Kitz Forum

Computer Software => Windows Vista => Topic started by: paul-49 on December 02, 2007, 07:40:54 AM

Title: Vista or xp
Post by: paul-49 on December 02, 2007, 07:40:54 AM
I know this might have been asked a million times,
I am off work in a weeks time for 10 days, now the PC getting a bit slow(not hardware) it really needs a format+reinstall,so thought should I put XP back on or give vista a try out, I have tried vista once before(don't ask where I go it from) was not that impressed with it to be honest,
but saying that I could not get a driver for my sound card or graphics card, so it was in 800x600 mode and 4.3 aswell(my monitor is a widescreen)
my scanner did not work and had trouble with the printer, that was 4 months ago, the drivers might have been updated now,
like I said my PC can run vista without a problem(dual core cpu, 2GB ddr2 memory and so on)

do I stay with XP
or give vista another go?
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: Pwiggler on December 02, 2007, 08:16:23 AM
hi paul

vista has its pro's and con's and it seems to be down to the individual which one they prefer.  i hadnt made my mind up when i reinstalled everything so i installed xp, then installed vista in a dual boot config and now use both equally for various tasks.

works for me !


Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: Floydoid on December 02, 2007, 09:10:06 AM
Personally I'd stick with XP.
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: guest on December 02, 2007, 09:48:32 AM
I'd be inclined to give Vista a miss too - unless you are a gamer and there are actually any DX10-only games?
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: kitz on December 02, 2007, 01:02:39 PM
My thoughts.....

http://forum.kitz.co.uk/index.php/topic,1161.msg41793/topicseen.html#msg41793
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: exo on December 02, 2007, 03:39:49 PM
Hi, Vista, whilst visually impressive if you have the hardware, is not such a radical move forward . With many driver and compatibility issues,  it just strikes me as a rather rushed o/s and not quite what we were promised or expected.
I think I will stick with XP until the next release from MS, which should be better.
I hope MS take note of the poor sales of Vista. I thought the cost of Vista in the UK was taking the mick.

For various reasons, I reformatted and reinstalled my XP after about 2 years of use. I read somewhere that a repair install of XP is almost as good as a clean install. Maybe worth bearing in mind if your current problems are not to severe.
http://www.michaelstevenstech.com/XPrepairinstall.htm

exo
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: oldfogy on December 03, 2007, 03:30:22 AM

I read somewhere that a repair install of XP is almost as good as a clean install.

The main problem with a repair is that it will only repair the OS, it will not remove the debris or registry entries or the variouse tweaks that will have built-up over time with adding and removing software etc.

I think the dual boot idea is a good idea, as at least you can play and investigate it's features, or lack of, depending on which version you install.
Not forgetting that it had a bad report when using copied music and movies. (At least in it's earlier days that is).

Personally I like to carry out a format and re-install at least once a year, the initial result is usually fantastic, mainly because I am always trying and removing programs and although I use Ghost to re-Ghost the PC, it is surprising how much still gets left behind over-time.

************************
Just found this little snippit, although I have not read all of it, it may be another reason to stay with XP.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nf/20071126/tc_nf/56872
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: paul-49 on December 03, 2007, 07:49:39 AM
Thanks for your replys, looks like staying with XP is the way to go for now, but liking the idea of dual boot, might give that a go, it be like the best of both worlds

Paul
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: jabns on December 03, 2007, 12:12:24 PM
Xp all the way! :)
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: maxping on December 03, 2007, 07:27:51 PM
Xp all the way! :)

I would also recommend XP, if the rumours are to be believed Windows 7 due out in 2010 will allow XP users to upgrade but will not let Vista users upgrade.
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: mr_chris on December 03, 2007, 10:38:21 PM
... if the rumours are to be believed Windows 7 due out in 2010 will allow XP users to upgrade but will not let Vista users upgrade.

I can't see that happening somehow... I could see that it might be the other way around, but it would be silly not to let Vista users upgrade.

Or do they think there aren't going to be enough Vista users to make it worthwhile coding the upgrade path :lol:
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: Accordion on December 04, 2007, 08:56:22 AM
For goodness sake don't post your preferences for XP on the Dark Side.
(And don't let moggy3 in here either!)

Personally, I think that MS has produced another 'disaster' like they did with ME. I have no plans to replace XP with Vista apart from on a play machine.
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: oldfogy on December 04, 2007, 04:05:01 PM
I think the name of the link spells out the theme of this little article.  :lol:

http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/windows/microsoft-kills-off-vista-anti+piracy-kill-switch-329603.php
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: Ratae on December 06, 2007, 12:33:55 PM
I was in PCW (damned if I know why) only last weekend looking at the new lappies! An assistant came to me and asked if she could help (when the shock wore off) I asked if any of the new 'puters came with XP as I didn't want Vista! I was told that If I wanted one with XP I would need to get one custom built! So! if I do decide to get a new one soon, that will be the way I'll go! What the hell happened to the customer is always right????? :(
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: Floydoid on December 06, 2007, 01:34:22 PM
Ratae, in that case build your own and install Linux, then neither PCW or MS will get an halfpenny of your money. :)
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: Ratae on December 06, 2007, 02:41:26 PM
Ratae, in that case build your own and install Linux, then neither PCW or MS will get an halfpenny of your money. :)

Floyd.....In answer to your suggestion.
1/.....I have enough to do without building computers! Also I've spent the last 'god only knows how many' years..building>assembling>making>designing>inspecting things and I'm heartily sick of it! I'm now retired which to me means doing only what I now enjoy!

2/.....I like XP!!!!    :)

ratae
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: roseway on December 06, 2007, 03:26:06 PM
>> I like XP!!!!

I guess it takes all types :linux:
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: UncleUB on December 06, 2007, 04:52:12 PM
I like Vista, :) Still saying that the OS I had up to march this year was windows ME.
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: Floydoid on December 06, 2007, 05:00:10 PM
ME was the pits of MS operating systems, tho apparently 2000 is considered to be the best of the pre-XP systems.
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: kitz on December 07, 2007, 12:22:08 AM
>> ME was the pits of MS operating systems

Never had any problems with it - yeah I know some slated it - but for me at least it fixed some problems I was seeing with 98.

I can remember though getting an OEM version of it - not liking it that much and then rolling back to 98.   Which lasted for about a week and I then realised that ME was faster at some things - particularly so at say defrag.   So I put ME back on - and actually liked it.

Vista though - still need to get to grips with that :(
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: mr_chris on December 07, 2007, 12:37:26 AM
Vista though - still need to get to grips with that :(

I don't care if I never do... but erm.. don't quote me on that in 6 months time :P
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: guest on December 07, 2007, 07:20:15 AM
Building your own laptop isn't something I'd recommend ;)

The laptop I bought this summer came with XP. It was also sold with Vista. The Vista version was £95 cheaper. A common-sense viewpoint is that means XP is better :P
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: stevie on December 09, 2007, 10:23:04 PM
Dell will still sell you a PC with XP on it.
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: Astral on December 09, 2007, 10:43:35 PM
Hi stevie, welcome to the forum. Good for Dell.

We have Dell gear at work and I asked the IT bod whether we would be sticking with XP. He said we'd be going over to Vista late in 2008. I was surprised!
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: stevie on December 09, 2007, 10:58:59 PM
Thanks for the welcome.

Heres an article from The Register, its a bit old from April this year, but the interesting bit is the last line, seems there won`t be anymore XP PCs after January 2008 or at least only those already built by then. I had to laugh at the "Latest & Greatest Technology bit".... ::)

Dell offers XP again amidst Vista complaints

Users ask to party like its 2001
By Austin Modine in Mountain View
Published Friday 20th April 2007 22:59 GMT

Dell is to once again offer Windows XP on new systems, responding to online customer complaints. The decision reverses a Vista-only policy the PC seller has moved to since the release of Microsoft's latest OS. The move is a reaction to online complaints at Dell's recently-launched Ideastorm website.

At Ideastorm, users can create or vote on suggestions to the company (in the courteous and thoughtful manner the internet is known for). Most of the complaints on the site regard a lack of OS options.

The most popular Vista-phobic post and the one that got the company's attention is "Dont [sic] eliminate XP just yet" which received 12,228 supporting "points." (The scoring process on the site is extremely convoluted. According to the site, each vote bumps the score by 10 points. This would mean either there's something else unsaid in the woodwork, or there's 1,222 and eight tenths of a person who wants XP. On an slightly unrelated note, a post asking for Linux support is the most popular with 125,126 votes.)

Dell manager Lionel Menchaca noted the complaint on his Dell blog and announced customers can now purchases XP Home or Pro on certain Dimension desktops and Inspiron notebooks.

The models are: Dimension E520 and E521 desktops, and Inspiron 1501, E1405, E1505, and E1705 notebooks

The XP option is available only to US customers.

Meanwhile, Microsoft is showing its poker face regarding the development.

"Dell is responding appropriately to a small minority of customers that had this specific request," Microsoft product manager Michael Burk said in a statement. "But, as they have said before, the vast majority of consumers want the latest and greatest technology, and that includes Windows Vista."

Manufacturers will only be able to pre-install XP on systems until Jan. 31, 2008 when Microsoft will force them to switch no matter what internet denizens ask for. ®

Source.... http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/04/20/dell_offers_xp_again/
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: feliscatusx2 on December 10, 2007, 11:10:04 AM
Using XP - I actually paid for it  :'(.

Must admit I quite like it, esp. with 2 Gb RAM and running in classic interface.

Until I got this new(er) PC I was using ME.  I liked it a lot and had not one single problem with it.  You just have to take out the garbage like System Restore etc.  I ended up preferring it to 98SE.

I would go back to ME like a shot, but there are too many hardware issues involved (too much RAM, can't get drivers etc).

Awaiting XP SP3 (real soon now  ;)) then will slipstream a new XP CD and take out most of the rubbish using nLite.

Vista - not likely, I'd rather use the dreaded L***x.

Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: guest on December 10, 2007, 11:16:13 AM
Hi stevie. A Dell lappie wouldn't be my first choice although they may be better these days ;) Dell are selling through the channel now too so I assume they're hurting rather badly (financially) if they've dropped the sacred "We only sell direct" mantra?

http://www.channelregister.co.uk/2007/12/06/dell_channel/
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: UncleUB on December 10, 2007, 01:12:47 PM
Well I have had 3 Dell desktops in the last 12 years and I must say I can,t say much to fault them.My latest one which I bought in April had a faulty hard drive.They changed the complete desktop tower unit without question.Like any bit of kit you can be un lucky and have problems.  :)
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: guest on December 10, 2007, 06:14:40 PM
Oh the desktops are fine. The laptops might be the same now for all I know :)
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: kitz on December 11, 2007, 02:05:31 PM
I notice that report states  "The XP option is available only to US customers"..  but the UK site also offers XP on several of their machines too.
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: mr_chris on December 11, 2007, 06:20:50 PM
I notice that report states  "The XP option is available only to US customers"..  but the UK site also offers Vista on several of their machines too.
You mean XP? Yeah its available, dunno why they're saying its US only - maybe on those particular models, who knows?!
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: kitz on December 11, 2007, 08:12:16 PM
oops yep sorry typo - ill change it.
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: jabns on December 15, 2007, 05:13:08 AM
Most businesses will not adopt vista until server 2008 is running smoothly and after SP1.

In this months PC Pro they said that XP SP3 had improved benchmark results by 10-20% and that Vista SP1 did nothing performance wise. They also said:


Unless microsoft believes in marketing suicide they will not release XP SP3 until after vista SP1


Which to me says everything!

I also have got my XP booting in under 3secs(after post). Removing event logging service made the biggest difference.

James
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: guest on December 15, 2007, 11:15:33 AM
I doubt they'll even adopt it then James. Vista is dead in the water in the business market as it offers NOTHING to businesses other than increased hardware/training costs. Hard enough finding businesses that are interested in "upgrading" to Office2007 never mind Vista.
Title: Re: Vista or XP
Post by: oldfogy on December 30, 2007, 02:06:58 AM
Just for what it's worth.
Firstly my original comment still stands (I still hate Vista)

Unfortunately one of my neighbours/friends brought some laptops for her daughters as Christmas presents.
This now makes "1 XP Desktop, 2 XP Laptops and 2 Vista Laptops.

Since Christmas I seem to have spent that much time on the Vista machines setting things up that by now I should be able to call myself pretty efficient with Vista, but I'm not going to.
Why, well to be honest, they are such a pain trying to navigate around.
IE: I created a folder (as I usually do to store my download files or backups).
But trying to find and access the folder again was almost impossible because I could not find it. Eventually I did find it, but it was by accident when doing something else.

One of todays saga's was Defrag, I eventually found where it was hidden, which was about 4/5 folders deep from the start menu. With running Defrag there is absolutely no indication of how much the HDD is fragged or how long it might take, no % indication, no nothing, so eventually left it running for them to turn off when it finished.

It's almost as if it's been designed so that the everyday person can't access anything except their normal folder from the start menu.

Also I could not find any easy way of removing "all but the most recent Re-store points" unless I disabled system re-store and then re-enabled it, at least with XP when doing a disc clean from within Explorer/My Computer the option is there straight-away.
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: Pwiggler on December 30, 2007, 08:22:12 AM
the upstairs machine i use for games was duel booting xp and vista but over the last week xp has 'had a few problems' and i'm gonna have to reinstall it so i'm only using vista on that machine.

i stuck another gig of memory in it and the games using dx10 look cracking and play faultlessly.

saying that last night i was un-raring a 6 gig file, transfering a biggy from the mce machine and browsing while updating a driver and it threw a paddy and locked up.  i left it while i went for a shower and it seemed to have retrieved its dummy and was ticking along nicely when i got back.

as you said OF, it doesnt let you know when its doin something or how long its gonna be.  and as for the 'calculating time' when copying files is a joke !
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: exo on December 30, 2007, 06:52:02 PM
Hi, providing it is scheduled, I believe the Vista defrag now runs automatically.
It can also be run from the command line which may give more detail.
More information here if interested.
http://www.thegline.com/windows/2006/11/about-vista-defrags-sudden-los.html

http://www.pcworld.com/article/id,134986-page,1-c,wordprocessing/article.html

exo
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: soms on December 30, 2007, 07:18:43 PM
I ran dual boot for a few months on a new PC i bought but eventually decided to start fresh XP only with RAID 1 mirroring.

M$ claim that on a high spec machine Vista will out perform XP. Indeed Vista performed well, but XP runs even better.

Also I dislike the clutter added to Vista, so many different windows and "centers" to perform the simpleist of operations.
The new "streamlined" interface changes are just ridiculous and some of my hardware and software didnt work.

I agree that it is just stupid how things like the Disk Defrag is so dumbed down - its just pathetic, and my copy of Diskeeper 10 wouldn't run on it.

For the time being i will stick with XP SP2 with IE6 (though I only use it for M$ sites). No doubt SP3 will force us to use IE7 and WMP11 which look stupidly out of place and are heavy rain poor to use.

Of course ultimately no doubt I will end up using Vista, either as M$ make life more and difficult or continue to "Vista-ize" (note U$ spelling) XP. Unfortunately Linux is to much hassle for me as someone who knows Windows 9x, 2k, XP fairly well.

Perhaps a move to something like a Mac-mini will eventually be in order?
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: mr_chris on December 30, 2007, 07:31:22 PM
Perhaps a move to something like a Mac-mini will eventually be in order?

Funnily enough I've been thinking that my next PC purchase may well be a Mac mini!! And for anyone that's known me a while, you would not expect me to say that!
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: guest on December 30, 2007, 07:35:31 PM
You fancy Apple's version of *nix then Chris? I find the number of updates they've had to issue for it extremely worrying compared to standard Linux distros :(
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: oldfogy on December 30, 2007, 08:02:48 PM
I suppose even for all our my gripes and groans with regards to Vista, as said earlier eventually we may well be converted over to it.
But at this moment in time, it's still going to be a long way off, especially with my recent dealings with it.

However, maybe it's time to create a Vista thread instead of placing Vista along with all the other Windows topics?
(Might save someone a lot of time and trouble in the future) when it becomes inevitable ?
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: guest on December 30, 2007, 08:18:16 PM
I think perhaps a Vista tips thread would be useful for some - your recent tips would be a good start.

I don't think I will be "converted" to it. It offers nothing compelling other than DirectX 10 which CAN be back-ported to XP. If I ever get back into gaming then a console will be my choice now. Clare plays LOTRO but frankly any MMORPG maker is going to have to be bribed (heavily) by MS to make a game DX10 only.

Vista is a disaster.
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: kitz on December 30, 2007, 10:10:53 PM
>> I think perhaps a Vista tips thread would be useful for some - your recent tips would be a good start.


Funny enough - when reading through your tips (thank you for doing those OF)... the thought also crossed my mind too.
Title: Re: Vista or XP
Post by: oldfogy on December 30, 2007, 10:48:59 PM

Funny enough - when reading through your tips (thank you for doing those OF)... the thought also crossed my mind too.

What more can one say, except, "Great minds think alike"  :drunk:
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: maxping on January 01, 2008, 07:29:40 PM
Having used a XP PC for a long time  and now trying to get used to a Vista operated Laptop i can honestly say get XP if you can,i have got used to it now but given the option i would have chosen a XP laptop instead.
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: grumpy old man on January 03, 2008, 08:52:47 PM
Have new laptop with Vista Home basic.  I would concur with points made by old fogy that items are difficult to find.  Alot of it seems change for the sake of change e.g. display settings in control panel in XP has now moved to personal settings in Vista, why?  If ain't broke don't fix it.

Apart from the difficulty in finding some items and moving things around on a whim, I get along with Vista reasonalby well, although I only use for office use and internet, no gaming or similar.  Doesn't seem to offer any great advantages over XP.

gom
Title: Re: Vista or xp
Post by: soms on January 06, 2008, 09:00:09 PM
Since I had some xmas money and things seemed in order I have ordered a Mac Mini with Mac OS X Leopard.

Firstly I love the design of the machine, being low power, queit and portable, everything my desktop PC isn't.

Having looked at some of the many websites and browsing Apple I do like the user interface for OS X. It certainly looks very smart and easy to use. Certainly looks far more appealing than Vista on various levels yet it is equally easy to use and graphically compelling.

In the past I have looked at Linux and didn't get on very well. Examples include getting wireless connections to work and generally understanding it. I was certainly lost and out of my depth, and this was with Ubuntu. Nor was I ever prepared to make an effort to get to know it when the advantages seemed so few.

Tbh the main reason I use a Windows desktop PC is for my games; all of which are DirectX 8/9 as well as all the software I bought or is Windows only (Office 2003, PagePlus, Photoshop Elements, Nero, 4oD, WS_FTP, EditPlus, RealVNC, Live Messenger etc)

I dont intend to convert as such but switch between the two. If I "adapt" well and get on OK and can find some equivilant software I might use the Apple most of the time and the PC only for games.

The reasons for buying one... the Mac Mini is a great idea with plenty of potential, M$ is making life difficult for XP users, especially since Vista and the future "looks bleak" for XP and M$ software so to speak - all this horrid "Vista-izing".

I am hoping the Mac Mini will show up next week and I will let you know how I get on. It should be interesting as to date I have not been interested in alternative platforms.