Kitz Forum
Chat => Tech Chat => Topic started by: sevenlayermuddle on September 19, 2015, 10:14:03 PM
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-34301689
I remember well the first time I heard the different sounding (read 'noisy') engines and looked up. Wow, I thought, that's Concorde! That was late 1970s after I first arrived down south, living for a while under the flight path.
In 2003, towards the end of the service, I was again regularly spending time under the flight path. The 'wow' moment hadn't worn off. It thrilled me again, and I still miss it.
I do remember, at least in the times I was under the flight path, it always flew on time. You could literally set your clock by it. Was it 11am and 7pm USA bound out of Heathrow, if I remember right?
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From what I've been reading on some of the aviation forums they will have a mountain to climb with the CAA who reportedly said after the Vulcan there will be no more. I some how think this is very very unlikely to happen as much as I'd like it to in some ways. They will need manufacturers support and I doubt this will be forthcoming.
Stuart
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:(
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It would be nice if it did fly again, I have vague memories of seeing it take off and land, Concorde always looked so graceful. My mother actually flew on it from Manston to Gatwick/Heathrow IIRC. That would of been before 1994, can't remember when though but it used to fly into Manston (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ImqVKetcTX4) for the air show and they used to run trips around the Bay of Biscay and to Gatwick/Heathrow. Here's (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SW3JWCsZYtY) another video of take off and landing at Manston.
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I also remember seeing it at Manston and I've been driving past Heathrow on the M25 when it has gone overhead - unmistakeable.
Dont really know why the BBC has dug this up, as I said earlier I honestly believe this will NEVER happen. The difference between Concorde and the Vulcan is that there were far more Vulcans built and hence far more airframes and spares but as has been seen this year the chances of the Vulcan continuing is slim to none. Resurrecting a Concorde is many orders of magnitude harder. See this thread (http://forums.airshows.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=69590) on the Airshows forum.
Stuart
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I watched the final flights landing live on TV. Remember how the Heathrow controllers managed to stack the three concordes in sequence on approach? What an image.
Didn't they even manage to get the inimitable Raymond Baxter to do the commentary? Or am I imaging that bit? :-\
But I also seem to remember, in the various documentaries at the time, it was stated that the 'surviving' planes would be deliberately rendered unsalvageable. Not sure what they planned to do to them, but it sounded like something pretty terminal. :(
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The CAA will have to follow their own rules so I don't see what they can do to stop it given the funding that appears to be in place.
Frankly I'd have thought they had better things to do - like forcing scum like Ryanair to (finally) pay passengers compensation for delayed/cancelled flights over the last 9 years!
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If they have the funding, then why not. London to NY in 3 hrs is incredible and I dont think there's anything like it today and we're still stuck with 5-6 hrs. Doubt that it would be doing the commercial routes again though.
Yep it was 11am used to stay with my friend who lived nr Eton and woken quite a few times after a good Fri/Sat night session to the sound of it right overhead. Cant recall the evening flight time other than it was about tea-time.
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Like I said eariler I dont think this will ever happen mainly because without manufacturers support (Airbus for airframe and Rolls Royce for engines) it is a non-starter and no matter how much money they have the CAA can stop it, nothing in the UK flys without a certificate of airworthiness and only the CAA can issue that. Airbus and RR I believe have no interest in supporting this, they have many more profitable things to do.
Stuart
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Like I said eariler I dont think this will ever happen mainly because without manufacturers support (Airbus for airframe and Rolls Royce for engines) it is a non-starter and no matter how much money they have the CAA can stop it, nothing in the UK flys without a certificate of airworthiness and only the CAA can issue that. Airbus and RR I believe have no interest in supporting this, they have many more profitable things to do.
Stuart
I thought there was also a shortage of engineering skills to maintain it as well.
I think I remember hearing something along those lines over the years.
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RR don't have "many more profitable things to do" in this market - they're about to REALLY start losing money hand over fist in the engine market (plus they're going to get hit with billions in fines for bribery & probably blacklisted in the USA & large sections of Asia).
They've been getting rid of thousands of engineers (real engineers, not technicians) over the last year or two. Wife contracted for them for the best part of 20 years & they're going down the tubes rapidly since 2012 or so.
Personally I reckon its the usual story of greedy, corrupt execs & bonuses screwing up another company but I digress. RR will survive because HMG can't afford to lose the nuclear expertise in Derby but the engines division is in deep deep trouble.
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I thought there was also a shortage of engineering skills to maintain it as well.
I think I remember hearing something along those lines over the years.
That's the Vulcan you're thinking about & the engineering skills are literally dying out.
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Right you are :blush:
Aren't the engines similar though, I thought there was some connection between the Vulcan and Concorde ?
Not heavily in to Planes etc but the odd fact (half fact) sticks now and then ;D
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I thought there was some connection between the Vulcan and Concorde
Olympus engines, sort of.
The Concorde versions were a major development with reheat and about double the power of those in XH588.
There was also a Vulcan with a prototype Concorde engine nacelle in the bomb bay for engine flight testing.
I've seen that close up doing it's "party trick" of full power on all engines from a low level, accelerating in a near-vertical climb. The noisiest thing I have ever experienced. >:D
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Olympus engines, sort of.
The Concorde versions were a major development with reheat and about double the power of those in XH588.
There was also a Vulcan with a prototype Concorde engine nacelle in the bomb bay for engine flight testing.
I've seen that close up doing it's "party trick" of full power on all engines from a low level, accelerating in a near-vertical climb. The noisiest thing I have ever experienced. >:D
I can imagine the noise, having seen an operational Vulcan being put through its paces in preparation for a forthcoming air display, in the early 1970s. A low level pass, from behind and over the heads of us observers, and then a full-throttle, with after-burners, almost vertical climb . . . (Nearly had the fur singed.) :D
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Yup, I was on the ground with all 6 engines exhausts pointing at me from not far away overhead.
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Concorde didn't need to cease flying when it did. >:(
Even with the one and only crash (a crash not as a result of a defect with the plane) of this marvellous bird's history and the fact Airbus ceased maintenance support Richard Branson wanted to take them on. BUT even though the British concordes where owned by the government and British Airways received big bucks to fly them, British Airways didn't want them to fly anymore.
The sad fact is that all tooling and plans used in the manufacture of the plane are no more so the costs to make one or keep an aged one in the skies would be prohibitive.
The running costs and noise of the engines used in concorde compared to modern passenger planes would also propably make it a non stater as well.
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The backers apparently have in excess of £120m initial funding. I'd say that's enough to kick things off :D
I'm absolutely certain there's enough megarich people who'd pay to fly in it/charter it to make ongoing costs viable.
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The backers apparently have in excess of £120m initial funding. I'd say that's enough to kick things off :D
I'm absolutely certain there's enough megarich people who'd pay to fly in it/charter it to make ongoing costs viable.
That is nowhere near enough to get RR and Airbus onside, perhaps if it were £120 billion then they just might start talking. You can wish all you like but it aint going to happen.
Stuart
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You may be right but I don't think we've seen the last of it yet - when people are spending £250m+ on a "superyacht", what do you think they'd spend to have a share in the only supersonic passenger aircraft to whisk their friends around in?