Kitz Forum
Broadband Related => FTTC and FTTP Issues => Topic started by: kitz on November 18, 2013, 04:23:50 PM
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Note 24/11/2013. I now have all the information I need.
Thank you very much everyone that took the time to post their results too. :)
Can anyone on fttc please do me a favour and download one of the larger TBB test files and see what speeds you can achieve.
Im particularly looking for help from anyone who is getting a full 40Mbps and anyone on the 80/20 service.
I would also appreciate it if anyone on a work dedicated link could also provide some results too for comparison.
The information I need please
- A speedtest from thinkbroadband (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest.html?)
- The results of a download file from here (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/download.html).
NetMeter (http://www.metal-machine.de/readerror/) is a good free utility that will allow you to check your throughput speed whilst downloading the file
Can you also please supply me with the following information:-
- Whether the test was performed by LAN
- Your ISP
- Your connection speed/type ie FTTC 80/20
- Router and modem
- Any other single thread speed tests you can do such as FTP
Thank you.
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FTP details removed.
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- Plusnet
- FTTC 80/20 - Sync 79,999/20,000
- LAN
- HG612 modem, TG582n router
- FTP max 28Mbps
- Result 71.47 Mbps (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html?id=138479998495080361468)
- HTTP - 30 Mbps [1]
- FTP - a pathetic 18 Mbps up & down[2]
(https://forum.kitz.co.uk/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.thinkbroadband.com%2Fspeedtest%2Fbutton%2F138479998495080361468-mini.png&hash=bf6b471c23c6c0ef8bac8d300e7a99ec6274a5d8) (http://http:http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html?id=138479998495080361468)
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- Plusnet
- FTTC 80/20 - Sync 79,999/20,000
- PPPOE
- HG612 modem
- FTP max 28Mbps
- Result 71.2 Mbps (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html?id=138478343328119069078)
- Max 30 Mbps - see attached cap [1]
(https://forum.kitz.co.uk/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.thinkbroadband.com%2Fspeedtest%2Fbutton%2F138478343328119069078-mini.png&hash=c7cad0cf7f6440196c3964892ede2fd8c7e78fce)
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- Plusnet
- FTTC 80/20 - Sync presumed 79,999/20,000 ?
- LAN
- ECI modem, TG582n router
- FTP max 28Mbps down. flat 19Mbp up [2]
- Result 72.12 Mbps (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html?id=138478644953141557995)
- Max 30 Mbps - see attached cap [1]
(https://forum.kitz.co.uk/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.thinkbroadband.com%2Fspeedtest%2Fbutton%2F138478343328119069078-mini.png&hash=c7cad0cf7f6440196c3964892ede2fd8c7e78fce)
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Ive tried several times to get a decent PPPoE connection with the ECI modem.
For some reason I cant seem to get any upstream speed. :(
- Plusnet
- FTTC 80/20 - Sync presumed 79,999/20,000 ?
- PPPoE
- ECI modem
- FTP max 28Mbps down. 0 up[2]
- Result - Neither the TBB or speedtest.net will perform. BTw speedtest rest appended showing 72.81 down /0 up [3]
- Max 30 Mbps - see attached cap [1]
- FTP Max 28 Mbps - see attached cap [2]. upstream is 0.5kbps
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BT Infinity 2 80/20
FTTC 80/20 Sync Speed 66832/19999
HG612/Netgear R6300
LAN connection
61.56 Mbps(https://forum.kitz.co.uk/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.thinkbroadband.com%2Fspeedtest%2Fbutton%2F13847949471067484755.png&hash=003395021f7c2b5c0bb29e4f7b0c2f0d8b1f099d)
FTP downloads of those large files I'm getting similar speeds, approx 62Mbps. First time I tested though I only got 23Mbps. Which is weird. That didn't change until I finished the download and restarted another.
HTH
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Thank you very much pettaw, at least that tells me it is possible to get more than 30Mb on the http files.
It is interesting to note you only got 23Mbp the first time though and also your speedtest is showing as 18Mbps per thread.
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Ive tried 4 times now to get a decent PPPoE connection with the ECI modem.
but for some reason I cant seem to get any upstream speed. :(
Ive had to switch back to using the TG582n to be able to post the rest results.
- Plusnet
- FTTC 80/20 - Sync presumed 79,999/20,000 ?
- PPPoE
- ECI modem
- FTP max 28Mbps down. 0 up[2]
- Result - Neither the TBB or speedtest.net will perform. BTw speedtest rest appended showing 72.81 down /0 up [1]
- Max 30 Mbps - see attached cap [2]
- FTP Max 28 Mbps - see attached cap [3]. upstream is 0.5kbps
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I didn't see the 18Mbps per thread? Where did you see that number on my speedtest [confused]
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Sorry - you dont. I was being stupid :-[
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You can have my TBB speedtest
BT 40/10
LAN 1 gigabit port HH3 to MB with a gigabit lan port
HG612
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Cheers thats great. Shows that your burst speed is still about the same as your overall speed.
Ive looked at Zen, Sky and BT speedtests Ive found elsewhere and none of those either are showing the 30Mbps restriction.
Ive tested the speed of my LAN between 2 PCs and that seems perfectly fine.
Not sure now if its my connection or a PN thing. I guess Ive done all I can here so its over to Plusnet.
Someone kindly tested the ftp server details I put up from a Zen connection, so that also seems specific to me/pn.
Therefore I'll delete the ftp details now.
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yeah kitz I can tell you before I even do the test I will get good single threaded results, no such problems with BT, but I will do a test now.
--edit-- test done. during the test live dumeter graph was flatlined max.
(https://forum.kitz.co.uk/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.thinkbroadband.com%2Fspeedtest%2Fbutton%2F138519940804532974202.png&hash=09a6ccb2748fee532f3f6ce591e7146842d92933) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html?id=138519940804532974202)
also I regurly use single threaded FTP servers to download various things, rarely any speed issues.
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du meter snapshot downloading 50meg file twice of tbb file page.
1st can see it ramped up slowly but did max before file downloaded. 2nd which was same file again ramped up instantly due to the connection been trained.
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Connection - Cat6 running full 1Gbps
ISP - BT Infinity2 (fully unlimited)
Connection speed - 80/20 (modem reporting 19999/79995 with max of 30710/87613)
Router/Modem - Home hub 5a running in VDSL2 mode (f/w 4.7.5.1.83.8.173.1.4 (Type A))
Router reported stats......
Noise margin: 14.2 / 7.5
Line attenuation: 0.0 / 10.7
Signal attenuation: 0.0 / 10.8
Single thread downloads (using stopwatch)......
1GB = 1min 57.1 sec (showing between 9.387 and 9.415 MB/s)
512MB = 1min dead (same as above)
TTB download........
(https://forum.kitz.co.uk/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.thinkbroadband.com%2Fspeedtest%2Fbutton%2F138521012647735517729.png&hash=2a94642a7bd443fcdfd9a32897831139c1a85b2e) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html?id=138521012647735517729)
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BT ftw over plusnet :)
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I think it might be time to move to Zen Kitz... what you think? >:D
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Thank you so very much everyone that posted their results - most appreciated and helped for the sake of elimination :)
I have been looking into this and I am almost there.
(https://forum.kitz.co.uk/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.thinkbroadband.com%2Fspeedtest%2Fbutton%2F138530813881758336892-mini.png&hash=76088e5733c71d99a3d147fbf460993a4ea79dc1)
Without going into great detail and all the testing and messing around Ive had, but this appears to be something to do with Receive Windows Auto-Tuning.
Its now turned off and although it may take a while to get to full speed at least it is doing so. Not sure what caused the problem on my network, but something has. I need to spend some more time on this but next area to research is mapped network drives.
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PS it may also not have been helped by my Intel NIC, which has now been removed and Im using the onboard LAN card.
Simply swapping cable between the 2 should not have caused my PC to die and refuse to boot back up (http://forum.kitz.co.uk/index.php?topic=13283.0).
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recieve windows auto tuning controls your tcp recieve buffers, I made the point on that in your speedtouch filtering thread as well.
turning it off tho isnt a fix, its a workaround, you have something broken if it been enabled breaks your speeds.
I suggest trying this before disabling it.
netsh int tcp set global autotuning=highlyrestricted
The settings have following affects.
Disabled will set a static tcp buffer that is under 65k so doesnt use the rfc1323 large windows, it exists to avoid compatability issues with certian old routers, and when tcp headers get ignored etc. The disadvantage is obvious, when you download from higher latency locations your speed will be restricted, unless multi threads make up for it.
highlyrestricted - allows automatic tuning of buffer size dynamically but will do very conservatively and caps it to a max size of 256k.
restricted - has the same cap as normal which I believe is a multi mbyte buffer but it grows the window size more conservatively.
normal - default setting, in my view too agressive.
experimental - removes the cap so can grow to extreme sizes, not sure if it also grows more agressively as well.
On many routers I have found normal to cause issues, but highlyrestricted works fine, on my asus running tomato asus both normal and restricted work although I prefer to use restricted.
also worth pointing out 'disabled' (edited made mistake) restricts upload performance by keeping the tcp send buffers small as well, and one reason why my speedtest upload ramped up fast (as ronski may know) is I have manually tuned my tcp send buffers since the default windows settings arent fitting for FTTC.
Usually intel nic's are considered the best in the business as well. I actually turned off my onboard nic and am using a intel nic.
--edit below--
its not possible in vista and newer to manually set the download tcp buffer size to your desire like in XP. For the upload buffer size the max size can be configured manually but its a not very well known registry setting.
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Cheers, Chrys. Only just seen this post & I dont foresee being able to do anything more on this until the weekend.
urning it off tho isnt a fix, its a workaround, you have something broken if it been enabled breaks your speeds.
My thoughts entirely and although things are much better, I'm not happy with the situation and know that I need to do a lot more digging to find out what caused it in the first place.
With it turned off, speed takes a while to ramp up. Multi-threading is fine, but Im still seeing slow page loading on sites that I havent been to before.
Usually intel nic's are considered the best in the business as well. I actually turned off my onboard nic and am using a intel nic.
I thought so too, but the PC is still sat with its lid off waiting for me to get some time to play again with the settings... and see how it behaves when I put the Intel one back in. At least atm I do have a working PC, even if the WAN isnt running to its full potential.
Hopefully after the w/e I can have some better news :)
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Seen similar before and its usually down to a "dodgy" NIC/switch.
If its GigE then jumbo frames is where I'd start, most consumer kit (NASs being a poster child) can't cope with anything over 4k properly. For example Windows 7 can be made to throw a wobbly with some WD NAS just by selecting a 9k frame - you'll see MrSMB errors and it'll cause multiple browser election nonsense. Edit - while its dealing with this then SMB seems to hog the NIC.
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I have ordered a MAC of BT. However the plusnet speedtest results concern me a bit, its defenitly a risk as BT has immaculate performance and I am jumping into a 18month contract.
I am considering going to plusnet cause. (with pro addon).
Static ip
UK online support.
My sync is below my estimate (as new estimate from isp is based on clean estimate). I guess this will make it easyish to get plusnet to investigate.
Plusnet do those tests on demand as did for BE.
I am keeping line rental with BT tho, I considered switching but with plusnet when using line rental saver the free weekend calls are removed (is not with BT).
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I'm with plus net, and have line rental saver, which I renewed a little while ago and I'm sure that I still have free evening and weekend calls included.
Ps I'll send you a PM in the a moment.
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if its regarding refferal I can use your username no problem.
Just bear in mind I havent got a MAC yet and even tho I ordered it online I expect a retention call from BT to make it diffilcult.
Also the decision isnt 100% yet either.
On the plusnet order page when selecting line rental saver the weekend package is removed. It also cant be added, for new plusnet customers weekend package is monthly line rental only. I signed up for BT's free caller display which now makes it harder to move voice as well. also plusnet have a monthly fee for ringback. So I wasnt attracted to moving my voice service.
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Thanks Chrysalis :thumbs: If you do move you do, and if you it you don't move then you don't.
That's sneaky of them removing the evening and weekend calls when taking line saver. I used to pay £3 a month for a calls feature package for caller ID & ring back, until I realised we never user ring back enough to warrant the £2 we were paying for it, so now we just have £0.99p charge for caller ID. We've spent 10p on ring back in the last year.
We now very rarely use the land line, we all have mobiles with more than enough minutes.
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I am tryng to think do mobiles have ringback facilities?
Ringback is useful for places like my GP surgery which get jammed up in the morning with everyone fighting for an appointment.
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Can't say I've ever tried on a mobile, but I do find more and more places where ring back doesn't work, especially on business lines, and my doctors.
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I got the MAC, was delivered to me, no call to haggle with me.
But I am hesitating, I think it looks dodgy these graphs arent available.
http://www.plus.net/support/service/network_performance/network-latency.shtml
Whats really annoying me is that there is no trial period or monthly contract option, I dont want to join, have performance issues and be stuck for 18 months.
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If it's any help there are these TBB ping graphs http://community.plus.net/ping-graphs/ for Plus Net users
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Yeah but I wanted to see those specific graphs, and the thread kitz made on plusnet looks very dodgy, I think kitz spent several hours chasing a problem which was plusnet's side.
I will email plusnet sales, if they give me a opt out within 30 days if I dont like I will sign up, otherwise need a long hard think.
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Where is Kitz thread you refer to, I'll be interested to read it?
These are my bugbears/ problems I've had with Plus Net, and I've been with them for over 10 years.
They are very slow to update to new products, and seem to keep them in trial for a long time.
I took care of a major problem for my brother when he joined PN at a house he just moved into, this was entirely ORs fault - his new line went dead on the day his broadband should have been connected, his phone was connected a few days before. Turns out an engineer nicked his line for someone else, he then ended up on a DACS. The problem I had with PN was we ended up going round in circles, it seemed each new support person never read the entire tickets, so they would try something someone else had already tried and kept coming up against OR saying there was nothing wrong, and then no lines available, amongst various other excuses. In the end I raised a CEO level complaint with BT and it was rectified within a week.
I highly suspect all of the bigger ISP operate a similar support system where no one person looks after a problem from start to finish. After I raised the complaint above, I dealt with one person at PN, and I received fantastic service, shame it can't be like that all the time.
I have maybe one or two other issues over the years, and they were all solved very quickly.
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just posted it on ttb, its here.
http://community.plus.net/forum/index.php/topic,120303.16.html
kitz I guess ideally should respond but it looks like she was generous blaming her own equipment as when she said her speedtests started speeding up later in the night without explanation that shouts out to me isp congestion.
There was also a guy posting says he routinely sees unecrypted ftp slow down but encrypted is fast aka plusnets prioritisation system slowing it down. His comment doesnt bother me as much since I can order pro to put everything in gold, but if http is slowing down (which is in gold) then thats a big problem.
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Ronski it seems the ringback monthly fee isnt needed, plusnet have more info very hidden away a bit sly.
http://www.plus.net/home-broadband/tariffs/
However they not working out much cheaper than BT. A ton of added costs if I dont move phone,
4 months discount of £8 lost on bb only = £32 (granted this isnt an extra cost just lost discount)
free installation £50
£2.50 per month 18 month contract £45 (although with this is still cheaper than BT but not cheaper if also take pro)
either the margins on line rental are very generous (believable given the wholesale price drops coinciding with above inflation price increases) or plusnet really believe most people make lots of landline calls given these price differences. Within 5 years line rental will cost more than fiber broadband.
the weekend calls thing may not be a huge issue but theire agressiveness to get line rental is annoying.
complicated a bit that a few days ago I signed up to BT's free caller display as they had a 7 dec deadline.
list of changes to new customers.
doubled connection cost to call 6p to 13p
essentials package previously free weekends
essentials now nothing inclusive
weekend package used to be evenings and weekends
now its weekends only
I find it hard to swallow I will be subsidising older customers if signing up to phone.
Skipping the phone I pay the install fee and extra £2.50 month and waive my discount (the discount would cover half my penalty to BT for leaving 2 months early).
The call connection fees and cost of calls is very similiar to BT (for new customers) But BT gives free weekend and evenings on line rental saver.
Line rental saver with BT if i renew I am fairly sure is more expensive than plusnet but no caller display to pay. So I think with that added its roughly even so BT actually wins unless you/I can get me on the old prices.
It does seem if I move I have to either have less value on calls or broadband, one or the other. I gain static ip and uk tech support, lose probable better performing network.
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Wow, a call set up price of almost 14p :o
As I said earlier I realised the monthly fee for ring back was excessive a long time ago, you'd have to use it more than twenty five times in a month if paying for the feature, or more than twenty times if you have the caller display & ringback package for £3 to make it cost effective.
I've not noticed any of these new prices and/or restrictions as we very rarely use the land line now.
Do you and other members of the household have mobiles? You really should be factoring that into your monthly costings, presuming you get good reception.
My wife is with Orange, she pays £7.50 a month for 250 minutes, 250Mb data and I forget how many texts. I'm sure I could now find her a better value deal.
I'm with Three, which have some fantastic Sim only packages, yesterday I upgraded to the One Plane, which costs me £15 a month for 2000 minutes, 5000 3 to 3 minutes, 5000 texts and all you can eat data which includes tethering. Tethering is the reason I upgraded, I was previously on the SIM600 plan for £12 a month.
My two daughters both have the 321 PAYG, 3p per minute, 2p per text and 1p Mb, on their old ASDA PAYG sims £10 would last many months (luckily!) and Three is much cheaper.
So you can see we have absolutely no reason to use the land line, it took a while to get the wife to stop using the land line though. The only time we use it is if we have an odd ball number to call, but I'm not sure which is the cheapest. Sometimes we still use it in the free periods, but rarely.
In the last 12 months we've spent £6.47 with PN on telephone calls. In the same period in 2012 £17.70, and 2011 was £56.65.
I can see many people doing the above, and this has got to hurt call revenue for ISPs like PN.
I source all our mobiles from Ebay, so I get them cheap, the wife and daughters all have ZTE Blades which they are happy with although they keep running out of memory. I have an S4 I got cheap from a friend when he got a free upgrade that he didn't want. So we only need SIMs and don't pay over the odds for contract phones. Before my S4 I got an S2 for about £120, it was a brilliant phone and a nice size, I sold that on to my brother. The S4 is a bit big but was a bargain I couldn't refuse.
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You right landlines are 'almost' obselete, especially with these pricing tactics. But obviously one still seeks for good value.
My landline does occasionally get used, usually its for 0845,0800 numbers or if I need to use ringback. As I mentioned before I occasionally use ringback, but ringback is cheaper on plusnet than BT, the order form gives the impression the £2.50 fee is required to use ringback, not even smallprint next to it. But it isnt, its just a fee for unlimited use.
To give you an idea how vulgar I find these prices (including all landline providers) here is what I pay for my mobile.
£13 month.
800 mins (excluding 01/02/03/08 numbers)
unlimited calls to 01/02/03 numbers
inclusive caller display, inclusive voice mail.
can use the phone anywhere not just in my house, and has better quality call quality.
so yeah with that deal, I hardly use my landline but my mobile is pricy for 0845 and isnt free for 0800. Plus I think ringback doesnt work on mobiles.
I see now also BT are doing a free offer where for a year 60mins per month free to mobiles, no fee. So comparing the 2 line rental savers, BT's is about £1 more comes with free caller display (if signed up before 7 dec), weekend calls, 60mins to mobiles. BT's weekend calls dont include 0845 tho unlike plusnet.
But after analysing the prices it seems BT have covertly got plusnet to a pricing level (along with the 18month contracts) closer to BT retail then people realised, but of course it is more suited to technical users with its static ips and uk support staff which is why I am interested in moving.
I dont like zen's approach to line faults so I am avoiding zen, aaisp is still on my radar but the usage limit although I think is enough for me is a psychological thing where on back of mind know have to keep an eye on it. BT business for a static ip is a huge price premium and traffic is still shaped on it.