Kitz ADSL Broadband Information
adsl spacer  
Support this site
Home Broadband ISPs Tech Routers Wiki Forum
 
     
   Compare ISP   Rate your ISP
   Glossary   Glossary
 
Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

Author Topic: Sky - Help needed please....  (Read 4868 times)

cwight

  • Just arrived
  • *
  • Posts: 9
Sky - Help needed please....
« on: June 21, 2007, 01:20:43 PM »

Ok I'm dire need of some help. I've done lots of reserach on this issues and read the Kitz site.

I built my house about 18 mths ago and had a new BT line installed. When it was initially installed it had a dax or somwthing on the line and hence broadband wouldn't work. I go that removed and my got the broadband working. Went with Toucan and had constant problems with loss of snych and slow speeds. Left Toucan, and tried BT for 3 months but still a intermittent loss of synch and very slow speeds 125kbs. Also, the broadband often only works if I use the phone so I presume it's an SNR issue. I had 5 BT OpenReach engineers out to the house and they couldn't sort teh problem out. Somethimes by connection was ok and at other nothing...

Heard that Sky have unbundled my local exchange and moved to them (BT let me go and gave a refund since they couldn't sort the problem out. Went with Sky Max package because their own engineer  set the whole thing up for you. He was here last Tuesday and initially I was getting nearly 5mb and very happy. However, 15 mins after he left I lost synch again and I can only get broadband if I use the phone.

Sky level 3 tech support are very good, but of course, when I ring them the BB seems okay because I'm on the phone. Following the advice on Kitz main site I have looked at my stats and when I use the phone my SNR is about 15.5, however, once I put the phone down it drops to -1.5.

I just don't know what to do. Can I force BT to reinstall a new line as there is something obviously very wrong with this one. Or shiould I maybe just pay to have a new line installed and just use that for BB?

Help...I think I'm going mad, and I've spent a fortune on calls to tech support.... ???

« Last Edit: July 10, 2007, 01:30:35 PM by kitz »
Logged

kitz

  • Administrator
  • Senior Kitizen
  • *
  • Posts: 33881
  • Trinity: Most guys do.
    • http://www.kitz.co.uk
Re: Help needed please....
« Reply #1 on: June 21, 2007, 01:55:09 PM »

Hi and welcome.

It sounds like you have whats known as a "High Open" fault. 
The big clue is "when I use the phone my SNR is about 15.5, however, once I put the phone down it drops to -1.5.".

See ~ adsl only works when the phone is being used. for explanation.

Try the quiet line test on there to see if you can hear anything.
This really needs to be reported to BT as a 150 fault as the problem is likely somewhere in the local loop.
The problem will be that as soon as you mention adsl, they will try refer you back to your ISP.

These types of problems are normally due to oxydisation of one of the joints on your phone-line between your home and the exchange.
Logged
Please do not PM me with queries for broadband help as I may not be able to respond.
-----
How to get your router line stats :: ADSL Exchange Checker

cwight

  • Just arrived
  • *
  • Posts: 9
Re: Help needed please....
« Reply #2 on: June 21, 2007, 02:15:00 PM »

Thanks for the prompt reply. I've tried the quiet line test and all I get is a voice going 'quiet line test' and a load of hissing and crackling. I take it that the line should be totally silent.
Logged

cwight

  • Just arrived
  • *
  • Posts: 9
Re: Help needed please....
« Reply #3 on: June 21, 2007, 02:55:01 PM »

OK BT are just hopeless. The fault people say the line checks out fine and if they send an engineer out and he finds no fault they will charge me £150. They also say that since the fault is with the broadband it's not their problem even though it's the same line for both broadband and phone; and it's clearly the line taht is at fault; BT aren't one company supposedly. I despair. What about my suggestion of getting a new phone line installed? I just want it sorted as I work from home quite a bit.
Logged

kitz

  • Administrator
  • Senior Kitizen
  • *
  • Posts: 33881
  • Trinity: Most guys do.
    • http://www.kitz.co.uk
Re: Help needed please....
« Reply #4 on: June 21, 2007, 04:29:00 PM »

>> I've tried the quiet line test and all I get is a voice going 'quiet line test' and a load of hissing and crackling. I take it that the line should be totally silent.

Correct. The fact that you can hear noise during this test indicates a fault on the telephone line itself.
The hissing and crackling indicate resistance on the line, possibly caused by oxydisation of the joints or water etc.


>> They also say that since the fault is with the broadband it's not their problem

See my post above - as soon as you mention adsl then they try and fob you off back to the ISP. :(
You are now in a horrible loop because of what weve just round out/confirmed, if you explain all this to your ISP then they will say its an actual line fault and needs a BT line engineer rather than a BT adsl engineer.

>> if they send an engineer out and he finds no fault they will charge me £150

They legally have to warn you about that - so you have to be prepared and make sure that the fault isnt with any of your own equipment.  Check from the master socket, check that its not a faulty filter - because this could also cause similar symptoms.
Try the quiet line test from the master socket without any other equipment plugged in - if you can still hear the hissing then, youve done practically all that you can to eliminate that its not your own equipment.

151 is really the correct place where you should be reporting this type of fault. Unfortunately the people on the end of the phone dont understand how the actual systems work and as you are correctly trying to explain your findings as soon as you mention adsl then they close their ears "not our problem".

As long as you have done all that you can to eliminate that the fault isnt in your own equipment then you should be ok when the BT engineer arrives.  He will be more astute to these kind of problems.  The offer of tea and biccies whilst you explain what youve done re the quiet line test.  Explain that your adsl only works when the line is being used and "could there be the possibility of a high open fault".

If you dont get any joy with BT direct then the only course of action would be explaining our findings so far and hopefully they can pull out the stops on this one.  Not sure what the foreign call center at Be* are like Im afraid.

>> What about my suggestion of getting a new phone line installed?

They may well work, but you will have associated costs with that one too for the provision of both the new line installation..  and provision of adsl on the new line.

Obviously I cant say for sure because I dont want you lumbered with the £150 fee....  but if I were you, I'd go along the "performed all the tests I can here" BT route on 151.  Then offer tea to the engineer when he arrives ;)
Logged
Please do not PM me with queries for broadband help as I may not be able to respond.
-----
How to get your router line stats :: ADSL Exchange Checker

cwight

  • Just arrived
  • *
  • Posts: 9
Re: Help needed please....
« Reply #5 on: June 21, 2007, 06:07:12 PM »

Many thanks for the detailed replies. The problem is that if I disconnect the broadband then do the quiet test it is fine, but as soon as I do the test with the broadband connected it goes ballistically noisy. Would this still constituite a fault on the phone line rather than the broadband? i know it's basically the same cable taking multiple signals, but whenever I try and explain this to BT phone faults they simply say, 'no it's a broadband fault'...
Logged

kitz

  • Administrator
  • Senior Kitizen
  • *
  • Posts: 33881
  • Trinity: Most guys do.
    • http://www.kitz.co.uk
Re: Help needed please....
« Reply #6 on: June 21, 2007, 08:45:51 PM »

>> but as soon as I do the test with the broadband connected it goes ballistically noisy.

hmmm.... faulty filters?? 
adsl noise from the router leaking on to the region normally used for voice.
Do you have any spare filters you can try?
Logged
Please do not PM me with queries for broadband help as I may not be able to respond.
-----
How to get your router line stats :: ADSL Exchange Checker

cwight

  • Just arrived
  • *
  • Posts: 9
Re: Help needed please....
« Reply #7 on: June 21, 2007, 10:07:37 PM »

I've got loads of spare filters, but i don't use any. One of the many BT OpenReach engineers to come to look at the problem fitted an ADSL face plate. It's also supposed to be a high tech modern house (just built it myself) with cat 5 cable used throughout...

Sky have tonight admitted that they can do no more and are sending the problem on to BT.... I'm beginning to think that the only solution is to get a new line installed and try and reclaim the cost from BT if it sorts the problem out... The problem is that it's an itermittent fault; my current SNR is 25 Db....

Thanks again for your help.
Logged

kitz

  • Administrator
  • Senior Kitizen
  • *
  • Posts: 33881
  • Trinity: Most guys do.
    • http://www.kitz.co.uk
Re: Help needed please....
« Reply #8 on: June 22, 2007, 01:22:07 AM »

>> I've got loads of spare filters, but i don't use any

d'oh sorry Im being stupid - I did take onboard during your earlier post  :doh:
- then forgot later on since it was about the only other thing I could immediately think ok.

I'd normally ask if there was another router you could try just to rule that out - but since your on sky then it would mean using another sky box.  The cable from router to socket is about the only other thing I can think of - you seem to have already covered all those bases. 
I was trying to think of anything that it could be other than a high open fault just to make sure you have all bases covered.

>> and are sending the problem on to BT

Which means that it will most likely be an adsl engineer that comes out.  Just repeat same story to him, but he may have to call out a BT engineer to check the actual line.
Silly isnt it that you have to go all round the houses. :(

Good luck with the engineer and please let us know how it goes.
Logged
Please do not PM me with queries for broadband help as I may not be able to respond.
-----
How to get your router line stats :: ADSL Exchange Checker
 

anything