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Author Topic: Infinity 2 Help with state of line.  (Read 8071 times)

vic0239

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Re: Infinity 2 Help with state of line.
« Reply #15 on: February 24, 2015, 06:10:40 PM »

Thanks for the advice. I did notice the dramatic drop in the SNRM earlier today and wish I knew the cause. There were power issues in the village this morning (10 min outage around 7.00) so I wonder if this is related. I'll resync and see whare I get to.  Andy.
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vic0239

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Re: Infinity 2 Help with state of line.
« Reply #16 on: February 25, 2015, 09:18:59 AM »

Looks like (to my untrained eye) the line has been stable overnight since the resync, but there are still some errors. My IP profile has dropped by the 10 meg as expected which leaves me still within the clean range of the availability checker.

 A couple of questions if I may:

- Is the 10 meg lost  forever or if the source of the interference is removed will my attainable rate rise again?
- If the drop is due to crosstalk, am I likely to see such a drop each time a new line is connected to the cabinet? It seems quite a drastic drop.
- Should I consider a different modem, would a more up-to-date device extract more from the line? I got the HG612 cheaply just to see what was going on with the line after the BT hub started misbehaving less than a day after installation.

Many thanks … Andy.
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burakkucat

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Re: Infinity 2 Help with state of line.
« Reply #17 on: February 25, 2015, 05:10:07 PM »

A couple of questions if I may:

- Is the 10 meg lost  forever or if the source of the interference is removed will my attainable rate rise again?

If the drop was down to a bout of interference, then you may regain that 10 Mbps.

Quote
- If the drop is due to crosstalk, am I likely to see such a drop each time a new line is connected to the cabinet? It seems quite a drastic drop.

As I understand it, from others who have closely watched their own circuits' behavior, the initial drop is the biggest and each subsequent drop is less than the previous one. (It can be visualized by comparing with a half-life curve, for example.)

Quote
- Should I consider a different modem, would a more up-to-date device extract more from the line? I got the HG612 cheaply just to see what was going on with the line after the BT hub started misbehaving less than a day after installation.

That is really your personal choice. I will say that the HG612 is a "well understood" device when unlocked and used as a pure bridge (just as Beattie Bellman planned) . . .
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vic0239

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Re: Infinity 2 Help with state of line.
« Reply #18 on: February 25, 2015, 09:50:30 PM »

Ok, thanks for that burakkucat, I'll ponder over the choice of modem some more.

Now, I really must get myself an "ology" on this complex topic of FTTC technology.

Andy.
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vic0239

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Re: Infinity 2 Help with state of line.
« Reply #19 on: February 26, 2015, 05:06:56 PM »

Line still looking stable today thanks goodness. Thanks to all for your help.

As an aside, I was out walking today and returning home past the telephone exchange saw a Kelly van parked outside. My heart immediately sank and as I got closer I could see the guy crouched by the FTTC cabinet doing his worst (or so I thought). As I neared the van I had to step over a long length of twisted pair cable from the cabinet to the van (it’s behind the wall adjacent to the pavement). The cable led to his Openreach modem and line testing device sitting on the passenger seat! Well I suppose he needed to check the line before visiting the customer’s premises. Fortunately when I got home, no change in my stats. Phew!  :)
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burakkucat

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Re: Infinity 2 Help with state of line.
« Reply #20 on: February 26, 2015, 05:38:25 PM »

Thank you for the update.

I don't think that Kelly Communications "odd job man" was accessing the FTTC but just the PCP . . .  :-X
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WWWombat

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Re: Infinity 2 Help with state of line.
« Reply #21 on: February 26, 2015, 06:02:17 PM »

Looks like (to my untrained eye) the line has been stable overnight since the resync, but there are still some errors. My IP profile has dropped by the 10 meg as expected which leaves me still within the clean range of the availability checker.

Yup - all looks cleaner, with a manageable ES rate.

Quote
- Is the 10 meg lost  forever or if the source of the interference is removed will my attainable rate rise again?

If the drop in SNR is permanent, then your loss of speed is too. With such a sharp change, and having stayed that way since, it looks to be permanent; as long as that user keeps their modem powered.

Quote
- If the drop is due to crosstalk, am I likely to see such a drop each time a new line is connected to the cabinet? It seems quite a drastic drop.

The effect of each new subscriber is random, as it mostly depends on the construction of the cable bundles that your line pairs share - how close together the pairs lie, and how long a distance they share that proximity. This means you might see large drops or small drops, in any order. This particular drop does seem very large, so I wouldn't expect many of that order; luckily the latest one seems to have had little impact.

From the way FTTC is deployed - with tie pairs between the FTTC cab and the old PCP, we know that there is always some amount of line shared, and that it is at the most susceptible point, when the transmitted power is at its highest, so we should always expect *something*.

Overall, the graphs used to show how effective vectoring is, also show how bad crosstalk can be - with the worst case speeds being half that of the theoretical best case. Thankfully, the worst case does not happen much, and you should mostly expect to stay within your clean range estimates.

Quote
- Should I consider a different modem, would a more up-to-date device extract more from the line? I got the HG612 cheaply just to see what was going on with the line after the BT hub started misbehaving less than a day after installation.
It probably isn't needed. The broadcom chipset in the HG612 doesn't seem to be markedly worse than anything newer.
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vic0239

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Re: Infinity 2 Help with state of line.
« Reply #22 on: February 26, 2015, 06:48:25 PM »

I don't think that Kelly Communications "odd job man" was accessing the FTTC but just the PCP . . .  :-X
Well whatever it is called it was the shiny new one recently installed. ;)

Thanks WWWombat, your comments have eased my mounting OCD over the horrifying earlier stats and I can now view them as a useful tool not something to worry about at all day long!  ;D

Thanks again.
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burakkucat

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Re: Infinity 2 Help with state of line.
« Reply #23 on: February 26, 2015, 07:25:53 PM »

I don't think that Kelly Communications "odd job man" was accessing the FTTC but just the PCP . . .  :-X
Well whatever it is called it was the shiny new one recently installed. ;)

Just had a thought.  ::)  You mentioned that the cabinet was outside the telephone exchange. Was you line previously EO (exchange only) / a DEL (direct exchange line)? If so, that nice new shiny cabinet would be one of two, PCP for telephony and FTTC for Internet access.

There could be one other explanation -- that a "combined" cabinet (PCP & FTTC) has been fitted. (But so far, I have only read about their deployment in N. Ireland.)
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vic0239

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Re: Infinity 2 Help with state of line.
« Reply #24 on: February 26, 2015, 07:58:42 PM »

No the line has never been EO although I think there are some. From what I gleaned from the engineer my cabinet (no 3) sits outside the exchange (just visible if one leans over that wall) and serves the majority of the village. The new cabinet is adjacent to it. Probably the extent of the fibre run is about 6 metres to this new cabinet from the exchange. There are no other new cabinets in the village.
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burakkucat

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Re: Infinity 2 Help with state of line.
« Reply #25 on: February 26, 2015, 09:50:53 PM »

I see. Thank you for that information.  :)
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vic0239

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Re: Infinity 2 Help with state of line.
« Reply #26 on: March 03, 2015, 09:21:55 AM »

Well it looks like my crosstalk inducing neighbour switched their modem off for a short while yesterday evening. The DS value appears to have returned to where it was, but the US has remained at a considerably higher value. Pity it wasn't the other way around!  :(
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vic0239

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Re: Infinity 2 Help with state of line.
« Reply #27 on: March 15, 2015, 11:44:57 AM »

Received a notification from MDWS not long ago advising I had a resync on my line, reason 1 RDI, followed by a further email to advise G.INP was now enabled. Looks like it is interleaved as well. I’m puzzled as thought my line had settled down although the sync speed has now increased.

Is this part of the rollout or have I suffered some interference on my line? 11am seems a peculiar time to interrupt the connection.
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burakkucat

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Re: Infinity 2 Help with state of line.
« Reply #28 on: March 15, 2015, 03:10:39 PM »

I would agree that 1100 hours is a peculiar time for intervention. However the plus point is that your circuit is now operating with G.Inp configured as active.
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vic0239

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Re: Infinity 2 Help with state of line.
« Reply #29 on: March 15, 2015, 03:22:02 PM »

Thanks burakkucat. I wasn't certain it was a good thing when I posted, but further reading of the forum and related articles have eased my concern. This is a fascinating subject and takes me back to my time when I worked with FDDI/ATM networks which I had long forgotten.  :)
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