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Author Topic: Wiring cover plate in garage - about to convert garage - advice please  (Read 2115 times)

Weaver

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Re: Wiring cover plate in garage - about to convert garage - advice please
« Reply #15 on: January 30, 2018, 02:05:05 PM »

@bogof - to me change point of entry is the same thing as a socket move, just as radical as you like. Basically you get charged for one hour's anything you like and then a second hour won't be necessary I would think.

I had mine moved from downstairs to upstairs on a different side of the building so that there was then zero length of wire running around the outside and zero inside. The NTE5 (I have three) is right by the upstairs window and that's exactly the point where the drop cable at height hits the corner of the house. All in the goal of removing every last chance of local interference from sources in the house given my terrifyingly weak -66dB signal 4.55miles of (very good, thick) copper.

Best money I ever spent. Way back then, 8 years ago it was £120 for one hour, which sufficed iirc, and that was just to move and hugely shorten one line, as the other two lines hadn't been invented yet then. I can post up pics.

Have choc biscuits amongst your huge assortment ready, and _top_ coffee and tea. Although your BT man may be plagued with offers of tea already. And don't hover over the poor guy. Just be nearby if needed.

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Black Sheep

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Re: Wiring cover plate in garage - about to convert garage - advice please
« Reply #16 on: January 30, 2018, 02:21:55 PM »

I wasn't going to get involved as the thread was running along nicely, but this is a totally different scenario to your, Weaver .......

..... there's a world of difference between moving a dropwire, and relocating an underground feed that is 99% unlikely to be ducted. A world of difference.  ;) :) :)

Wallet at the ready ??
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Weaver

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Re: Wiring cover plate in garage - about to convert garage - advice please
« Reply #17 on: January 30, 2018, 02:23:58 PM »

Agrees with Blacksheep. Mea culpa. Underground is a damn nuisance - I had not noticed that bit. Anyway tho, BT are good, just ask for what you need and they make it happen.
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Westie

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Re: Wiring cover plate in garage - about to convert garage - advice please
« Reply #18 on: January 30, 2018, 06:12:07 PM »

On close inspection it appears the single black cable probably serves both our houses.

I'm sure you've already considered this, but if the black cable does serve two properties I'd also talk to the neighbour first before making any changes. (They might even be prepared to share the cost, if it worked in their favour too.)
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burakkucat

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Re: Wiring cover plate in garage - about to convert garage - advice please
« Reply #19 on: January 30, 2018, 08:08:42 PM »

A "Change point of entry" isn't the same as a "socket move" appointment, correct?

You are correct. You do not need a "socket move" appointment . . .  :no:

A "change of entry point" appointment implies adjustment to the incoming service feed, be it aerial or underground, and everything else in between the DP & the location where you require the NTE5 to be sited.
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bogof

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Re: Wiring cover plate in garage - about to convert garage - advice please
« Reply #20 on: January 30, 2018, 08:19:02 PM »

This seems like it is going to be a ball ache :(

I spoke to BTOR infrastructure.  Was a slightly surreal conversation as it turns out their office is actually on my road(!).  I walk past it maybe 15 times a week.

Yes, the service arrives underground into the cavity between the two houses.  Despite apparently there being a service hatch somewhere nearish the property according to the lady I spoke to, I'll be damned if I can see it (I wonder if it is in a flowerbed).

I have two options... a basic "overhead" engineering fee, which though the service is underground, if it could be within the realms of moving the cable a little within the houses could be done in a short space of time.  £127 inc VAT.

Any more needs a survey at £300, plus the works.  :(

It looks like the basic engineering fee route is a non-starter.  The cable coming out of the ground into the cavity between the two houses is quite tight, and I probably couldn't move it closer to where it needs to be without having to make holes in both my neighbour and my walls and having their internal wiring re-done as well if there isn't enough slack. (to give us both access to the new location).

The survey route is basically spending £300 to find out how much more it is going to cost.

Unless I'm missing something in the way of a route open to me; in a pragmatic mood I'm thinking better to re-make my line connections with jelly crimps to make it secure and likely to survive, cover the access panel as desired and if the worst comes to the worst, and the line degrades and my neighbours won't allow access then I'll be into a survey fee situation, in the meantime I'm saving the cost.

I'd love to leave access, but I can't see how to leave anything that could be considered useful access given the room layout.  At the end of the day, someone needs to be able to get access, get in tools and operate them, and be able to see what they're doing, for it to actually be useful.  I'll have a word with the builders when they get here tomorrow to see if they can see a way around.
« Last Edit: January 31, 2018, 06:44:01 AM by bogof »
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Deathstar

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Re: Wiring cover plate in garage - about to convert garage - advice please
« Reply #21 on: January 30, 2018, 08:51:18 PM »

 Can you just not create a wee door that you can open and close? Or slide in and out with a latch to secure it?

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

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Black Sheep

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Re: Wiring cover plate in garage - about to convert garage - advice please
« Reply #22 on: January 30, 2018, 08:53:52 PM »


Yes, the service arrives underground into the cavity between the two houses.  Despite apparently their being a service hatch somewhere nearish the property according to the lady I spoke to, I'll be damned if I can see it (I wonder if it is in a flowerbed).






In newer properties (circa 25-30yrs old ??) ...... there is a strip of land where the garden meets the road/pavement known as the 'Service strip' ..... they're approx. a metre wide and contain inspection chambers for the properties services.

These should be left clear and accessible, but I know from hundreds of personal experiences, they are usually covered with something for aesthetics.

Just for info really, in case your premises has one such strip ??

https://www.oxfordshire.gov.uk/cms/content/service-strips-public-highway-grass-verges
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Weaver

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Re: Wiring cover plate in garage - about to convert garage - advice please
« Reply #23 on: January 31, 2018, 05:45:52 AM »

Burakkucat is of course correct, I think I was oversimplifying. I meant ‘move socket and massive amount of gubbins attached to it and all necessary whatever needed’. I had an incredibly easy job, it was all just around the outside of the house anyway and totally accessible, which is very often the case.
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bogof

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Re: Wiring cover plate in garage - about to convert garage - advice please
« Reply #24 on: January 31, 2018, 02:56:05 PM »

In newer properties (circa 25-30yrs old ??) ...... there is a strip of land where the garden meets the road/pavement known as the 'Service strip' ..... they're approx. a metre wide and contain inspection chambers for the properties services.

These should be left clear and accessible, but I know from hundreds of personal experiences, they are usually covered with something for aesthetics.

Just for info really, in case your premises has one such strip ??

https://www.oxfordshire.gov.uk/cms/content/service-strips-public-highway-grass-verges

No such luck really.  We all have drives going up to our houses (a tight terrace of 35 year old houses) with just individual access for Gas / water meters etc through the block weave paving.

Did have some luck today.  I asked 2 people yesterday to cancel the engineer visit, yet the guy still turned up, real nice young lad.  He must have taken pity on the state of the wiring as he whipped out the old junction box and re-did the wiring for mine and my neighbours using jelly crimps, and placed them in a nice new grey tub with all the cables tied properly for relief.  He was able to do all that from my side.

He also said it is probably a big old job to do the move.  He reckons there will be a burried junction box somewhere under mine or my neighbours driveway (common for the time) and that getting the line moved would need digging that up and a new route of the cable into our property being made.

I'm minded to box it over for now, rely on access through next doors garage (though the newly terminated cables should hopefully be as good as it can be for what it is), and if I have to and if it comes to it at a later date I'll just have to bite the bullet and get it moved properly.
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runitdirect

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Re: Wiring cover plate in garage - about to convert garage - advice please
« Reply #25 on: January 31, 2018, 03:45:54 PM »

I personally think you are over thinking this. It's terminated & working. BTO have responsibility up to & including the NTE. If your line fails in the future it will be their problem to start digging driveways up & installing a new line. Plenty of buildings have cables installed in their fabric (although not normally in the cavity!). If it fails it easier to install new. Your property doesn't look that old? A Big hole like that in the party wall isn't ideal in any case! Brick it up & stop worrying (gel crimps will almost definitely last forever).
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licquorice

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Re: Wiring cover plate in garage - about to convert garage - advice please
« Reply #26 on: January 31, 2018, 03:55:37 PM »

The only comment I would make is that your neighbour would appear to have 'star wiring' with 2 cables connected to his incoming pair which he may or may not wish to regularise at some point.
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bogof

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Re: Wiring cover plate in garage - about to convert garage - advice please
« Reply #27 on: January 31, 2018, 04:50:28 PM »

I personally think you are over thinking this. It's terminated & working. BTO have responsibility up to & including the NTE. If your line fails in the future it will be their problem to start digging driveways up & installing a new line. Plenty of buildings have cables installed in their fabric (although not normally in the cavity!). If it fails it easier to install new. Your property doesn't look that old? A Big hole like that in the party wall isn't ideal in any case! Brick it up & stop worrying (gel crimps will almost definitely last forever).

Do you know if they still consider it their responsibility if you've done something like block an access hatch - or could they insist you do the work to move it?  I would think that becomes quite arguable.  I had thought myself that at the end of the day if it was blocked up and you asked for a new line they'd maybe come out and do some digging, though equally they might say there's supposed to be some wires there, go get em for us... :).

I'm with you personally now that it has been re-terminated to current standards - I think the circuit is as robust as it could be and I'm not going to go getting an expensive bit of work done to try and improve matters.  I also deeply dislike the hole on two counts.  One is the hole itself, and two is the neighbour has really easy access onto my phone line which could cause all manner of mayhem, clearly with no way to prevent this. 

The BTOR chap also commented on their lacklustre wiring, but I'm not really going to go there.  He was happy to re-terminate theirs too (at the end of the day I guess it is BT's network to do what they like with!).  It does me no benefit to start riffling around discussing the phone wiring with them as they're tenants in a private rented house and I don't want any aspersion of guilt coming my way if they have any issues in future - it is between them an BTOR and I'm not involved.
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anfield_92

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Re: Wiring cover plate in garage - about to convert garage - advice please
« Reply #28 on: January 31, 2018, 09:44:08 PM »

Do you know if they still consider it their responsibility if you've done something like block an access hatch - or could they insist you do the work to move it?  I would think that becomes quite arguable.  I had thought myself that at the end of the day if it was blocked up and you asked for a new line they'd maybe come out and do some digging, though equally they might say there's supposed to be some wires there, go get em for us... :).


This is a situation I come across daily in my area as we have a lot of estates where the underground feed goes directly into the property as opposed to an external wall. In this situation you would be given the choice of either making the feed accessible, or (for a fee) we would dig where the cable meets the house and re-route it into an external box.
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Black Sheep

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Re: Wiring cover plate in garage - about to convert garage - advice please
« Reply #29 on: January 31, 2018, 09:46:00 PM »

D'ya know, anfield ....... I almost posted the other day that I've only EVER seen this kind of scenario, when I've been on loan to Liverpool.

Nowhere else.  :)
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