Kitz Forum
Broadband Related => FTTC and FTTP Issues => Topic started by: sotonsam on June 01, 2018, 04:10:51 PM
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Does anyone have any experience with these types of engineers? What do they do different?
As I'm still having issues with my Infinity line, I’ve been back onto BT - genuinely with the sole aim of terminating my contract, but instead they want to try me with a 'boardband boost' engineer before they process any termination.
It was a bit of a strange call really. He did a speed test remotely and said that he received 62.59Mb back, yet the bearer speed on my modem is 55283 - so I have no idea where he got that speed from?
But anyway, he's arranged a boost engineer - but does anyone know what they do? Are they going to bitch at me because I don't have the latest Home Hub connected? (I had the rigmarole of going through this on the call, apparently the reason my bearer speed is 55 is because my wireless channels are wrong and I'm not using a BT Hub) *sigh*.
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I suspect this broadband boost engineer will just be checking your setup is allowing you to get the best connection.
I'm sure BS and others will know more technically about it.
Why was he going on about wireless channels being wrong? Are you connecting via wifi or through ethernet?
I wonder how much these call centre people get paid? Do they get any form of training on the products they are helping with or are they purely looking at a script all the time?
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I said at the start that I connect wired, I don't use the wireless. (I always try - if i can - to avoid saying that I don't use the 'Hub', as this gives them something else to moan about).
Even though I said that I'm wired at the start, he still went along with what I assume was a script. Asked where it was positioned and I said by the master socket. Then I got the spiel ''Well, if it's by a wall then you will get lower speeds as you are losing speed through the wall'. Give me a break. I feel sorry for people out there who would actually buy this spiel and BT get away with it, it's shocking.
I'll give them the benefit of doubt with this engineer visit, if this doesn't work and I'm still below my handback threshold then I will be pushing that termination!
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I had a Boost engineer visit a few months ago. They are OR engineers who will basically check all the wiring from your master socket to the PCP to try and improve your connection speeds - including changing the pair your line uses if they find a better one.
They won't worry about the modem you are using - they will test the line using their own kit.
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I had a Boost engineer visit a few months ago. They are OR engineers who will basically check all the wiring from your master socket to the PCP to try and improve your connection speeds - including changing the pair your line uses if they find a better one.
They won't worry about the modem you are using - they will test the line using their own kit.
Cool - I was hoping they wouldn't be bothered!
Out of interest, did you get an improvement from their visit? I've now hit 45Mb on my line after another resync last night, on a line which up until 3 months ago was on 68-70!! This will be the 4th engineer, so hopefully they find something. I've already had a new pair tried, new master socket etc. Stays on 58-60ish for a while, then just sinks - so I think the prob is further away from my property.
Something came to my mind yesterday actually, we have a mobile mast and associated cabinets running parallel with the run from my house to the cabinet. 3 months ago they had to remove all that kit to allow the water company to repair a fault, they've since reinstalled it...it may be a coincidence...may not be, but my problems have been since then...
If they can't find anything, then BT will have a termination coming their way!
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Maybe they moved some of the non-BT gear to be right next to your phone line cable and so now it is leaking interference / crosstalk in to your world?
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If that is the case, then I don't think I'll be seeing a fix any time soon....
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Out of interest, did you get an improvement from their visit? I've now hit 45Mb on my line after another resync last night, on a line which up until 3 months ago was on 68-70!! This will be the 4th engineer, so hopefully they find something. I've already had a new pair tried, new master socket etc. Stays on 58-60ish for a while, then just sinks - so I think the prob is further away from my property.
Yes, my speeds improved by about 10% during the visit (the engineer had originally hoped for more) and then SNR lowered itself to 3 after a couple of weeks providing a further boost (hauwei cab). In my case, the visit was caused as when my line was upgraded from 55mb to upto 80mb, my sync speed actually fell.
If I recall correctly you have a 2nd FTTC line now, so worth drawing the engineers attention to the fact that is much more stable and doesn't have the same instability issues.
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Why are the two lines so different?
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Cheers gt9 - yeah, I will mention the 2nd line (although he will probably notice it). Although if I’m greedy I could be getting more out of that as well (under 60 throughput!)
@Weaver - I don't know the normal process for fitting two lines - but this is what happened in my case. The Openreach guy (subby) had a look to see if I had any spare pairs in the drop, it did - so he took the drop cable into a new joint/junction box and attached it to my facia - then I have two lines coming out of this. In terms of why two lines are so different, I'm not sure they are - I personally think they're both underperforming to a certain extent, but I'm only really pushing my BT Infinity line because this has now fallen to 50Mb throughput (54Mb sync), so below my estimated range (63-70) and my handback threshold (57).
I've had two techs out who have confirmed my physical line length to be 168m from house to PCP. My attenuation levels of 13 are slightly at odds with that, and are possibly indicative of aluminium somewhere along the run or possibly a faulty joint somewhere. They've both said that I'm the only person on either side of my road (on the line between me and the cab) to have FTTC, everyone else has VM (hence why it's so oversubscribed!) - So crosstalk on the journey to the cab isn't an issue (unless the mobile masts are introducing it). They believe I should be getting at least 68Mb (which I've always got since 2013, until the start of this year), so I'm a little frustrated that even after saying that they've left without achieving it! I'm kind of hopeful today that a Broadband Boost engineer can find something further down the line and look into it a little more detailed (the last people I've had have only spent a max of 5-10mins)
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I was wondering what might be going through any cabling to the mobile phone boxen and whether that might be the source of crosstalk
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They believe I should be getting at least 68Mb (which I've always got since 2013, until the start of this year), so I'm a little frustrated that even after saying that they've left without achieving it! I'm kind of hopeful today that a Broadband Boost engineer can find something further down the line and look into it a little more detailed (the last people I've had have only spent a max of 5-10mins)
Yes, in my case the Broadband Boost engineer spent a couple of hours looking at the route the line took to the cab - no guarantees obviously and in my case he did say he had hoped for even higher speeds then he achieved but the copper was poor - but they certainly have time to properly dedicate to troubleshoot the issue.
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As per all Openreach guys, very thorough and helpful – although unfortunately he’s not been able to make any improvements, it’s poss a little bit slower. He’s tried me on new pairs, new drop cable, new port in the cab….but it’s not having it. He cannot get it above 54Mb (so, 49-50mb throughput). He was able to confirm that the cable run to the PCP is full aluminium and he suspects that this is the issue.
Interestingly though, my AAISP line resynced whilst he was doing it and is now getting 78mb…..on a target SNR of 2.6. Although my attainable is now 64, so I don’t know how long my sync speed is going to remain 78…
At least I have all I need to now shelve my BT Infinity line without any penalty!
BT Line –
http://dslstats.ddns.net:55555/connection.htm
AAISP Line –
http://dslstats.ddns.net:55552/connection.htm
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Sounds like a great engineer, so basically he tried swapping all of this in a single visit which is very good of him.
Tie pair swap
D side swap
DP swap
Did he do a DLM reset before trying these alternate pairs?
I just read all your posts.
The AAISP line is syncing higher presumable due to a lower target SNRM. It may also have more favourable conditions in terms of quality of the line and crosstalk, someone would need to try and calculate what the line would get on equal line parameters to the infinity line.
The infinity line if you leave it alone as long as its stable should eventually end up on a 3db target as well so the speed would increase.
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Sounds like a great engineer, so basically he tried swapping all of this in a single visit which is very good of him.
Tie pair swap
D side swap
DP swap
Did he do a DLM reset before trying these alternate pairs?
I just read all your posts.
The AAISP line is syncing higher presumable due to a lower target SNRM. It may also have more favourable conditions in terms of quality of the line and crosstalk, someone would need to try and calculate what the line would get on equal line parameters to the infinity line.
The infinity line if you leave it alone as long as its stable should eventually end up on a 3db target as well so the speed would increase.
Yeah, he was a good one. He spent about 3/4 hrs, up the pole, walking to the different chambers in the path etc. He reset DLM a couple of times and actually sat with his tester in my master socket for what felt like ages, it only ever showed up 1 fec error in about 10 mins! He did everything he could, so I’m happy with that.
I think my gamble has paid off with my AAISP line though - I've lucked out a bit I think, if I disconnect my BT line my attainable on my AAISP rises to 84Mb, 32mb up. So my 'BT' line is seemingly more susceptible to crosstalk than my new one.
So I've contacted BT today and they have confirmed that I am free to end my contract with no penalty as my minimum in contract is 57mb - so I shall be doing that and will then have a single line on 70mb+ with AAISP...!
p.s - I'm on ECI, so 6db SNR will be my norm. When my AAISP line resynced when he was doing the work, my BT line was off - so my AAISP came up at 78mb on a 6db SNR. When my BT line came up....my attainable on AAISP dropped quite a bit and my SNR fell to about 2....so although it seemed stable, to be safe I've resynced my AAISP to get it back to the 6db SNR and in line with the 64mb sync - but that'll gain 10/15mb when my BT line goes.
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The AAISP line is syncing higher presumable due to a lower target SNRM. It may also have more favourable conditions in terms of quality of the line and crosstalk, someone would need to try and calculate what the line would get on equal line parameters to the infinity line.
The infinity line if you leave it alone as long as its stable should eventually end up on a 3db target as well so the speed would increase.
Both lines are connected to an ECI cabinet. No 3db target margin that I am aware of.
Anyway, looks like the AAISP FTTC connection has finally re-sync'd and took a hit to its sync speed:
Bearer: 0, Upstream rate = 20000 Kbps, Downstream rate = 63141 Kbps
78 Mbps was too good to be true, although it looked like it was doing OK up until that point for errors. Perhaps the modem was rebooted? Because it is showing:
Resyncs: 0 (since 05 Jun 2018 16:14:49)
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Both lines are connected to an ECI cabinet. No 3db target margin that I am aware of.
Anyway, looks like the AAISP FTTC connection has finally re-sync'd and took a hit to its sync speed:
78 Mbps was too good to be true, although it looked like it was doing OK up until that point for errors. Perhaps the modem was rebooted? Because it is showing:
It was stable, but the SNR did hit 1.6/1.7, and it was a little too close to the edge for me. I did a manual reboot to bring it back to a 6db target.
But to prove a point, after It had resynced at 63/64, i killed my BT line and my AAISP attainable jumped back to 84....so I think I've lucked out a little here.
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I think my gamble has paid off with my AAISP line though - I've lucked out a bit I think, if I disconnect my BT line my attainable on my AAISP rises to 84Mb, 32mb up. So my 'BT' line is seemingly more susceptible to crosstalk than my new one.
That's interesting. That's a fairly large increase, but nothing outside the extraordinary when two pairs are on the same drop (since a hit of up to 20 Mbps is possible). Perhaps you COULD try to test and see if it was not "luck" (better-than-normal conditions) when you sync'd at 78 Mbps before and actually take both lines offline and just sync up the AAISP alone? If you get the same sync as before, perhaps you just have a better connection on the new pair (and perhaps the newer DSLAM firmware is helping a bit).
So I've contacted BT today and they have confirmed that I am free to end my contract with no penalty as my minimum in contract is 57mb - so I shall be doing that and will then have a single line on 70mb+ with AAISP...!
Possibly a good shout. Now that you have that new connection with AAISP, if you have gone for the 1 month contract you could technically move it to another provider if you wanted. Though, AAISP are safe hands from what I have read so there is no reason to leave (unless want to pick from the bargain bucket of ISPs).
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Probably will hold back any more resyncs for a few days! But as I said earlier, I dropped the BT line a few hours ago and saw the attainable rise to the 80s on the aaisp line, so the potential is possibly still there.
Yeah I’m in a rolling 1 month with aaisp. Can’t fault them really, they give me all I need from an isp but at least with a rolling 1 month I have flexibility now should anything change.
All in all I think I’ve got an ok result from all of this!
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ok so isnt on a 3db target.
What happens to the infinity line when the AAISP line is turned off?
Looks like the lines are crosstalking with each other.
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ok so isnt on a 3db target.
What happens to the infinity line when the AAISP line is turned off?
Looks like the lines are crosstalking with each other.
Good question and something I did have a look at. My attainable on my BT line did increase, but only to about 63Mb. So my BT line looks to be affected by more crosstalk than my new. So it’s been a bit of an interesting unintentional experiment, can really see how big an impact crosstalk can create.
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It was stable, but the SNR did hit 1.6/1.7, and it was a little too close to the edge for me. I did a manual reboot to bring it back to a 6db target.
My line has been running at around 1dB for weeks perfectly fine. It's considerably longer than your line also.
Max: Upstream rate = 7563 Kbps, Downstream rate = 45838 Kbps
Bearer: 0, Upstream rate = 8070 Kbps, Downstream rate = 51405 Kbps
Bearer: 1, Upstream rate = 0 Kbps, Downstream rate = 0 Kbps
Link Power State: L0
Mode: VDSL2 Annex B
VDSL2 Profile: Profile 17a
TPS-TC: PTM Mode(0x0)
Trellis: U:ON /D:ON
Line Status: No Defect
Training Status: Showtime
Down Up
SNR (dB): 0.9 4.1
Attn(dB): 24.5 0.0
Pwr(dBm): 13.3 3.2
A new crosstalker has hit another 5Mb off my line, resulting in the very low SNR.
Still, not bad for a 24.5dB attenuation. The line is just over 1000m.
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My line has been running at around 1dB for weeks perfectly fine. It's considerably longer than your line also.
A new crosstalker has hit another 5Mb off my line, resulting in the very low SNR.
Still, not bad for a 24.5dB attenuation. The line is just over 1000m.
Considering the OP is on an ECI cabinet, I would say an SNR of under 3 dB with no considerable errors is exceedingly good considering the absence of G.INP. Heck, my fairly short line on a Huawei cabinet is probably more prone to errors than his even at an almost constant 6 dB if G.INP was disabled.
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Disconnected my BT line now - resynced my AAISP, and straight back at 77/78 sync and attainable.
http://dslstats.ddns.net:55552/index.htm
I think I've been very lucky with this line....