Kitz ADSL Broadband Information
adsl spacer  
Support this site
Home Broadband ISPs Tech Routers Wiki Forum
 
     
   Compare ISP   Rate your ISP
   Glossary   Glossary
 
Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

Pages: 1 [2]

Author Topic: What is a Full Intrusive Line Test  (Read 9738 times)

kitz

  • Administrator
  • Senior Kitizen
  • *
  • Posts: 32198
  • Trinity: Most guys do.
    • http://www.kitz.co.uk
Re: What is a Full Intrusive Line Test
« Reply #15 on: May 16, 2016, 08:51:01 PM »

Its interesting the difference between WOOSH/WHOOSH

Originally the WOOSH toolset evolved as a suite of tools for Wholesale based ISPs based from the One Shot test.

The suite of tools was only available to Wholesale Only Operatives..  therefore Im guessing it will some combination of the highlighted initials.

Below is a screen cap from about 2005 showing the WOOSH tool set and results from the One Shot Check
http://www.kitz.co.uk/adsl/images/WOOSH.gif


KBD = Knowledge Based Diagnostics for ISPs which replaced the WOOSH test.
Logged
Please do not PM me with queries for broadband help as I may not be able to respond.
-----
How to get your router line stats :: ADSL Exchange Checker

Black Sheep

  • Helpful
  • Kitizen
  • *
  • Posts: 4963
Re: What is a Full Intrusive Line Test
« Reply #16 on: May 16, 2016, 08:52:33 PM »

this looks like GEA service test

https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwiDiJWrq9_MAhUgOsAKHezeBckQFgglMAE&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.btwholesale.com%2Fassets%2Fdocuments%2FOrders_and_Faults%2FBT_Wholesale_Diagnostics_Guide_v1.pdf&usg=AFQjCNEr1K983g8Yt_gVgAt9dTatX4mynA

Thanks for that NS ............... Knowledge Based Diagnostic = KBD. This is a BT Wholesale tool it appears, and can see the benefits of the intrusive test should a network fault be prevalent ??

An identified network fault would see the task be progressed to a relevant-skilled engineer, and a broadband fault would not be raised at this time. If the network test passes, then the DSL test results will be interpreted and a decision made from there.

If a subsequent DSL fault is raised, then the GEA testing we perform via WHOOSH is completely non-intrusive.
Logged

kitz

  • Administrator
  • Senior Kitizen
  • *
  • Posts: 32198
  • Trinity: Most guys do.
    • http://www.kitz.co.uk
Re: What is a Full Intrusive Line Test
« Reply #17 on: May 16, 2016, 09:07:27 PM »

I'm wondering... and this is only just supposition on my part.

Facts

The original WOOSH test was only available to Wholesale based ISPs, and many, many years ago the likes of Sky kicked up a stink because there was no equivalent for LLU diagnostics.   

We then went through a silly phase when WOOSH was withdrawn and neither the ISPs nor visiting BT engineers had access to any of the WOOSH data.  KBD was then developed for the ISPs and Openreach engineers got W(H)OOSH back.

Supposition.

What was originally WOOSH, got renamed to WHOOSH for Openreach Engineers?
Its only when performed by the ISP that it becomes intrusive?    I can guarantee you that when I asked Plusnet to perform that GEA test on my line last year,  it definitely made me lose sync.


Also noted is the fact that you said your WHOOSH GEA test gave you some slightly different info as well as to what the ISPs get.   I wonder if for the sake of the LLU ISPs that part of the service does have to be disconnected?     

Logged
Please do not PM me with queries for broadband help as I may not be able to respond.
-----
How to get your router line stats :: ADSL Exchange Checker

Black Sheep

  • Helpful
  • Kitizen
  • *
  • Posts: 4963
Re: What is a Full Intrusive Line Test
« Reply #18 on: May 16, 2016, 09:16:38 PM »

Hmmm ??  :hmm: :hmm: The WHOOSH being for OR only seems to be a good fit ?? I wouldn't be surprised to hear that this is the case ??  :)
Logged

Black Sheep

  • Helpful
  • Kitizen
  • *
  • Posts: 4963
Re: What is a Full Intrusive Line Test
« Reply #19 on: May 16, 2016, 09:17:08 PM »

Maybe Ignition has some idea on this ??
Logged

Black Sheep

  • Helpful
  • Kitizen
  • *
  • Posts: 4963
Re: What is a Full Intrusive Line Test
« Reply #20 on: May 16, 2016, 09:27:43 PM »

Clever lady, kitz .............. it would appear that WHOOSH is indeed an engineer interface with WOOSH. Who knew ??  :) :)
Logged

burakkucat

  • Global Moderator
  • Senior Kitizen
  • *
  • Posts: 27503
  • Over the Rainbow Bridge
    • The ELRepo Project
Re: What is a Full Intrusive Line Test
« Reply #21 on: May 16, 2016, 09:31:04 PM »

I'm wondering if the difference between the ISP/CP tests and the Openreach tests are also related to the location of the "test head". I.e. from whence access to the EU's circuit is obtained?  :-\
Logged
:cat:  100% Linux and, previously, Unix. Co-founder of the ELRepo Project.

Please consider making a donation to support the running of this site.

kitz

  • Administrator
  • Senior Kitizen
  • *
  • Posts: 32198
  • Trinity: Most guys do.
    • http://www.kitz.co.uk
Re: What is a Full Intrusive Line Test
« Reply #22 on: May 16, 2016, 09:46:45 PM »

Yay... getting there between us. :thumbs:

I've also just found something which says what WOOSH stands for, although I've no idea where that person got the info from or who he is.  It seems odd that he should respond to a question some 6 years later.  - Link

Quote
WOOSH - Web Out Of Service Handler.

Note also the reply underneath from Openreachpeep who confirms what I said earlier that it was taken out of service due to in-equivalence. 
I couldnt recall the year, but I can certainly recall how the Openreach guys moaned about it (including Ezzer).
Logged
Please do not PM me with queries for broadband help as I may not be able to respond.
-----
How to get your router line stats :: ADSL Exchange Checker

NewtronStar

  • Kitizen
  • ****
  • Posts: 4834
Re: What is a Full Intrusive Line Test
« Reply #23 on: May 16, 2016, 09:49:58 PM »

Well I think this is good when your ISP can run a KBD test most of the time I thought they were messing around with saying please wait and then saying have you a mobile phone so we can call you back, it all seems very clear now  :thumbs:
« Last Edit: May 16, 2016, 09:55:55 PM by NewtronStar »
Logged

kitz

  • Administrator
  • Senior Kitizen
  • *
  • Posts: 32198
  • Trinity: Most guys do.
    • http://www.kitz.co.uk
Re: What is a Full Intrusive Line Test
« Reply #24 on: May 16, 2016, 09:57:52 PM »

According to the KBD gumph (see earlier post) ... its specifically the running of the "Copper Pair Test" in GEA Service Test which makes it intrusive.

Logged
Please do not PM me with queries for broadband help as I may not be able to respond.
-----
How to get your router line stats :: ADSL Exchange Checker

NewtronStar

  • Kitizen
  • ****
  • Posts: 4834
Re: What is a Full Intrusive Line Test
« Reply #25 on: May 16, 2016, 10:23:22 PM »

Just looking at the E2E access TEST: this is also intrusive.

E2E Access Test: Fibre service test, also known as the 'GEA Service Test' in the KBD tool. Please note: This test is for 21C Fibre only and is intrusive to the DSL service.
Logged

kitz

  • Administrator
  • Senior Kitizen
  • *
  • Posts: 32198
  • Trinity: Most guys do.
    • http://www.kitz.co.uk
Re: What is a Full Intrusive Line Test
« Reply #26 on: May 16, 2016, 10:34:10 PM »

Yep :)

On FTTC lines only, there's the GEA Service test.  It's also known as the E2E Access test and fully intrusive.

This is what I think they will have run for Shadow4dog.
Logged
Please do not PM me with queries for broadband help as I may not be able to respond.
-----
How to get your router line stats :: ADSL Exchange Checker

Black Sheep

  • Helpful
  • Kitizen
  • *
  • Posts: 4963
Re: What is a Full Intrusive Line Test
« Reply #27 on: May 17, 2016, 12:41:15 PM »

Yay... getting there between us. :thumbs:

I've also just found something which says what WOOSH stands for, although I've no idea where that person got the info from or who he is.  It seems odd that he should respond to a question some 6 years later.  - Link

Note also the reply underneath from Openreachpeep who confirms what I said earlier that it was taken out of service due to in-equivalence. 
I couldnt recall the year, but I can certainly recall how the Openreach guys moaned about it (including Ezzer).

Having slightly more time on my hands today, I've trawled our intranet for what 'WOOSH' could be an acronym for and nowhere at all does it suggest it is such. I've even found the original 'Detailed Design Document' and from the outset, it is just simply a word that is used with nothing to hide.

I tend to pride myself in knowing most of our acronyms/TLA's, from many years of practice ............. but I have never, ever seen any hint that WOOSH is anything other than a word, and I still stand by the thoughts above that it is simply an example of onomatopoeia ??  :) :) 
Logged

shadow4dog

  • Member
  • **
  • Posts: 38
Re: What is a Full Intrusive Line Test
« Reply #28 on: May 17, 2016, 01:01:28 PM »

Thank you for that excellent explanation.

They've run a 3 of these GEA Service Tests and they have a similar format to the one Kitz links to. I've included the text from one of them. I've no idea what interference observed on week days is all about... because it's missing from one that's run later (probably at the weekend!)

I don't know if it's worth getting Openreach to visit or not.

Thanks
Tim

Quote
KBD
EA Test Detail
Circuit ID   NA   Service ID   XXX
Test Outcome   Pass
Test Outcome Code   GTC_FTTC_SERVICE_0001
Description   GEA service test completed and no fault found but unable to check for customer equipment connected to modem.
Main Fault Location   OK
Sync Status   In Sync
Downstream Speed   66.0 Mbps
Upstream Speed   20.0 Mbps
Appointment Required   N
Fault Report Advised   N
NTE Power Status   PowerOn
Voice Line Test Result   Pass
Bridge Tap   Not Detected
Repetitive Electrical Impulse Noise   Not Detected
Estimated Line Length In Metres   305.6
Upstream Rate Assessment   Very Good
Downstream Rate Assessment   Low
Interference Pattern   Regular Interference Observed on Week Days
Service Impact   Retrains Observed
Interference Duration Longest Occurrence   From 07:15 to 07:30
Interference Location   Unknown
Home Wiring Problem   Not Detected
Downstream Policing Discard Rate   0.0
Customer Traffic Level   Upstream and Downstream Traffic Detected
Profile Name   0.128M-80M Downstream, Retransmission Low - 0.128M-20M Upstream, Error Protection Off
Time Stamp   2016-04-23T17:00:00
Parameters   MIN   MAX   AVG
Down Stream Line Rate   61.9 Mbps   67.1 Mbps   65.6 Mbps
Up Stream Line Rate   20.0 Mbps   20.0 Mbps   20.0 Mbps
Up Time   0.0 Sec   900.0 Sec   889.9 Sec
Retrains   0.0   1.0   0.0
Current and Last 15 Minute Bin Performance
Parameters   Last Traffic Count(Upto 15 mins)   Current Traffic Count(Upto 15 mins)
Start Time Stamp   2016-05-06T14:45:16.535+01:00   2016-05-06T15:00:16.535+01:00
Ingress Code Violation   0   0
Egress Code Violation   0   0
Errored Seconds   1   0
Severely Errored Seconds   0   0
Unavailable Seconds   0   0

Logged
Pages: 1 [2]
 

anything