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Author Topic: Possible Interference?  (Read 18278 times)

snadge

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Re: Possible Interference?
« Reply #30 on: October 01, 2012, 07:36:40 PM »

is the noise present all the time or is it rising at peak times? have you ran/checked the scripts we have been using?

personally I would run the scripts for 24 hours and look at the SNRM over time and see if its gradually kicking in, see how your Noise Margin drops to 4db as soon as its sync'd at 6db...meaning at that moment in time theres 2db worth of noise on the line...

if it were me I would monitor to see when it happens / or is at its worst and see if I can relate the timing to anything turning on or in use in my house, if not then I would turn every device off in my home (at the wall as standby is no good) except the router and use a laptop in the next room to check stats in the router via wifi - then check the QLN / SNR / SNRM and see if theres any difference, if so then you know its something in your home, turn on each device one by one until the QLN / SNR / SNRM changes then you have found the culprit... if the noise is still present when everything is turned off then its a neighbour or somewhere else down the line and could be hard to sort out.
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GigabitEthernet

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Re: Possible Interference?
« Reply #31 on: October 01, 2012, 08:29:25 PM »

Well, from my research, installing an RF3 filter may help things, would this be a good thing to do? I have also discovered that the iPlate has an RF3 filter built in, does the vDSL faceplate have the same?
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snadge

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Re: Possible Interference?
« Reply #32 on: October 01, 2012, 11:53:11 PM »

iPlate has RF3 built in? does it? hmm - I dont think the SSFP has (VDSL faceplate) - RF3 may be able to remove some noise but it can also remove some of your broadband signal, ive had no personal experience with RF3's this is just what I have been told, you could try it? have you already determined that the noise source is not in your home? , if not it will be worth trying to find that out before purchasing RF3 filter.

edit: an iPlate has a Bell-Wire filter on it (22mH choke which is a low-pass filter), I wonder if this is what your confusing with an RF3 filter (which is something else entirely different) ..?

if you have a filtered faceplate (which you have) then your bell-wire is already filtered (if its even connected, terminal 3)
« Last Edit: October 01, 2012, 11:58:54 PM by snadge »
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roseway

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Re: Possible Interference?
« Reply #33 on: October 02, 2012, 07:14:41 AM »

My only experience of an RF3 was when an OR engineer experimentally fitted one in the course of diagnosing a problem I had at the time. The effect of the RF3 was to reduce my connection speed by about 20%, so it was quickly removed again.
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  Eric

GigabitEthernet

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Re: Possible Interference?
« Reply #34 on: October 02, 2012, 07:34:19 AM »

edit: an iPlate has a Bell-Wire filter on it (22mH choke which is a low-pass filter), I wonder if this is what your confusing with an RF3 filter (which is something else entirely different) ..?

According to this, it does have an RF3.

Quote added for convenience:

Quote
We now have the BT 80B RF3 available to purchase online. These have the same inductor as the BT I Plate so if you installed the following you acheive the exact same result as the I Plate :-
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snadge

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Re: Possible Interference?
« Reply #35 on: October 02, 2012, 02:04:37 PM »

hmm thats odd - i may be wrong but I think they are two different things.

the Bell-Wire inductor is a 22mH choke that acts like a low-pass filter that wipes most of the xDSL signal from the ring-wire allowing only the phone signal to pass-through, this stops any interference thats in the xDSL part of the spectrum that's getting into the ringwire (which is only in your extension wiring in the home) from back-feeding into the xDSL signal itself, and its only partially/mostly successful... I think anyway.

the RF3 Filter attempts to strip interference from the xDSL signal (that may be introduced anywhere down the line from exchange to nte) without affecting the signal itself..but people have reported that it does so, if the noise is having a massive impact on your broadband then RF3 may remove it but may also take the broadband in that range with it too, but result is stable broadband, albeit with or without lower speed, as Roseway said he had 20% reduction in speed, I believe B'Kat also had one installed.

if you read the iPlate page on his website it says:

Quote
How?
    - Provide a filtered ‘bell wire’ which reduces the amount of noise picked up by home extension wiring from affecting the broadband ADSL signal.
    - Provide common mode filtering of RF signals without affecting frequencies in the ADSL band.

to me this implies it has both a 22mH inductor and RF3...possibly anyway

if you take a look at the pictures of each one, the bell-wire inductor is a small white rounded thing, the RF3 is a bigger black unit with lots of copper wire exposed, looks like they are wrapped around a magnet - the RF3 is slightly larger than the 22mH choke, not saying they cant make smaller one...but...

RF3 filter is usually more for removing noise from your telephone line
Bellwire Inductor is for removing noise from the bellwire in your home

..thats the way I see it anyway

one thing I can tell you is that the SSFP your using does not have RF3, but your faceplate might have 22mH Choke.. the Bell-Wire Inductor is now fitted onto the actual faceplate of newer NTE-5's , SSFP would not have RF3 because its used for a VDSL service and they wouldnt want anything messing with the signal. also if your master socket is the only socket you have then you do not have a bell-wire, and even if you did the SSFP filters the broadband from the phone signal BEFORE passing it on to the extension wiring, thats the whole point of filtered faceplate.

RF3 FILTER ------ 22mH CHOKE on back of NTE-5



maybe someone else can shed some light on this?

it wont hurt trying an RF3 anyway, at least you can remove it if it has a negative impact.
« Last Edit: October 02, 2012, 02:12:52 PM by snadge »
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GigabitEthernet

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Re: Possible Interference?
« Reply #36 on: October 02, 2012, 05:49:01 PM »

I have been doing some maintenance on my master socket (clearing up the wires), and I think the QLN is better. Could somebody confirm?
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snadge

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Re: Possible Interference?
« Reply #37 on: October 02, 2012, 05:57:48 PM »

yes theres defo improvement, especially up the higher end... what did you do/change exactly?
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GigabitEthernet

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Re: Possible Interference?
« Reply #38 on: October 02, 2012, 06:00:45 PM »

yes theres defo improvement, especially up the higher end... what did you do/change exactly?

BT wouldn't like it, but I just cleaned up the wires coming in from outside; I just made sure the wires were straight and there were no creases, then I just reconnected them to the back of the master socket 'plate' and it seems to be better.

I have got an iPlate coming tomorrow to see if that helps. I will probably order an RF3 filter, to see if that helps.


Thanks for your help so far everyone :).
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snadge

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Re: Possible Interference?
« Reply #39 on: October 02, 2012, 06:41:19 PM »

straight? how was the wiring before? I think it was poor contacts on the faceplate resulting in poorer common-mode noise rejection (noise cancellation in xDSL connection).. now you have cleaned the contacts they are making better contact and creating a slightly cleaner, more 'balanced' signal (and thus better noise rejection)...something like that anyway.

be interesting to see what the i-Plate does for you... because... can you sit that between the SSFP and Backplate? if you replace the SSFP with the i-Plate you will need to use a filter for phone & broadband and your DSL signal will route through to your extension sockets where it can be degraded, of course an i-plate is supposed to resolve that but its not 100% successfull at removing all noise from the bellwire (and if no wire on terminal 3 its a waste of time...well..for the inductor anyway)... a Filtered Faceplate is a much better solution than an i-Plate, unless of course it has an RF3 filter built in and that helps remove noise introduced into the line external to your home.

if your going to use both SSFP and i-Plate I think the i-Plate goes on first then the SSFP (which you will simply be using as a filter)

I would like to find out for sure if an i-Plate has an RF3 in it because everyone knows that RF3 can reduce broadband speed sometimes (if to make the line more stable), and for BT to sell it as a broadband accellerator would be daft when in some/most cases it would degrade speed - the whole point of the i-Plate was to remove noise from the bellwire (which increases speed)...thats it! which it does with the 22mH inductor - everyone used to say that if you removed the bellwire then i-Plate is waste of time...well that wouldnt be true if it had some magical RF3 filter that removes noise with no impact to broadband signal at all...everyone would be using them lol... doesnt add up for me.
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GigabitEthernet

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Re: Possible Interference?
« Reply #40 on: October 02, 2012, 07:07:25 PM »

...be interesting to see what the i-Plate does for you... because... can you sit that between the SSFP and Backplate?

This suggests it is possible.
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snadge

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Re: Possible Interference?
« Reply #41 on: October 02, 2012, 08:09:40 PM »

how was the wiring before you 'cleaned' it? wasnt running by any electrical wiring was it? (EMI)
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GigabitEthernet

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Re: Possible Interference?
« Reply #42 on: October 03, 2012, 07:27:01 AM »

how was the wiring before you 'cleaned' it? wasnt running by any electrical wiring was it? (EMI)

I don't think so. I only made sure the wiring wasn't creased and I put it back in more carefully.
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snadge

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Re: Possible Interference?
« Reply #43 on: October 03, 2012, 03:21:19 PM »

aye defo sounds like bad contacts..

got your i-Plate yet? my HG612 aint here...was hoping it would be today as was dispatched monday
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GigabitEthernet

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Re: Possible Interference?
« Reply #44 on: October 03, 2012, 09:06:14 PM »

Got the iPlate - didn't make any difference :(. I have now ordered an RF3 filter to see if that helps, if not, I will give up as there isn't really anything else I can do.
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