Kitz Forum
Broadband Related => Broadband Hardware => Topic started by: shape on December 19, 2007, 09:59:16 PM
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Hi all ;)
Just managed to firmware unlock my speedtouch 585 v6 from Tiscali which arrived today. 8) only took me 2 hours, lol.
I have been informed a lift and shift has been completed by wholesale. ;D
I have just managed to get DMT working.
I have selected a 24hr noise monitor on DMT tool.
Would it be possible to post that here, and have someone run there eye over it for me pretty please?
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Yes, you can certainly do that, and we'll be pleased to have a look at it.
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;D
Many thanks
will post stats morrow
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Hi,
sorry to be a pain, when test is complete how do i get the graphs in here?
Cheers peeps ;)
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First you will need to take a Screen-shot" of the graph, then using something like Photobucket you can post it on here for people to see, this is also a free service.
The program I usually use to take the actual screen shot is called: "Screen-Hunter" which is also a free program, available from:
http://www.wisdom-soft.com/
http://s92.photobucket.com
You will need to register with Photobucket who do also "occasionally" send out emails, but nothing to be bothered with with regarding receiving Spam or Junk mail.
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Unless the screenshot is very large, you don't need to host it somewhere like Photobucket, you can just include it as an attachment to your message. See the link "Additional options & file attachments" under the box where you type your new message.
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Can you press PrintScreen on the keyboard and then copy and paste into Paint and then attach to your post ?
I think I did that once on another forum but it was a bit small.
p.s. How do you search for your posts on here using your username ? I've gone into search and can't get it to work.
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Can you press PrintScreen on the keyboard and then copy and paste into Paint and then attach to your post ?
Yes you can, but it can be a bit fiddly then having to crop out any unwanted areas, whereas "ScreenHunter" will allow you to do this at the same time.
I'm not sure if this is what you want, but:
If you click your username it will take you to your profile, from there scroll down to the bottom of the screen, there you will find:
Additional Information:
Show the last posts of this person.
Show general statistics for this member.
If you select "Show the last posts of this person" it will produce a list of all or most of your own posts.
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I imagine that PrintScreen captures the whole screen, doesn't it? Better to use a proper screenshot program.
I believe that the search function requires you to give it some text to search for, so you can't just look for every message you've posted.
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Thanks for info.
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Hey thanks for all the advice, learnt something new again :-)
I'm wel happy with the speedtouch kept sync for DSL-Link Uptime : 1 day, 12:21:37.
The homehub kept resyncing forcing my ip profile down to 135kbps.
So things are looking up. ;)
Tea time was a paticular problem for me, but it held steady.
http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh137/shape_04/test.gif
Could just do with the exchange telling my router to resync to a higher sync speed, and lower noise db.
Test1 comprises of two tests
1. Best Effort Test: -provides background information.
IP profile for your line is - 500 kbps
DSL connection rate: 448 kbps(UP-STREAM) 1088 kbps(DOWN-STREAM)
Actual IP throughput achieved during the test was - 437 kbps
2. Assured Rate Test: -provides background information.
Assured Rate IP profile on your line is - 500 kbps
Actual IP throughput achieved during the test was - 497 kbps
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SNR 22.5??? That's ridiculously high! Where is the target SNR slider set in the modem options tab? You should be able to get so much more out of that line by getting your target SNR reset by your ISP. However some ISPs are a bit more clued up than others when it comes to requesting this from BT wholesale.
Ps Re screenshot - you can press Alt + PrintScreen and it will take a snapshot of the active window only.
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I think BT will sometimes see a line where the customer has had a few problems and instead of taking the time to find out why there have been problems they look for the easy solution. In my case I reported a few problems and the day before a broadband engineer came to visit the noise margin was raised to 15db (info found on my ISP stats page) whereas in the past it had been 6db.
When they came out in the morning when my line is usually at it's best anyway, they checked the BT network and then the guy plugged in his laptop to my master socket and got a connection.
Result "oh at the moment everything is fine sir, a bill will be sent to your ISP,goodbye have a nice day". :no:
If you can lower the noise margin a little with DMT ( and it stays down ) some have said it can creep back up if BT have set it high on purpose, or your ISP has the ability to get BT to lower it then perhaps a reasonable sync speed is eventually achieved.
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The slider is just in the default position.
Shall I just try a DSL resync, this would make the router reset at the default noise db?
Cheers.
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"I imagine that PrintScreen captures the whole screen, doesn't it? Better to use a proper screenshot program."
Hold down the Alt key, then hit PrintScrn will capture only the active window, not the whole screen.
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Yeah, and then look at it straight away after re-syncing... this will tell you what your actual target SNR is set at. Probably 15dB, given all the problems you've been having.
With that attenuation and SNR at 1Mb, I'd reckon 5-6Mb is what you could be getting if your SNR was lower! This is what frustrated me so much about BT's DLM - I ended up syncing at about 4Mb on PlusNet, because DLM for my line seemed to be ultra-sensitive... I think I rebooted 3 or 4 times within an hour once, and that was it.. my SNR was up from its default (and stable) 6dB and bye bye 8Mb.
Now I'm on Be and syncing around 9Mb, sometimes up to 9.8Mb, but it generally holds stable at 9Mb. Currently been connected at 9,026kbps for nearly 8 days solid - not bad IMO on a line for which I was initially told I could only get 512k and 1Mb was unavailable!! :lol:
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"I imagine that PrintScreen captures the whole screen, doesn't it? Better to use a proper screenshot program."
Hold down the Alt key, then hit PrintScrn will capture only the active window, not the whole screen.
I already beat you to it, 3 posts above yours! heh ;)
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"I imagine that PrintScreen captures the whole screen, doesn't it? Better to use a proper screenshot program."
Hold down the Alt key, then hit PrintScrn will capture only the active window, not the whole screen.
I already beat you to it, 3 posts above yours! heh ;)
Okay, Okay..............my poor wee fingers are frozen stiff today, can't type quickly enough :no:
Teach me to read the whole thing properly, won't it ? :-[
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Hi,
thanks did a DSL resync, not as high as we thought, but maybe due to the history of problems.
http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh137/shape_04/steve.jpg
Test1 comprises of two tests
1. Best Effort Test: -provides background information.
IP profile for your line is - 500 kbps
DSL connection rate: 448 kbps(UP-STREAM) 3840 kbps(DOWN-STREAM)
Actual IP throughput achieved during the test was - 416 kbps
2. Assured Rate Test: -provides background information.
Assured Rate IP profile on your line is - 500 kbps
Actual IP throughput achieved during the test was - 741 kbps
seems default noise on my line is 9db.
Maybe it will sync higher after some stability?
Cheers peeps ;D
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"This is what frustrated me so much about BT's DLM - I ended up syncing at about 4Mb on PlusNet, because DLM for my line seemed to be ultra-sensitive... I think I rebooted 3 or 4 times within an hour once, and that was it.. my SNR was up from its default (and stable) 6dB and bye bye 8Mb".
I have been told that you can reboot up to ten times an hour before it affects your profile. If I reboot 3 times in an hour my profile goes right down.It's as if the exchange is waiting for any excuse to lower the profile and cut your speed. I just think it's a very poorly thought out system which BT use without any thought for their customers.
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The slider is just in the default position.
Shall I just try a DSL resync, this would make the router reset at the default noise db?
Cheers.
I'm never sure if I should press DSL Resync or the Apply/Resync button or if it makes any difference.
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Yes it would be nice to read up on all the settings,
PPP
gainQ2
bitwap
etc
Unless we learn german I think we are stuck, lol.
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Please take a look at this 2 hour test i repeated tonight.
The noise decreased from 9db, but I expect it to go back up to 9db tomorrow morning.
Also I noticed the errors have shot up.
I'm suprised I never lost sync to be honest.
What's your thoughts?
http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh137/shape_04/test3.jpg
Link Information
Uptime: 0 days, 5:33:53
Modulation: G.992.1 Annex A
Bandwidth (Up/Down) [kbps/kbps]: 448 / 3,840
Data Transferred (Sent/Received) [MB/MB]: 8.46 / 86.59
Output Power (Up/Down) [dBm]: 12.0 / 19.5
Line Attenuation (Up/Down) [dB]: 20.5 / 39.0
SN Margin (Up/Down) [dB]: 22.0 / 6.0
Vendor ID (Local/Remote): TMMB / µ
Loss of Framing (Local/Remote): 0 / 0
Loss of Signal (Local/Remote): 0 / 0
Loss of Power (Local/Remote): 0 / 0
Loss of Link (Remote): 0
Error Seconds (Local/Remote): 1,933 / 0
FEC Errors (Up/Down): 2 / 17,829,430
CRC Errors (Up/Down): 0 / 28,893
HEC Errors (Up/Down): 0 / 26,707
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You seem to have a rather noisy line, which would account for the errors and the rather low downstream sync frequency. If you haven't already done so, have a read of http://www.kitz.co.uk/adsl/lowSNR.htm .
By the way, although the figure for FEC errors looks very high, it's not really anything to worry about. FEC errors are errors which are autocorrected on connections which have interleaving turned on, as yours appears to. I also get a high level of FEC errors, but my line is very stable with a current uptime of 65 days.
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Hi Shape,
Glad to see that you managed to use Photobucket, however, just a suggestion in case you are not aware.
With the various options from Photobucket, one of the other options that you can/could select would actually display your info on this page instead of just inserting the link to it.
Unfortunately I can't remember exactly which one of the 3 options it is, although you know the one you are currently using, you could try one "or both" of the other options then select preview to see which is the right one.
What I would probably suggest is to open Wordpad first, then copy and paste all 3 options from Photobucket into that which makes it easier than keep going back and forth.
As I said, just a suggestion, hope you don't mind.
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Thank you both kindly for the replies.
Thanks oldfogey, i'm just trying to insert the recent one here, (forgive me if i mess it up 1st time) Sadly for me it lost the ghost again at 6.00 p.m.
So the lift and shift never helped, although the speedtouch has faired better than any other router.
Kitz, I have no internal wiring.
I have had installed a new drop wire, the engineer kindly even installed one of them NTE5 adsl faceplate, so no need for micro filters.
He also fitted a RF3 filter too.
I'm clagged straight into that.
I know it's only broadband, but i'm proper gutted, I thought I had this sorted. :(
Seems I have a problem between 3.30 to 6.00 p.m
There is nothing left to do now :no:
Thank you for taking the time to help and offer advice ;D
Much appreciated.
Regards Steve.
[attachment deleted by admin]
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1. i'm just trying to insert the recent one here, (forgive me if i mess it up 1st time)
2. Seems I have a problem between 3.30 to 6.00 p.m
3. There is nothing left to do now :no:
1. We all have to learn at some time, and I'm quite sure the people here don't mind, and as you can now see, it does work ok.
2. (3.30 to 6.00 p.m) ? I wonder if you are hitting some sort of "Throttling" as this is pretty close to peak times?
3. Don't give up, the people here are a good knowledgeable bunch and I'm sure with a little perseverance you will get it sorted eventually. (Sorry It's not my field of knowledge so I can't help with it)
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Thanks ;D
I'll try and persevere, been like this since 6/10/07.
There is a pattern though, look at noise rising right up now, and errors dropped.
test 3 compared to test 4.
Can we break the cycle???
I seem to have a 3/ 4 hour noise nightmare, then it rises out of all context.
[attachment deleted by admin]
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You now have a very high noise margin, and if you were to resync when it was like that you would get a much higher connection speed. That's more like your line ought to be, with an attenuation of 40 dB.
It looks as though there is some large source of interference affecting your line earlier in the day. Almost any electrical appliance could be causing this, but the large effect it's having suggests something pretty big. You don't have a factory next door I suppose? :) Or does someone in your household operate some kind of machinery at that time?
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Hmm,
No I live no where near a factory, nor do I have any large electrical appilances on, In fact i've tried this with only the router turned on and laptop on battery power.
But that is a massive noise fluctuation.
Thanks for reply. ;)
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I" have had installed a new drop wire, the engineer kindly even installed one of them NTE5 adsl faceplate, so no need for micro filters.
He also fitted a RF3 filter too".
I have also been trying different things since I started having problems on my line earlier in the year. I bought a 2wire as they have a good reputation on long lines, not sure if they help with interference on the line of course. I also bought a couple of filters from a US company which I intended using to see if they would help as I have electric fences nearby. Haven't had a proper chance to try them yet.
I'm using the Speedtouch so I can use DMT but I intend to go back to the 2wire when
I can.
What does the RF3 filter do ?
Is it fitted by BT at the exchange or in the house ?
Can you buy one yourself and fit to your master socket in the house ?
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Hi,
The RF3 filter is meant to filter out REIN I believe, mostly caused by A.M radio stations.
Not a hundred percent, but think thats what I was told by engineer.
I can't understand how my line has a 9db noise all day long till around 3.30p.m, then drops all the way down till a resync at 6.00p.m.
Then it resyncs at 9db again then creeps all the way upto 19db at minute, bet its even higher in morning.
I don't think the noise is outside on my drop wire.
But then again i'm convinced its not in here.
Bizarre.
Electrical fences, that sounds nasty, but then you will not be the only one affected by that?
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I read that some people put their radio on AM and set it around 600-620khz but not on an actual station and then walk around the house listening for any interference. I did that and heard a click every second and was told by another poster it might be electric fences,and that was before I mentioned I had electric fences nearby.They then asked if I had pigs nearby to which I replied "yes I do" and they said that electric fences for pigs can cause problems.
At least with forums like this you can learn and try different things. You hope that something might work and it's certainly better than expecting BT to come to your aid, although to be fair I suppose some people do get reasonable help from them.
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I'll dig out an old AM radio, and try that.
Yes your right I have learnt quite a bit having this problem.
I can't fault BT really.
They did a new drop wire and socket.
An E-side pair swop.
A lift and shift.
Supplied 2 hubs and a voyager 2091.
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Hi,
Please don't laugh but is AM the same as medium wave?
I tuned to 600khz to 620 khz on MW and get some foreign talking show.
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AM isn't the same as medium wave, but medium wave transmissions are all AM (amplitude modulated). Medium wave and long wave are two bands of frequencies used for AM radio channels.
In fact the "xxxx wave" terminology is rather old fashioned, and we mainly talk about frequencies rather than wavelengths these days. The spectrum looks like this, in order of increasing frequency:
Very low frequency (VLF) - Used for various special purposes
Low frequency (LF, also known as long wave) - Used for AM radio
Medium frequency (MF, also known as medium wave) - Used for AM radio
High frequency (HF, also known as short wave) - Numerous purposes including ham radio
Very high frequency (VHF) - Used for FM radio, and also for taxi and police communications, etc.
Ultra high frequency (UHF) - Used for terrestrial television
Microwave frequency - Used for satellite communication (and of course, microwave ovens)
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Thank you kindly for the reply, this is a game of learning more and more each day.
;D
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Hi all ;)
Just managed to firmware unlock my speedtouch 585 v6 from Tiscali which arrived today. 8) only took me 2 hours, lol.
Hi,
How did you 'firmware unlock' it ... did you flash it with the newest firmware from the Thompson site ... if so how ?
I find the Speedtouch support site quite a bit behind Netgear in every respect ... I'm looking here : http://www.thomson-broadband.co.uk/codepages/content3.asp?c=7&ProductID=511 but the documentation links take you into space as far as I'm concerned, with references to 7.4, 7.2, ..... I can only see 6.2 as the latest firmware. ... and how to do it ... there's no guide that I can see. ??? ??? ???
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With regards to using a radio to pick up interference I tried it earlier on and was suprised how a radio stored in my cupboard and seldom used could be used in such a way. I got a lot of noise in close proximity to DC power blocks and such like.
I also recalled that on a butt phone, in monitor mode you could faintly hear what sounded like radio - AM radio I am guessing which is picked up on the lines operating frequency?
I then unplugged the phone in monitor mode and took the plug around the DC adaptors and LCD screen and it clearly picked up noise as well, though very quiet as I guess it is not being amplified like in a radio, unless the phone offers voice amplification.
Apologies for going off topic, I was just a little excited to have tried something new!
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I was just a little excited to have tried something new!
Whatever floats your boat, soms. We're all delighted for you! ;)
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I was just a little excited to have tried something new!
Whatever floats your boat, soms. We're all delighted for you! ;)
I don't get out quite as much as i'd like to really ::)
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:D
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btw, in reply to farmergiles...
What does the RF3 filter do ?
Is it fitted by BT at the exchange or in the house ?
Can you buy one yourself and fit to your master socket in the house ?
An RF3 filter is a radio frequency filter designed to block certain frequencies (mainly EMI?) from continuing on the telephone line. Exactly what is filtered I am not sure.
It is simply an in-line internal BT connection block housing with a PCB with a set of screw terminals for the "incoming" line and a set of krone terminals for the cable run to the master socket.
As you might have guessed from above it is an inline filter fitted by BT to the line side of the master socket.
It is commonly installed where the drop wire is joined to internal cable (where there is such a joint) or if retro-fitted it is often installed above/below/beside the NTE5 with the drop wire re-routed into the RF3 block and then a short link put in to the master socket.
It is not an item you can buy yourself, except say for the odd item which ends up on eBay. You technically shouldn't tamper with anything line-side though.
The only RF filters sold by BT is a plug-in double outlet one which is not very attractive and useless for hardwired/master filtered ADSL installations.
For those who think such a unit would help it would be best to ask the engineer nicely if/when you have a fault. They don't take very long to put in and can only improve the line. The RF3 is fully compatible with ADSL, redcare etc.
If you see an RF2 filter for sale etc do NOT get it as RF2's will block ADSL frequencies.
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[q]An RF3 filter is a radio frequency filter designed to block certain frequencies (mainly EMI?)[/q]
EMI is not a frequency or band of them. It stands for Electro Magnetic Interference. Any frequency can be interference in the right (wrong?) situation.
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[q]An RF3 filter is a radio frequency filter designed to block certain frequencies (mainly EMI?)[/q]
EMI is not a frequency or band of them. It stands for Electro Magnetic Interference. Any frequency can be interference in the right (wrong?) situation.
Thanks for clarifying that a bit. I get a little confused because both seem to effect ADSL and i have never been taught properly about frequencies etc :)
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Hi,
sorry to revive an old thread but i thought it most relevant here.
I have been running the tool routerstats, seeing a noise spike around the same time every night.
Tonight after talking to my neighbour last night, we went to his and turned on his tv, sky and router, his normal routine when he gets in with his son around six.
Nothing, after a bit i returned home, and saw a noise spike forcing a resync of my router.
I popped back around to discover he had just turned on his kitchen and utility room lights, also his normal routine of letting his dogs out.
We tried replicating this to no avail.
We are going to try again thursday, as i'm at work morrow night.
I may of found the source of REIN, he explained his kitchen lights where always blowing the bulbs.
Fingers crossed, he is as keen as me, as he explained his BB was poor, but he had give up with indian customer support.
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No need to apologise; this is really interesting. If you can get a reproducible result that would be great.
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Not sure whether to post here or start a new thread on REIN .... but .... how does REIN get transmitted and what does it affect ?
Does it get transmitted through the air or through electrical wiring or through telephone cables ?
Does it get transmitted through the air and affect the modem, or through the air and affect the adsl signal on the telephone line.
I presume it can't get transmitted down a neighbours telephone line as surely this would go back to exchange without transferring across to neighbouring properties ?
So in the case above, if it was something in the neighbour's house ..... how would it get across to affect shape's house ?
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REIN<
Somewhere, when i look better there is some excellent explanations on this great site. (edit to follow)
I'm not sure where I mentioned that the last openreach engineer to visit explained to me where loads of customers where losing there adsl.
It turned out to be some blokes sky box, which has the telephone lead plugged in. (if you have/had sky you'll know what i mean)
The sky box was making so much noise and transmitting down his phone line, and affecting other ADSL customers, knocking there service off.
So i suppose it can go down the phone line affecting other people.
It can be transmitted across the airwaves and induced into phone lines.
I think in my case his lights are producing a huge electro magnetic pulse, which my router, or cable from my router to BT master socket is picking up.
In fact if i remember correctly one coil can induce a electrical current into another via electrical magnetic force.
I'm excited to say the least, which I suppose is sad really, but after four months, lol.
Roseway, thanks for being interested :-)