Kitz Forum
Broadband Related => ADSL Issues => Topic started by: aesmith on December 17, 2015, 01:52:53 PM
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Latest update after BT OR attendance today. As before we had everything in the house switched off before he arrived, and nothing plugged into the line except a phone into the test socket. As before he tested the line and said it was all within spec for voice. He tested for DSL and it was showing loads of FECs and a few CRCs, however he said that this due to interferences (the famous REIN) and not to a line fault.
He had deduced this by listening with the van radio as he drove up to the house, he said he was picking it up a couple of hundred yards from the house, increasing as he approached but then stopping when he was alongside the house. We went for a spin in his van and sure enough I could hear exactly the same harsh hum as we hear on the phone line, even 100 yards or so N of the house where there is absolutely nothing, over a hundred yards from our electric supply and even further from our phone line. Driving slowly past the house the noise shut off as if by a switch, just exactly when he moved the gear lever into neutral, and it didn't reappear when we went round the house again. I nipped inside and the noise on the phone line was exactly the same.
Following his visit I've done some tests plugging our appliances back in and listening with an AM radio, I can't say I'm any the wiser because just about every appliance seems to make some sort of noise. Nothing makes that harsh humming/buzzing noise that we hear on the phone line. So I have a few questions ..
(1) That testing with the van radio, how authoritative is that? It seems to me that you're driving round with a bunch of potential interference sources in the van, for all I know it was a phone charger or invertor or something in the van causing it.
(2) Are there particular signatures I'm looking for in noise from appliances, and if I find these how can I tell if the signal strength is enough to upset the DSL?
Thanks, Tony S
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Couple of points ............
1) The 'Noise' you can hear on your phone will NOT be the same 'Noise' that you hear on the radio. The REIN noise the engineer is looking for via his van radio, is well out of the phones frequency spectrum, as such the human ear won't be able to hear it .... it is high frequency.
2) As with your AM/MW radio 'telling you' there is HF noise on most electrical items you go near, it is exactly the same with the van-radio scenario. The 'Buzz' you hear on the radio could be deafening, but it does not automatically follow that this is SERVICE AFFECTING REIN. It merely points to the fact that there are 'Noisy' electrical items in the area.
The only way to tell if the noise you heard on the van-radio WAS service affecting REIN, would have been for the engineer to use the Spectrum Analyser on the Hand-Held Tester to view the ADSL/VDSL spectrum bandwidth.
The thing with REIN faulting is, it comes down to experience. So, I'm not calling the engineer here. Another thing to consider is the make-up of your cable feed ?? I had a REIN fault a few months ago that turned out to be 1.5Km of Aluminium cable causing the high amount of FEC's. The engineer who had raised the task had done everything right, and he could hear the same 'Buzzing' noise demonstrated to you today next to the EU's telegraph pole.
The SA is the only TRUE way to determine if REIN is present. You'll need a skip for all the 'Faulty' items your radio will find. ;) ;D
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Thanks. I understand what you mean about the noise, but it sounded the same. Maybe what I mean is that the radio output, from the OR guys van, sounded the same as listening to our telephone line. That let me (and him) to conclude that it was linked. I guess technically what it was picking up was 50Hz modulation on that 612kHz frequency.
The other thing that gets me, was we were picking this up in the van to the N of the house, and there's no electrical equipment or cables for a good hundred yards in any direction in any direction. I only have a photo from winter, so ignore the snow but this is about how far we travelled with no change in the signal. Nearest electricity is the shed with the gable facing the camera, but there's nothing powered on there. The house is around 50 further away, and the phone line comes down the hill in the background and enters the house at the far end to the south.
(https://forum.kitz.co.uk/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi42.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fe320%2FGandyGoose%2FTech%2FIMG_1772-1280_zpshdrtlhwp.jpg&hash=bf142b02af6723801de317ef6fcb347000de89b4)
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Latest update after BT OR attendance today. As before we had everything in the house switched off before he arrived, and nothing plugged into the line except a phone into the test socket. As before he tested the line and said it was all within spec for voice. He tested for DSL and it was showing loads of FECs and a few CRCs, however he said that this due to interferences (the famous REIN) and not to a line fault.
Was the visit for a noisy (audible) telephony fault or for a DSL fault? Quite simply, if it was the former and you were able to demonstrate --
I nipped inside and the noise on the phone line was exactly the same.
-- then the statement --
he tested the line and said it was all within spec for voice.
-- was wrong. An "in spec" line for a telephone service does not have any audible noise present upon it.
Puzzled. ???
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Both really. ISP is reporting errors on the DSL, corresponding with the time we first started hearing this buzzing on the phone line. Openreach position appears to be that if the line is within spec for all their parameters like impedance, ac and dc balance etc etc, then the line is not faulty. Their position appears to be that if the line tests OK in that way but still has audible noise then the noise must be an external factor. That's what the guy was trying to demonstrate. If the signal he was picking up hadn't stopped dead in that way, while the phone noise continued, then I might have accepted that.
Black Sheep I notice has not fully endorsed the "van radio" testing methodology. I wonder if anyone has any comment about the detected "REIN" stopping so suddenly, as I say it was as if the switch had been thrown. At that time we were around 40m from any electrical equipment or lines. I'm really now pretty convinced the source of this "REIN" was within the van itself.
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A spectrum analyser and a set of directional aerials appears to be called for. :-X
I have a small (hand sized) ICOM IC-R5 Communications Receiver that is capable of tuning to 300 kHz (and below) and will use it when attempting to trace electrical noise sources. I will do a sweep at 300 kHz, 303 kHz and 306 kHz before checking the higher harmonics of those three frequencies.
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As well as frequency, how does one assess magnitude? I mean supposing a signal on the appropriate frequencies is detected, how do you determine whether this will or will not affect a line say 20m or 50m away? I must say I find it a little odd that the first point of call isn't to measure for interference on the line, then to try and track down the source once it is known to affect the line. The actual process seems to be the wrong way round.
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I think it's a matter of where their responsibility lies. The only obligation Openreach have is to maintain the physical connection. Any investigations into external interference may or may not be carried out on a goodwill basis, depending on the availability of appropriate people, etc.
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I think it's a matter of where their responsibility lies. The only obligation Openreach have is to maintain the physical connection. Any investigations into external interference may or may not be carried out on a goodwill basis, depending on the availability of appropriate people, etc.
As roseway states above, OR's job is to test the 'Pair of wires' up to a particular standard. If that standard is met, then it will be due to faulty levels of interference coupling into their network that is causing REIN issues. Normal levels of interference would be rejected on a good pair of wires.
So, for example, if your pair of wires passes the tests, and an electric welder in a shed nearby is giving of REIN, then that will never be the fault of OR. Again, as Eric has pointed out and have you have experienced personally, OR as a gesture of goodwill regularly despatch a REIN-trained engineer to have a cursory glance in the hope of resolving the problem. This will generally be when our workstacks dictate, as REIN faulting is a gratis service ...... as a rule, nobody pays OR to attend REIN faults.
So with that in mind, to answer your question again, the only way you can measure the presence and magnitude of the unwanted signal is via a Spectrum Analyser connected directly to the pair of wires.
Our Hand Held Testers have a SA in-built, and below are three examples of a trace from a JDSU. The other HHT is an EXFO but I have no info on that device as I don't possess one.
Picture REIN1 is an example of a normal DSL circuit. REIN2&3 are circuits suffering from REIN.
The slight problem with the HHT SA's is they are not good at capturing all types of REIN patterns due to their slow refresh rate. An electric fence giving of REIN would likely be missed for example.
As I mentioned earlier today, REIN training is virtually non-existant, because we can't leave a REIN source switched on for any length of period in our training rooms within the Telephone Exchanges for obvious reasons. It really is a case of 'time spent on jobs = experience in the bag'. I kinda remember that awful feeling in the pit of my stomach on the first dozen or so REIN jobs. Fish out of water, nervous, unconvincing to the EU when explaining outcomes etc etc ........ a bl00dy nightmare !! ;D
Can I ask how the engineer left the job ..... did he say he would keep the REIN case open, or that he would close it off ??
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So with that in mind, to answer your question again, the only way you can measure the presence and magnitude of the unwanted signal is via a Spectrum Analyser connected directly to the pair of wires.
That wasn't done.
Can I ask how the engineer left the job ..... did he say he would keep the REIN case open, or that he would close it off ??
Not sure to be honest, he didn't specify. When the detected signal "switched off" the guy drove off after explaining to me that if noise on the line reappeared I could check with an AM radio to see if the signal was back. At that stage neither of us had rechecked the phone line. He came back because he thought he'd left something with us, and I told him the phone line noise was unchanged. I have yet to see how the job's been reported to the ISP, but I've updated their ticket to make it clear that I don't think we have a conclusive result.
You, and the OR guy speak about "neighbours", but we have nobody with 1/4 mile of us, and no electric installations either. I really can't see a nearby source of interference unless it's within our premises. What I think I'll do at the weekend is switch the power off at the cutout and listen to the line like that. I already know that switching off every appliance makes no difference, but let's test with the whole house and outbuildings de-energised. If the noise disappears I can switch off at the CU, re-energise and then bring the final circuits on one at a time. We do have some stuff around, like electric fence energiser, but nothing near the phone line. (the electric fence is a pulse every 3 seconds, so it's signature should be readily recognisable, and it can be shut off for testing)
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One other thing both Walter and I have done in the past is to listen to the line via an amplifier that presents a high impedance across the pair (thus not looping the pair and signalling to the exchange that a call is wished to be originated). It is surprising just what can be heard when the "proceed to call" tone (a.k.a. "dialling" tone) is absent.
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Presumably the same effect could be obtained by using one of those yellow test phones (aka "butt set", like you use to check to AC15 tones without interfering with the signalling. I'll see whether we have one at work.
I must say I'm tempted to check at one of the many joints, to see whether the noise is any different a few hundred yards towards the exchange. That's what OR has done on previous faults, whereas currently the seem to be focussing only on what's happening within our house.
I'm not convinced my issue is REIN at all.
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Presumably the same effect could be obtained by using one of those yellow test phones (aka "butt set", like you use to check to AC15 tones without interfering with the signalling.
Yes, that would do nicely.
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How does your Electric supply come to your property ?, Is there a pole transformer ?.
Could be a HR joint !, can you borrow a infrared camera to look at the joints to see if any are getting hot .
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I'll put up a plan/map. My feeling is that the transformer is too far from the line to be an issue, but maybe I'm wrong there.
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Just found I plan I'd made up for other purposes, showing the supply arrangements. I've added the phone line route, and the path along which the van radio heard this alleged REIN signal. Would appreciate any comments, because at the moment I'm finding this hard to believe, firstly because of the distance to the phone line, and second because the line characteristics were unchanged when the signal stopped. Also uploading a wider scale map showing distances to neighbours and therefore to electrical equipment other than my own. (Edit, second map doesn't show scale, but the 1km grid spacing is visible)
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I think the major clue here, is that the circuits characteristics remained the same when the 'Noise' disappeared.
As I said before, the van radio, or your own portable radio will pick up all levels of 'Noise', it's whether they are service affecting levels that matters.
If your fault is constant, then I would humbly suggest you have a HR-type fault ?
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Thanks. HR=High resistance? Would that not have shown on the guy's tests, or does it depend on how the test was carried out?
I did point out to the OR guy, and to the ISP, that the buzz on the line was unchanged when this signal disappeared. They just seem to be completely blinkered and convinced it's REIN - maybe because that's something they could wash their hands of. The OR guy came into the house with that mind set, after listening to his radio when he was 100 yards or so away from the phone line, even though he lost the signal when alongside the house.
Final DIY tests for the moment, I just confirmed that the buzzing on the line is unchanged when I switched power off at the incomer. The meter is still energised, and the service cable, but no other electrical equipment could have been powered on with 400m of the house.
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Thanks. HR=High resistance? Would that not have shown on the guy's tests, or does it depend on how the test was carried out?
On the 240volt mains supply Not your phone line !.
If there was a bad joint it could send out rf interference all around and maybe your phone line would pick it up.
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Cheers. That's something I can check out, shame I didn't think of it when I had the power off anyway.
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There is the possibility that the pole mounted 11 kV to 240 V transformer has a developing fault, enough to generate copious RF. :-\
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There is the possibility that the pole mounted 11 kV to 240 V transformer has a developing fault, enough to generate copious RF. :-\
That's what I was thinking :)
Can you find where it is @ aesmith and take a portable radio near it, and have a look at night to see if there is any arcing and listen for sparking sounds.
You could get the local electric supply people to have a check of your supply (tell them your supply fluctuates and you have smelt a burning smell ;))
I have in the past reported all sorts of problems when I have spotted them while out walking and the electric chaps are very grateful ;D
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I went through the electrics today, starting off by switching off everything at the meter cabinet, then checking all connections before switching back on.
I was not amused to find a loose neutral in the consumer unit, not just loose but backed off almost all the way. Very black mark to the sparkies who did the rewire in 2011! That was the immersion heater, which we can't remember ever having used. I don't know if that could have caused an issue if there was no current flowing. On the other hand even if not relevant to the BB issue, that was a potentially dangerous condition now fixed.
Elsewhere everything seems tight and properly connected so far as I've checked. Nothing detected at the pole.
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Armed now with a "BT Telephone 290A", the noise on the line sounds very similar in Monitor mode with the line idle as it does during Quiet Line. What I'd really like to do is have a listen 1/4 mile of so nearer the exchange.
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Openreach should be attending yet again tomorrow. The ISP seems unable to give any detail on what the guy's remit will be, but they said it's raised as a broadband and not a telephone fault, and it will be a REIN engineer.
I was thinking to try and steer him along the following lines, what do people think?
(1) Start with house switched off at the incomer, so no energised electrical equipment or wiring inside the house or outbuildings.
(2) See whether his testing still shows all these FEC errors
(3a) If the line runs clean like this, then I guess we have to accept that it's our equipment or wiring causing the problem, and hopefully narrow it down by powering stuff up circuit by circuitt
(3b) If we still get FEC errors with everything shut down, then what? At that stage I would be anticipating an attempt from OR to stillclaim that it must be some external interference, but do they have any obligation to demonstrate this, or to identify the source?
As you can maybe see I'm concerned because the last two guys arrived with a preformed fixed idea that REIN was the cause, and all they were interested in was explaining that this doesn't constitute a line fault and therefore won't be something they can fix.
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Your plan of action reads as reasonable, so I'm not sure what else to add. Obviously it would be important not to "tell" her/him what to do but to show interest in the technicalities and ask questions so that she/he can demonstrate her/his understanding/knowledge.
Remember to make some coffee or tea and to offer biscuits or a bacon sandwich! ;)
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Openreach should be attending yet again tomorrow. The ISP seems unable to give any detail on what the guy's remit will be, but they said it's raised as a broadband and not a telephone fault, and it will be a REIN engineer.
I was thinking to try and steer him along the following lines, what do people think?
(1) Start with house switched off at the incomer, so no energised electrical equipment or wiring inside the house or outbuildings.
(2) See whether his testing still shows all these FEC errors
(3a) If the line runs clean like this, then I guess we have to accept that it's our equipment or wiring causing the problem, and hopefully narrow it down by powering stuff up circuit by circuitt
(3b) If we still get FEC errors with everything shut down, then what? At that stage I would be anticipating an attempt from OR to stillclaim that it must be some external interference, but do they have any obligation to demonstrate this, or to identify the source?
As you can maybe see I'm concerned because the last two guys arrived with a preformed fixed idea that REIN was the cause, and all they were interested in was explaining that this doesn't constitute a line fault and therefore won't be something they can fix.
Stages 1-3a are perfect, and are pretty much what I do when proven conclusively that REIN is the culprit.
Stage 3b ?? Again, I can only use myself (and another guy I know) as examples. I personally would attempt to localise where the REIN was coming from by a) Using the van radio at 612Kz and b) Intervening in the Network to determine where the good and bad readings are. Also, using the 444B Tester in joints and on overhead wires can sometimes indicate the direction the source is ??.
However, to use the 444B, the engineer must first set up the Spectrum Analyser to view the DSL bandwidth and watch which frequencies are being affected by the REIN. He can then set the tester to the required 'sweep' ...... 0-1Mhz or 1-100Mhz.
To reiterate, the above is assuming your 'pair of wires' are in absolute perfect condition, and are rejecting normal levels of 'noise'.
Good luck, hope you get the required result ?? :)
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Stages 1-3a are perfect, and are pretty much what I do when proven conclusively that REIN is the culprit.
Thanks, in my mind that has not yet been proven. It seems to be an assumption because their copper line tests pass but yet the errors persist in the DSL and noise on the phone line. The last guy really showed that mind set, his mind was made up before he entered our premises or even went near the route of the phone line. All he actually did was to fit a filter (made no difference) and changed the noise margin (made no difference to error rate, just slowed the line down).
One question - the ISP referred to BRAT (or Brandenberg) picking up REIN, and pin pointing it at my house. Given that this is kit at the exchange, firstly how does it detect REIN, is it just from the pattern of errors or does it detect foreign signals on the wires? Also, how does it know where these errors or spurious signal entered the cable?
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Stages 1-3a are perfect, and are pretty much what I do when proven conclusively that REIN is the culprit.
Thanks, in my mind that has not yet been proven. It seems to be an assumption because their copper line tests pass but yet the errors persist in the DSL and noise on the phone line. The last guy really showed that mind set, his mind was made up before he entered our premises or even went near the route of the phone line. All he actually did was to fit a filter (made no difference) and changed the noise margin (made no difference to error rate, just slowed the line down).
One question - the ISP referred to BRAT (or Brandenberg) picking up REIN, and pin pointing it at my house. Given that this is kit at the exchange, firstly how does it detect REIN, is it just from the pattern of errors or does it detect foreign signals on the wires? Also, how does it know where these errors or spurious signal entered the cable?
You are quite correct, Brandenberg Repair Access Tool (BRAT) is basically a summary of all the stats. It can not detect where 'Noise' enters the 'pair of wires'.
BRAT really is a hit and miss indication, and one that unassuming engineers (or engineers wanting a quick 'out'), may interpret wrongly.
An example is .... its summary of DS Attenuation may pass, but there could well be a HR fault on the circuit in question that it can't 'see'. This HR will be what is allowing excessive 'noise' in and causing many CRC's/FEC's. So, BRAT assumes the 'pair of wires' is ok and that the errors can only be down to REIN.
Don't get me wrong, BRAT does have its place in DSL faulting, but it has to be used in conjunction with all the other tests we have at our disposal. PQT, DSL Close-out, Eclipse, TDR, HR Detect, Auto ID, Quiet Line Test, Using the QLT whilst performing an error-rate test at the same time, ringing the landline number whilst performing an error-rate test ......... that's off the top of my head, there's more that I've forgot to mention.
The real underlying issue, is the pressure on the engineer to be both efficient and productive with extreme time-pressures placed upon them.
I hope you get an engineer who takes ownership and finds the source of the fault ...... a probable HR, IMO.
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Thanks. You've speculated about an HR fault earlier but would that not be detected by the pair quality test?
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Not guaranteed whatsoever, It all depends on the severity of the HR. As I've mentioned above, the PQT is just one test and should not be taken as the holy grail of results ..... it is a good indicator, but needs to be taken into consideration with other tests made.
Am signing off now, so will pick up with you again tomorrow. :)
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Another inconclusive visit I'm afraid. The guy sort of caught me on the hop by rolling up around 1/2 hour after the end of the appointment window, by which time I was assuming it was going to be a no-show (which wouldn't be surprising given weather issues locally). Anyway he ran a couple of tests, presumably the basic line test first, the second one was a DSL test with a different screen from the previous guy. His test ran for a couple of minutes and he said it showed no errors. He then popped down the the exchange to check something, and gave me a call from there saying he'd checked the equipment and that my DSL still seems stable as well. He suggested we monitor the line, and speculated that if the fault got worse then maybe they'd be able to locate it. He didn't return to the house. Buzz on phone line is unchanged.
I've asked the ISP to reset me back to 6dB/Interleaved and report on error stats, but this is going round in circles.
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More productive visit this time. As before the guy ran a test from the house, which passed. However he didn't leave it at that, since he agreed with me that a good telephone line shouldn't have a clearly audible buzzing. He checked a couple of joints, and at around 100m from the house the noise was still present on the Exchange side. Over to the exchange and no noise found there (shame that would have been an easy fix I'd think). He couldn't check at the "DP" since the pole's marked unsafe so can't be accessed without special equipment. Job has been referred back, classed as "underground".
So some progress, at least there's agreement that the buzzing indicates an issue, and that it doesn't originate on our property.
[Moderator edited to convert "should" to "shouldn't".]
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More productive visit this time. As before the guy ran a test from the house, which passed. However he didn't leave it at that, since he agreed with me that a good telephone line should have a clearly audible buzzing. He checked a couple of joints, and at around 100m from the house the noise was still present on the Exchange side. Over to the exchange and no noise found there (shame that would have been an easy fix I'd think). He couldn't check at the "DP" since the pole's marked unsafe so can't be accessed without special equipment. Job has been referred back, classed as "underground".
So some progress, at least there's agreement that the buzzing indicates an issue, and that it doesn't originate on our property.
LOL ....... methinks that should read as ..... "shouldn't have a clearly audible buzzing". Never doubted for a minute that it wasn't REIN. :)
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Oops, that's correct "shouldn't". As for REIN or not, I don't know what to believe after all this time, however I was pretty miffed that it seemed to be an unshakeable assumption from the broadband engineers, in particular the last but one had already made is mind up before entering the house. The last guy, who found no fault on the DSL, I think that must have been using the 15dB nm target as the line does indeed seem to run with minimal errors once it's slowed that far.
Anyway, next update expected mid next week so fingers crossed the buzzing gets fixed, and hopefully that will fix the DSL.
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Have you had any success communicating with the maintainer of the electricity supply infrastructure? (Or has that now been definitely ruled out?) :-\
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I haven't followed that up to date. I had a wander near the 11kV transformer with my AM radio and wasn't picking anything up to make me suspicious, so nothing really to report to the DNO. The transformer's over 50m from the phone line so I thought it would need to be a pretty strong signal to carry that far. I'm going to wait and see just now. The fact that the OR guy checked 100m from the house and found noise on the exchange side of the joint suggests that it originates elsewhere (only 5200m to check).
I'll revisit electrics if clearing the buzzing doesn't clean up the DSL, I could probably power the router from a battery for testing with the whole house electrics switched off. But will cross that one when I come to it.
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I now understand. Thank you.
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Some progress today I hope. The Openreach engineer was a local guy, which helps, and with a bigger van. He was able to access some of the underground joints that the previous guy wasn't equipped to work on. His testing showed the line clear at the public road, quiet after the branch to our neighbour, then noisy halfway along to us, maybe 400m from the house. He swapped us onto another pair over that section, and we now have a nice quiet line. It remains to be seen how the DSL behaves, I've swapped back to the Thomson router so I can monitor with DSL Stats, but at 2752k (15dB target) that fact that it's error free is not conclusive. I'll see if Plusnet will reset everything tomorrow.
As a side issue I found that my test phone was picking up noise, a distinct 50Hz buzz, when it was near the DECT handset. That confused the heck out of me when I was trying to check that the noise was gone from the house. It was noisiest when the DECT handset was near the phone itself, not when I held the handset near the phone line. Very odd, I wouldn't expect 50Hz noise from a battery powered device. To further confuse, it didn't happen when the base station was powered off. Switching off the base station caused the noise to disappear altogether, powering it back on the noise resumed when the station booted up completely (blue LAN light comes on).
Tony S
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Interesting developments.
Though the induced 50 Hz noise via the DECT phone is a bit puzzling. ???
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Interesting developments.
Though the induced 50 Hz noise via the DECT phone is a bit puzzling. ???
I am not surprised the power supply on the dect phone converts the 250v AC to 9 or 12V DC and then enters the circuitry on the dect base station and then exits via the DSl cable to master socket.
I would try a compatible PSU for the dect phone if no change then a component inside the dect phone base station circuitry is showing signs of a failure.
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I am not surprised the power supply on the dect phone converts the 250v AC to 9 or 12V DC and then enters the circuitry on the dect base station and then exits via the DSl cable to master socket.
I don't think that's what was happening in this case. The DECT base station wasn't connected to the phone line, I had my test phone connected to the line. The noise I was picking up was when the DECT handset (not the base station) was held near to the test telephone. I'm sticking my neck out and saying the noise didn't originate from the PSU, because it didn't start when the PSU was plugged in, only after 30 seconds when the base station was fully booted up and paired with the handset.
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Disappointingly it looks like the errors might be returning. We're still only connecting at 2752 on the 15dB NM target, but at around 04:30 this morning it changed from a few FECs every now and then to a steady rate of hundreds per minute. Still no CRCs, but of course we're running artificially slow.
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I have to agree . . . that doesn't look nice. :(
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I sometimes get FEC going up to around 100,000 per minute, but that's on ADSL2. High FEC rates don't cause me any problems, but ADSL1 is likely to be less effective at correcting the errors.
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CRCs are back now we've been reset to 6dB target, which happened at 15:15.
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It looks like we might have an issue in the house after all, switching everything off in the room except the router just about stopped the CRCs completely, although strangely the FECs continued unchanged. Re-synching at 20:00 gave a slower speed and at that speed with everything switched back on I'm getting a pretty low error rate, something like 0-6 ES per hour (total 82 in 23 hours).
What seems to have changed is the SNR now varies more between day and night, when we started getting really bad errors last night it was varying between 2.5 and 3.5, down from 6dB at 16:00. So naturally a re-synch at that time dropped the speed pretty severely.
So fixing the audible line noise has made a big difference, but not completely solved the issue.
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So fixing the audible line noise has made a big difference, but not completely solved the issue.
Or could it be that there were two issues of which only one has been resolved? :-\
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I think that's correct, another fault previously masked by the line faults that's just been fixed.