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Author Topic: New Router - Line becomes noisy  (Read 1453 times)

Black Sheep

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Re: New Router - Line becomes noisy
« Reply #15 on: December 28, 2017, 09:03:00 PM »

That is exactly what is an SFI product ..... that is what is being considered in this debate, is it not ??

Openreach are never free, unless it's proven onto their network.

The 'normalisation' costs tend to be footed by the ISP on behalf of their ISP, I suppose as a goodwill gesture ??  :)
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risk_reversal

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Re: New Router - Line becomes noisy
« Reply #16 on: December 28, 2017, 10:44:16 PM »

So for clarity, in order to have my wiring 'normalised' (ie replace master socket with NTE5 and check wiring to extensions), do I need to call my ISP (Xilo / Uno) or my phone company, I am with BT?

Cheers
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NewtronStar

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Re: New Router - Line becomes noisy
« Reply #17 on: December 28, 2017, 10:59:09 PM »

Please forgive my stupidity but I am not clear on what you said below. What is this 'data socket' and could I also have my corded phone plugged into it?

Yes you can have BroadBand and Telephone going to Extension socket which has two ports of course it will need to be wired from the NTE5 & SSFP 1 pair for telephone the second pair for data (internet)

See this thread http://forum.kitz.co.uk/index.php/topic,20694.60.html

Have added a picture this will explain it all

[Image removed pending clarification of its origin - roseway]

« Last Edit: December 29, 2017, 07:22:57 AM by roseway »
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Black Sheep

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Re: New Router - Line becomes noisy
« Reply #18 on: December 29, 2017, 07:30:12 AM »

So for clarity, in order to have my wiring 'normalised' (ie replace master socket with NTE5 and check wiring to extensions), do I need to call my ISP (Xilo / Uno) or my phone company, I am with BT?

Cheers

Your ISP.

On a landline (phone issue), our remit is only to work on the PSTN side of the circuit, and if that is ok when we arrive at site, then it's adios from us.

They are two separate functions in 'our' eyes (us and the CP's/ISP's).

Take your circuit for example, if you were to raise a phone issue but the reality was that your star-wiring was actually causing broadband issues (star-wiring does not affect PSTN services) .... then BT would be miffed that Openreach spent up to a few hours normalising the wiring on their bill ...... seeing as you have broadband provided by Xilo/Uno.

Not ideal, we all know that and the debate has been done to death ............. it is what it is.  :)

 
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risk_reversal

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Re: New Router - Line becomes noisy
« Reply #19 on: December 29, 2017, 12:18:58 PM »

NewtronStar, that is most kind. Have watched a could of YouTube videos and can see what you mean now.

Black Sheep, many thanks for the clarity.

May I ask the following 3 and hopefully final questions

1. My current (LJU) master socket has a flush fitting face plate (with metal back box). I take it that the BT engineer will replace it with a flush fitting NTE5 face place.

2. Will the engineer replace the existing back box, or just re-use it. Presumably if the existing back box to the 'old' LJU master socket is left in situ the existing screw holes on it will line up with the new NTE5 face plate.

2. What 'flavour' of NTE5 is most likely to be fitted. My previous house had a NTE5A. But I understand that there is now a 'new' NTE5C.

Many thanks again for everybody's kind help.

Cheers


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Black Sheep

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Re: New Router - Line becomes noisy
« Reply #20 on: December 29, 2017, 12:38:07 PM »

Black Sheep, many thanks for the clarity.

May I ask the following 3 and hopefully final questions

1. My current (LJU) master socket has a flush fitting face plate (with metal back box). I take it that the BT engineer will replace it with a flush fitting NTE5 face place.

2. Will the engineer replace the existing back box, or just re-use it. Presumably if the existing back box to the 'old' LJU master socket is left in situ the existing screw holes on it will line up with the new NTE5 face plate.

2. What 'flavour' of NTE5 is most likely to be fitted. My previous house had a NTE5A. But I understand that there is now a 'new' NTE5C.

Many thanks again for everybody's kind help.

Cheers

Please bear in mind my reply is a generalisation, and not tailored to yours or anybody's, specific situation.

To answer your 3 questions at once (as they kind of all link together) ............... the engineer should replace your existing LJU for the latest NTE5C and also install a MK4 SSFP (filtered front-plate) as well, if required.

I would humbly suggest that 99% of the time, the existing sunken back-box will accommodate the newer faceplate without issue. If it doesn't, we will NOT replace the back-box as I'm afraid OR's policy is, and always has been, to only install flush-fitting fixtures such as cable, boxes and sockets.

The terminology has to be right here ......... flush-fitting in this instance means we would fix a new plastic back-box direct onto the plaster, as opposed to a sunken back-box that the electricians will have chased out and installed when the house was built.

Of the other 1% of occasions the new plate wont connect to the back-box, then it's a case of nattering with the customer and working out what is best for them. More often than not it may be a case of fitting a blanking plate to the older sunken back-box, and extending the cables into a position for the newer flush-fitting back-box .... which would be either above, below or to the side of the original box .... ensuring no wires are actually on show.

I hope this makes sense .... it does it my napper.  ;) ;D
 
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risk_reversal

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Re: New Router - Line becomes noisy
« Reply #21 on: December 29, 2017, 01:58:19 PM »

Bless you Black Sheep that is very informative.

I am now erring on the side of getting a telephone engineer to come and do this privately instead of going down the ISP route (with BT) so as to avoid the possibility of any unwelcomed surprises and to make sure this replacement is done as per my aesthetic requirements.

Cheers and many thanks

 

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Black Sheep

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Re: New Router - Line becomes noisy
« Reply #22 on: December 29, 2017, 02:37:34 PM »

Not a problem.  :)
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burakkucat

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Re: New Router - Line becomes noisy
« Reply #23 on: December 29, 2017, 06:21:41 PM »

I am now erring on the side of getting a telephone engineer to come and do this privately . . .

Most local (free) newspapers have a classified advertisements section and, more often than not, one may find the services of a retired (or ex) GPO/PO Tel/BT/Openreach engineer (technician) there listed.
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Black Sheep

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Re: New Router - Line becomes noisy
« Reply #24 on: December 29, 2017, 06:30:29 PM »

Most local (free) newspapers have a classified advertisements section and, more often than not, one may find the services of a retired (or ex) GPO/PO Tel/BT/Openreach engineer (technician) there listed.

Alas, you still come across either ex-job, or electricians, or others .... that unfortunately haven't a clue about DSL behaviour. They still work on a PSTN only basis.

The first question I would ask any potential workman is, "Will you be fitting an integrated low-pass filter with the new master socket, to remove any bridged-tap scenarios ??". If his response is .... " I'm not a plumber, I don't do taps" ..... then get an expert in.  ;) ;D
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burakkucat

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Re: New Router - Line becomes noisy
« Reply #25 on: December 29, 2017, 06:55:53 PM »

Alas, you still come across either ex-job, or electricians, or others .... that unfortunately haven't a clue about DSL behaviour.

A very important point that needed to be highlighted. Thank you.  :)

Of course if risk_reversal is located either within b*cat's home town or in the catchment area for Walter's Wheelbarrow then there would be no problem.  ;)
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Black Sheep

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Re: New Router - Line becomes noisy
« Reply #26 on: December 29, 2017, 06:57:27 PM »

Of course, sir ....... hardly needed to be mentioned.  ;) ;D ;D
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risk_reversal

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Re: New Router - Line becomes noisy
« Reply #27 on: December 30, 2017, 09:14:14 AM »

I live in Central London. If you know of anyone or have any ideas please let me know.

Otherwise I was tempted to try out this guy

http://www.tele-installations.co.uk/ex-bt-engineer

Read all of his review here

https://www.freeindex.co.uk/profile%28tele-installations%29_70962.htm

Although as we all know with reviews, they are merely an indication at best

Cheers
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Black Sheep

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Re: New Router - Line becomes noisy
« Reply #28 on: December 30, 2017, 02:01:24 PM »

On face value, they seem to be exactly what you need.  :)
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Chrysalis

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Re: New Router - Line becomes noisy
« Reply #29 on: December 31, 2017, 04:08:45 AM »

Absolutely it does. I probably perform this at least once a day, on average ??.

Don't get too hung-up on the terminology ..... 'normalisation' is just another term for 'removal of star-wiring' or 'replacement of obsolete master socket' or 'connecting outside bell to SSFP' ...... things of that nature.

In a nutshell, we have approx. 2hrs paid work by the ISP in which to 'normalise' (bring up to current standards), the wiring at the EU's premises ONLY IF it has been allocated to us a module by the ISP.

There are 5 modules the ISP can 'buy' from Openreach.

1) Base (Internal up to NTE)
2) Internal wiring (EU owned - extentions etc)
3) EU's equipment (If they have set it up incorrectly etc)
4) Network (OR's external and underground network)
5) Exchange (What is says on the tin)

Before someone comes up with a 'grey' scenario, there always will be. I'm just giving the run of the mill gist of the job we do.  :)
thanks for the info on the modules, i wonder how often they only pay for base and then blame openrrach for lack of fix to the end user

Chinese whispers
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