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Author Topic: Daily Error Spikes  (Read 5016 times)

kitz

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Re: Daily Error Spikes
« Reply #30 on: July 25, 2017, 11:28:09 PM »

As you say,  if Openreach came out then unless it was erroring at that particular time, they would have a hard job finding out what the cause was.

TBF it wouldn't bother me too much if the DLM didnt penalise me. As you can see I'd sat nicely for several weeks at 80Mb, SNRm not budging. 
Then something will set it off (rather the daily spike will).   I notice before DLM does so I take action and all calms down again.   The next day DLM catches up and my speed drops to ~67Mbps and applies interleaving. 

The only reason I can think of why I escaped DLM this time is although the Errors were totally unrelated to the Thunderstorms and just outside the time frame, DLM must have classed it as a Wide Area Event.   My line is UG all the way, so is not as badly affected by storms as some other lines.

I would also love to know what causes that daily spike on quite a lot of lines even though it may not be as severe as mine is. 
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PhilipD

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Re: Daily Error Spikes
« Reply #31 on: July 27, 2017, 04:50:50 PM »

Hi

Could be sewage pumps turning on for a period of time, these are often out of site underground and not necessarily the best maintained bits of electrical equipment, and might explain why no action is taken as it affects many lines and is seen as a wide area event.

If like some of us on ECI cabs you've seen a reduction in power used on the upstream that may make your line more susceptible to having errors even though the noise hasn't necessarily become worse.

Regards

Phil
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kitz

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Re: Daily Error Spikes
« Reply #32 on: July 27, 2017, 07:51:29 PM »

I dont think so.   AFAIK the nearest sewerage pumps are about a mile away.

Up until the outage last week, they were regular as clockwork between 10-11am.   Since then they have been at differing times.   
Its also odd that sometimes a router reboot can clear the errors.   Daily spikes have been noticed on other lines including those on Huawei cabs. 

This week is the first time Ive escaped DLM intervention... but Im assuming that it was because we had very bad storms here quite soon afterwards, then DLM has viewed it in with the storm Wide Area Event.

>>> If like some of us on ECI cabs you've seen a reduction in power used on the upstream

I had noticed that but when I mentioned it on here a few months ago, someone pointed out (ejs?) that it may be some sort of weird reporting error.  Note how upstream and downstream are the same.
However if you look at the band breakdown, something is obviously wrong [see cap below] with the aggregated figures.
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Chrysalis

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Re: Daily Error Spikes
« Reply #33 on: July 29, 2017, 05:55:00 AM »

kitz having read what you said in the other thread, you have now had a long outage I would concentrate on that and not the speed when dealing with plusnet.

So you have now had a circa 14 hour outage.
Also random periods of time that last approx an hour that cause your service to be unresponsive.

That should be enough to make plusnet agree to investigate further.

Good luck.
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j0hn

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Re: Daily Error Spikes
« Reply #34 on: July 29, 2017, 11:09:35 AM »

I'm forming the opinion that the lower power on the upstream (certainly in my case) is completely down to the ZyXEL VMG8x24.
If you look at my last 60 days on MDWS (Minted) you can see upstream power has dropped from 4.1dBm to as low as 0.9dBm.
On 6th July you can see it very briefly jumped to 4.2dBm. That was me briefly connecting the Huawei HG612.
Then 2 days ago it jumps back up to 3.7dBm. That's me switching to a ZyXEL VMG1312-B10A.
I believe both ZyXEL's use the same chipset, which differs to that in the HG612, so that isn't the cause.
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kitz

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Re: Daily Error Spikes
« Reply #35 on: July 29, 2017, 07:23:23 PM »

kitz having read what you said in the other thread, you have now had a long outage I would concentrate on that and not the speed when dealing with plusnet.


Ahh gotcha... that would be because I said "Just got in (my dsl has been down all day - see MDWS).", by that I meant I had just got in and sat down at the PC and why I hadnt been able to  respond to the thread and a couple of PMs I'd got about it earlier.


My dsl was actually down because I was out all day a fair distance away, without any net access and I knew I wouldnt be back until very late evening.
So rather than risk my line throwing throwing a wobbly when I wasn't in a position to do anything about it, I turned by router off before I left.

:)

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kitz

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Re: Daily Error Spikes
« Reply #36 on: December 13, 2017, 03:25:28 PM »

blahh...  didn't notice this in time today :(

Only posting because no doubt DLM will clobber me tomorrow and as a record to see how long it takes to remove this time.


---
PS
Was able to stop it using the following commands rather than a modem power cycle.

adsl connection --down
adsl connection -up
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Dray

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Re: Daily Error Spikes
« Reply #37 on: December 13, 2017, 05:32:52 PM »

can't you automate that with dslstats?
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kitz

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Re: Daily Error Spikes
« Reply #38 on: December 14, 2017, 09:37:43 PM »

Not sure if I could without some additional scripts.   It is a PITA and if I am using the PC I can usually spot it erroring because everything is so slow.
However I wasn't using the PC at the time so didn't notice until later on in the afternoon when trying to access websites was like wading through treacle.
Its why if Im out for the whole day I will usually turn the modem off, but as I was only away for a few hours I didn't bother...  but too late damage done.

Of course DLM noticed and my 73Mbps has now been reduced to 67.6Mbps due to INP=3.    However, even though it is annoying and the line is now fine again, I'm not going to stress about it and just hope DLM relents.    I'm only posting more as a reminder for me to see how long it takes.   Still no idea what causes the daily spike though.
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NewtronStar

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Re: Daily Error Spikes
« Reply #39 on: December 16, 2017, 12:53:00 AM »

Upstream & Downstream SNRM oscillation showing since switching the modem off to-day  ???
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kitz

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Re: Daily Error Spikes
« Reply #40 on: December 16, 2017, 11:34:51 AM »

Cheers NS.   I've just looked and so it is :(

I was out all day yesterday and had turned the modem off knowing that if it went into spaz mode I wouldn't be able to do anything.    Didn't get back until late last night, switched modem on because I needed wifi for the Echo to control heating/lighting without looking at the line stats.

Will power down the modem in a few mins to see if I can get rid of it.
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kitz

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Re: Daily Error Spikes
« Reply #41 on: December 16, 2017, 11:58:35 AM »

Hmm  a power down of the modem doesnt seem to have fixed it and right now its oscilating between 6.3dB and 5.6dB on a slightly lower sync of exactly 67500.  :-\

It probably needs a longer period of time disconnected to clear, but I have several things I need to do today which need an internet connection. :(

Whilst DLM applying INP may have stopped the daily Err/Sec spike, it is only masking it and as you can see below it is still there.... but this time it racked up ~140k of FECs.
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ejs

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Re: Daily Error Spikes
« Reply #42 on: December 16, 2017, 01:11:23 PM »

Whilst DLM applying INP may have stopped the daily Err/Sec spike, it is only masking it and as you can see below it is still there.... but this time it racked up ~140k of FECs.

Why do we take this kind of attitude towards anything that the DLM does? We could say that pretty much anything that the DLM does is only masking a problem, implying that there shouldn't be any DLM at all. Or, as far as the DLM can tell, you had a problem causing lots of errors, so the DLM increased the level of error protection, effectively solving the problem, the errors are now corrected, and the service should no longer be affected - the DLM did exactly what it is supposed to do.

The DLM will not be aware that most of the errors seem to be due to something getting stuck in a weird state.
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kitz

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Re: Daily Error Spikes
« Reply #43 on: December 16, 2017, 01:41:03 PM »

 :-X  I was only saying that whatever is causing it, is still obviously there.   I'm not obsessing over it or chasing my ISP, was more mentioning it because I was seeing how long DLM takes to remove.

Whatever it is is a PITA, because aside from the one minute period per day, the line is OK and doesnt need any DLM interaction.   Just that sometimes that one minute spike, causes the line to spaz out for a while.   By the time DLM takes action, the line will always be stable again and in no need of DLM.
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Chrysalis

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Re: Daily Error Spikes
« Reply #44 on: December 27, 2017, 08:44:59 AM »

had a spike myself last night I assumed I am screwed, but I might just be ok even with sky only using the standard profile.

MDWS shows 1371 ES for the day, just below the 1440 sky profile limit.

No idea what triggered it SNRM didnt dip at the time.

Since a very brief power cut this morning (less than one second) it also looks like someone's modem has dropped out as well as my crosstalk dropped off as well.
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