192.168.1.100
-----------
I was just about to hit send and I saw your reply.
IP Profile for your line is - 77.43 Mbps
>>> & its LAN2 port provides access to its stats.
Ok Im being thick now.... so I cant access the internet and line stats at the same time :doh: ??? ?
So how do the scripts work if the LAN card on the PC is connected to the TG582n for internet access?
I don't want to sound competitive, but you can use DSLstats with the HG612 - that's the device the program was originally developed for.
Mode VDSL2
Traffic type PTM
DSL synchronization status Up
DSL up time 4758
Line Status
Help
Downstream Upstream
Attainable rate (kbit/s) 101664 35452
SNR margin (dB) 11.8 15.7
Line attenuation (dB) 0 0
Output power (dBmV) 14.3 5.3
Statistics
Help
Path 0
Path 1
Downstream Upstream Downstream Upstream
Line rate (kbit/s) 79999 20000 0 0
CRC errors 0 0 0 0
FEC errors 108 0 0 0
HEC errors 17 0 0 0 To access the internet & stats at the same time from the same PC, an ethernet cable needs to run from the MODEM's LAN2 port to a spare ROUTER port.
btw has anyone else noticed the Huawei runs a heck of a lot hotter than the ECI?What model is it Kitz? Some 2Bs had a problem with insufficient heat sinking. I can't say that I've expeienced any problems with the 3B
The ECI has been on all day and in heat. The Huawei had only been on about 15mins not even connected to DSL and I noticed it was a lot hotter than the ECI.
15 mins to get a gateway with the TG582n is a PITA add on top of that the sync up time, and youre talking 20mins if you have a blimp or want to make any changes. That aint too clever really.Well clearly something is wrong there, as it never takes even a fraction of that time for me. Can you see anything in the TG582n event logs to suggest what the problem might be?; but at first read this sounds more like a PN network issue than anything to do with the TG582n per se. IME it takes 10-20secs for the modem to sync (look at the UA time in the modem stats) and the PPP connection connects within seconds of the VDSL PTM link becoming established. The whole thing is generally up within 30secs.
[I appear to be syncing at the 79,999 kbps (as predicted by BE)Congratulations. From your stats it looks like you are very close to your FTTC cabinet (e.g. perhaps around 100m or so?), and possibly the first (or one of the first) in there.
... and thats with an SNRm of 12dB & Interleaved..... and on the end of 25m of dodgy internal wiring.
Well that was an unexpected turn up for the books. The BT estimate was 62 Mbps :clap:
Link Status: Connecting...
Its a 3B, Ive stood it on its side for now and it seems a lot better than when it was flat.
This is just one thread in the Plusnet forum that mentions the issue:-Of course, thank you BE for reminding me of this. :-[ I was of course referring to the time it normally takes IME, and even then I wasn't including the time for the router (TG582n) itself to boot (which is another minute or so if that is required), but just the time from when the PTM path becomes available. As Kitz had so many disconnects yesterday, she may well have fallen foul of the stale PPP connection. But if it is happening like that in other circumstances then there is definitely something wrong. I did wonder in passing if using a non-PN DNS at that point in the sequence would cause delays, but not of that order, I would hope?
http://community.plus.net/forum/index.php/topic,114808.msg989806.html#msg989806
Bob P mentions a known 8 minutes issue, but I have seen other users' posts here & there that mention up to 15 minutes for their connections.
and whilst I was typing this I lost internet .. It took at least 12 mins to come back up. Lost internet.. not sync.So if the modem itself has not resync'ed (up time=3.7hrs), then it looks like the you are losing the PPP connection (router up time=~3mins) instead for some reason. If so, then perhaps a number of yesterday's problems (e.g. when it was perhaps the PPP connection that dropped out rather than the modem) will not even have been noticed by DLM. Doesn't help much I know, but at least DLM shouldn't (I hope) 'punish' you for it. It also gives evidence supporting why you may be falling foul of the 'stale' PPP connection issue BE has pointed to.
This is what it says in the router interface when it goes downQuoteLink Status: Connecting...
This is my Internet uptime from the TG582n
Uptime: 0 days, 0:02:53
and sync uptime from the HG612
DSL up time 13324 13324 seconds = 3.7 hrs
Yes!
So.... I appear to be syncing at the 79,999 kbps (as predicted by BE)
... and thats with an SNRm of 12dB & Interleaved..... and on the end of 25m of dodgy internal wiring.
Well that was an unexpected turn up for the books. The BT estimate was 62 Mbps :clap:
# xdslcmd info --pbParams
xdslcmd: ADSL driver and PHY status
Status: Showtime
Retrain Reason: 0
Max: Upstream rate = 35667 Kbps, Downstream rate = 101660 Kbps
Path: 0, Upstream rate = 20000 Kbps, Downstream rate = 79999 Kbps
Discovery Phase (Initial) Band Plan
US: (0,95) (880,1195) (1984,2771)
DS: (32,859) (1216,1959) (2792,4083)
Medley Phase (Final) Band Plan
US: (0,95) (880,1195) (1984,2771)
DS: (32,859) (1216,1959) (2792,4083)
VDSL Port Details Upstream Downstream
Attainable Net Data Rate: 35667 kbps 101660 kbps
Actual Aggregate Tx Power: 5.3 dBm 14.3 dBm
============================================================================
VDSL Band Status U0 U1 U2 U3 D1 D2 D3
Line Attenuation(dB): 0.8 17.9 29.2 N/A 11.1 24.5 38.8
Signal Attenuation(dB): 0.9 17.8 29.0 N/A 11.1 24.5 38.8
SNR Margin(dB): 15.8 16.3 15.7 N/A 11.5 12.1 11.8
TX Power(dBm): -4.8 -25.3 4.8 N/A 12.0 7.4 7.2
#
I'm assuming if you don't have an option it's PPPoEoA, this could be the reason why it takes a while to authenticate as it shouldn't try and authenticate at the ATM level.
Never mind forgot you are using it as a router! Though are you trying to authenticate via PPPoE?
Possibly the first PN port?They've had quite a few, some having rather tricky "issues" along the way >:D , but none that I've seen reported at the final stage like this.
>>> What model is it Kitz?
Its a 3B, Ive stood it on its side for now and it seems a lot better than when it was flat.
Earlier yesterday definitely were sync. I was following the instructions on page 10 of the Plusnet troubleshooter booklet. I couldnt get authenticated on to the PN network at all. I worked my way through everything suggested in that booklet including a factory reset of the router. Each time it suggests switching the BT modem off for 30 seconds.That's terrible! :o
a factory reset of the routerThat's the PN equivalent of 'please reinstall Windows' then? :'(
Each time it suggests switching the BT modem off for 30 secondsPlease don't do that from now on. :no: DLM monitors that number of resyncs by examining the recorded up time in each 15 mins time slot. If there was 15 mins up-time in one time slot, and less than 15 mins in the next then it would record that a 'forced (i.e. unsolicited) resync' had occurred. If at least two time slots back-to-back have no up time, it will (should :-X) determine that this was a solicited resync e.g. following the EU powering down the line, and ignore it for the purposes of determining instability.
>>> What model is it Kitz?
Its a 3B, Ive stood it on its side for now and it seems a lot better than when it was flat.
Perhaps you could do a 'Blue Peter' and make a stand (out of the base of a washing-up liquid bottle) to hold it vertical? The best cooling occurs when the long edge is the uppermost horizontal, meaning that the cables exit from the bottom.
>>> It may be interesting to see your --pbParams dataCode: [Select]# xdslcmd info --pbParams
xdslcmd: ADSL driver and PHY status
Status: Showtime
Retrain Reason: 0
Max: Upstream rate = 35667 Kbps, Downstream rate = 101660 Kbps
Path: 0, Upstream rate = 20000 Kbps, Downstream rate = 79999 Kbps
Discovery Phase (Initial) Band Plan
US: (0,95) (880,1195) (1984,2771)
DS: (32,859) (1216,1959) (2792,4083)
Medley Phase (Final) Band Plan
US: (0,95) (880,1195) (1984,2771)
DS: (32,859) (1216,1959) (2792,4083)
VDSL Port Details Upstream Downstream
Attainable Net Data Rate: 35667 kbps 101660 kbps
Actual Aggregate Tx Power: 5.3 dBm 14.3 dBm
============================================================================
VDSL Band Status U0 U1 U2 U3 D1 D2 D3
Line Attenuation(dB): 0.8 17.9 29.2 N/A 11.1 24.5 38.8
Signal Attenuation(dB): 0.9 17.8 29.0 N/A 11.1 24.5 38.8
SNR Margin(dB): 15.8 16.3 15.7 N/A 11.5 12.1 11.8
TX Power(dBm): -4.8 -25.3 4.8 N/A 12.0 7.4 7.2
#
Retrain Reason: 0
Max: Upstream rate = 9502 Kbps, Downstream rate = 46048 Kbps
Path: 0, Upstream rate = 10641 Kbps, Downstream rate = 47007 Kbps
Discovery Phase (Initial) Band Plan
US: (0,95) (880,1195) (1984,2771)
DS: (32,859) (1216,1959) (2792,4083)
Medley Phase (Final) Band Plan
US: (0,95) (880,1195) (1984,2771)
DS: (32,859) (1216,1959) (2792,4083)
VDSL Port Details Upstream Downstream
Attainable Net Data Rate: 9502 kbps 46048 kbps
Actual Aggregate Tx Power: 6.9 dBm 11.0 dBm
============================================================================
VDSL Band Status U0 U1 U2 U3 D1 D2 D3
Line Attenuation(dB): 2.2 32.8 50.6 N/A 16.1 42.4 66.5
Signal Attenuation(dB): 2.2 32.7 50.2 N/A 16.1 42.4 66.5
SNR Margin(dB): 5.5 5.4 5.0 N/A 5.6 5.6 5.6
TX Power(dBm): -3.6 -9.0 6.4 N/A 8.6 7.4 -4.2
Is that yours BE? :( :'(
That's terrible! :o
That's the PN equivalent of 'please reinstall Windows' then? :'(QuoteEach time it suggests switching the BT modem off for 30 secondsPlease don't do that from now on. :no:
DLM monitors that number of resyncs by examining the recorded up time in each 15 mins time slot. If there was 15 mins up-time in one time slot, and less than 15 mins in the next then it would record that a 'forced (i.e. unsolicited) resync' had occurred. If at least two time slots back-to-back have no up time, it will (should :-X) determine that this was a solicited resync e.g. following the EU powering down the line, and ignore it for the purposes of determining instability.
I know that Asbo has proved on another thread that (becuase of 'last gasp' communications between the modem and the DSLAM - at least the Huawei ones!) that powering it down prevents line-errors being recorded, which you would otherwise get if you just unplugged it from the line (either at the modem or NTE), which DLM would frown on.
At the other end of the spectrum from that which you are currently experiencing with your PN PPPoE, quite often (becuase the TG firmware has the wrong PPP timeouts set by PN) a modem resync will not be detected by PN's RADIUS servers, as it happens too quickly within the PPP timeout - But DLM has seen it (rather like the garden shed in Bill & Ben)!!!!! :lol:
Is that yours BE? :( :'(
No I believe that is a service based in Ewhurst, which has received the attention of an Eagle-eye. ;)
Is that yours BE? :( :'(
One thing I notice is the Tx power seems low compared to mine. Im a novice when it comes vdsl, so dont know what the normal parameters are for FTTC, but certainly on adsl you'd expect a specific range.
Has anyone done a study on average Tx power on vdsl.... this probably would have been something I would have done in the past days when I had more time (ok I did because back in 2003 I never understood why mine was low compared to everyone else's - which lead me to the discovery of power cut back & PSD masks)
Retrain Reason: 2
Max: Upstream rate = 4282 Kbps, Downstream rate = 19336 Kbps
Path: 0, Upstream rate = 4333 Kbps, Downstream rate = 19023 Kbps
Discovery Phase (Initial) Band Plan
US: (0,95) (868,1207) (1972,2783)
DS: (32,859) (1216,1963) (2792,3959)
Medley Phase (Final) Band Plan
US: (0,95) (868,1207)
DS: (32,859)
VDSL Port Details Upstream Downstream
Attainable Net Data Rate: 4282 kbps 19336 kbps
Actual Aggregate Tx Power: 6.2 dBm 11.3 dBm
============================================================================
VDSL Band Status U0 U1 U2 U3 D1 D2 D3
Line Attenuation(dB): 8.3 56.1 N/A N/A 22.2 65.7 0.1
Signal Attenuation(dB): 8.3 55.6 N/A N/A 22.2 N/A N/A
SNR Margin(dB): 5.9 6.1 N/A N/A 6.3 N/A N/A
TX Power(dBm): -4.2 5.8 N/A N/A 11.3 N/A N/A
Secondly quality of copper is going to make a difference, a lot of this will depend on the age of your estate. Over the years BT have used various gauge copper 0.5mm and 0.3mm as well as copper coated aluminium. With vdsl obviously the chunk of E side has been eliminated, and D side is going to be a lot dependant on when BT first put the lines to an estate in.
Although this estate is newish, its fed from a much older DP which definitely uses 05.mm gauge from the cab. The cab Im actually connected to is probably one of the first installed in this town and the DPs put in during an era when the price of copper wasnt such of a concern as it has been over about the past 20 yrs. No idea what gauge is used on the UG feed for the estate, but since Im near the beginning its a relatively short length to the JBF Im on, compared to the overall distance anyhow.
I moved into this estate shortly before adsl became available, back in the days when no-one ever thought of things like attenuation and loop length. Although I am very close to the exchange because this estate is fed via an old cab and DP the loop length is relatively long and literally does go all round the houses .. but even so Ive always been able to exceed estimations and at once upon a time I had a rock steady full 24Mbps down 2.6 Mbps up with Be*.... well until more recently that is.
I think with vdsl its going to be a bit more difficult to estimate speeds as accurately as we could with adsl2+ because so much more is dependant on the type of copper used by BT locally.
Is that yours BE? :( :'(
No I believe that is a service based in Ewhurst, which has received the attention of an Eagle-eye. ;)
Is that yours BE? :( :'(
No I believe that is a service based in Ewhurst, which has received the attention of an Eagle-eye. ;)
It is indeed very similar to an Ewhurst connection, but it's actually someone else's.
He too can't get to the bottom of why it's so poor.
There is a school of thought that VDSL2 output power is decreased for cabinets a long way from the exchange - to avoid swamping the already weak ADSL signals that have travelled all the way from the exchange.
e.g. my cabinet is around 4.4km from the exchange, so ADSL signals won't be too strong at all by the time they reach the cabinet.
At the additional 1000m or so to my home from the cabinet, I could only achieve 1 Mbps on ADSL (on a good day).
FWIW, see the attached graph for how power in the 2nd DS band (D2) has deteriorated on my connection since Christmas.
It's been a big fat zero since DLM was reset/re-calculated 13th July.
Now, whether that's the result of lower sync speed or the lower sync speed is a result of reduced power, I just don't know.
Neither did the visiting engineer.
There is a school of thought that VDSL2 output power is decreased for cabinets a long way from the exchange - to avoid swamping the already weak ADSL signals that have travelled all the way from the exchange.
That very same 'school of thought', was told to myself and others, on a recent course I attended.
That very same 'school of thought', was told to myself and others, on a recent course I attended.
Sorry BS, I didnt see your post when I started typing my reply, do you have any further info on this ie such as how many profiles and distances?
or was it just as we are doing here and pointing out the obvious as to yes it makes perfect sense that there would likely be vdsl specific power profiles to protect the very long lines.
----
However, Ive still no idea why BE's line would suddenly be reduced for no apparent reason ???
Yes, it was basically 'chit chat' from our trainer. I personally wasn't aware of this, but he said the power back-off was related to the ANFP, especially on long distance Cabs. He also commented that he knew of instances of this, whereby the synch speed at the Cab would be less than the 40/80Meg one may expect. I haven't ever experienced this situation, and my patch is semi-rural/semi-urban.
Perhaps on some of the extreme rural routes, Wales, Highlands of Scotland, Lake District/Peak District etc, this may occur ??
Is 4 km classed as long distance?
BTW
I noticed yesterday that the DLM seemed to turn interleaving off, it may or may not be a co-incidence, but looking back on DSLstats, it possibly occurred some time around the drop in PPP session, as Ive not had any recorded FECs since then.
Secondly Ive also just noticed that my intermittent EMI/REIN/upstream line fault appears to be back :'( Ive taken that back to the other thread (http://forum.kitz.co.uk/index.php/topic,12660.msg240187.html#msg240187).
ath 1
Downstream Upstream Downstream Upstream
Line rate (kbit/s) 79999 20000 0 0
CRC errors 0 0 0 0
FEC errors 108 0 0 0
HEC errors 17 0 0 0
Was Interleaving ever on, Kitz ?? I've just viewed your 'Service Profile History' and there is only one 'event' logged since the connection was made live. That is 128K-80M with interleaving switched off on both US and DS ??
>> Was Interleaving ever on, Kitz
On the first day it was according to the first set of stats I pulledCode: [Select]ath 1
Downstream Upstream Downstream Upstream
Line rate (kbit/s) 79999 20000 0 0
CRC errors 0 0 0 0
FEC errors 108 0 0 0
HEC errors 17 0 0 0
Ive not had any on Sat or today though, but saying that Ive been switched off since about.. umm 5.30ish?
Just to add... this morning the 585v7 was showing:
DSL Type G.992.5 Annex M US 56
Maximum Bandwidth (Up/Down) (kbps/kbps) 1,988 / 22,700
Bandwidth (Up/Down) (kbps/kbps) 1,995 / 19,915
So that suggests the line had Annex M after the switchover this morning and when using the 585v7, but not the Belkin N1 Vision... :no:
DSL Type: G.992.5 Annex M US 56
Maximum Bandwidth (Up/Down) [kbps/kbps]: 2,004 / 22,704
Bandwidth (Up/Down) [kbps/kbps]: 2,011 / 19,919
>Internet_PPP
Type: PPPoA
Uptime: 0 days, 0:03:30
IP Address: *my new PN ip address*
Data Transferred (Sent/Received) [B/kB]: 702 / 5.26
--------------
> Internet
Type: ETHoA
Uptime: 0 days, 0:03:35
IP Address: *my old BE ip address*
Data Transferred (Sent/Received) [kB/B]: 11.01 / 0