Broadband Related > FTTC and FTTP Issues

Requesting Openreach move DP line is connected to?

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BC88:
Hey all,

This is my first post on Kitz, after many years of passively browsing the forum!

I thought I'd start off with a post about an issue I've been looking into for my parents, who are struggling to get VDSL in their village. The village is served by one cab, which was enabled for FTTC in 2015; original estimates from BT's DSL checker showed their line as being able to receive ~20Mbps, but at the time they weren't interested in upgrading. Over the last couple of years their needs have changed and are now looking to take advantage of the higher speeds available to them.

I decided to help them with this, but very quickly noticed an issue that would likely prevent them placing an order. Over time the speeds they're estimated to receive on a VDSL service have dropped from the ~20Mbps quoted above, to 4.1Mbps (Clean - A), which is slightly less, if not the same as the speeds they currently receive from their ADSL2+ service, provided by IDNet.

Something about this dramatic drop prompted me to check the neighbouring properties estimated speeds, so armed with some telephones numbers, I took a look and to my surprise, estimates for neighbouring properties were in the ranges of 40-48Mbps.

I spoke with IDNet to see if they could confirm with Openreach that their data was correct. They came back saying it was correct and noted that the line of our closest neighbour was connected to a different DP than that of my parents. It's worth noting that both this neighbours line and my parents line, connect to the same telegraph pole (situated on my parents property), before feeding back to a DP situated at the end of their shared drive way and that line lengths to this DP are almost identical.

IDNet were able to provide me with the estimated and calculated line lengths of both lines and it appears that our line is an extra >1.5km longer than the neighbours line.

Neighbour:
Circuit line length estimate: 5531
Circuit line length calculated: 4990
DP Line length estimate: 5343

Parents Line:
Circuit line length estimate: 6917
Circuit line length calculated: 6510
DP Line length estimate: 6261

This extra distance would explain the decrease in obtainable speed, but makes little sense (to me) as to why it appears to be connected to a different DP much further away.

Unfortunately IDNet weren't able to help when I asked the obvious question, how do we go about moving the DP the line is connected to and said that it was unlikely Openreach would even consider. So I thought I'd bring this topic up here, to get the experienced thoughts of this community to gauge if this really is something they will have to live with, or if there's a solution?

It's worth noting that the local council partly funded the roll out to this rural location and by their records, the property is able to receive 'superfast' broadband despite the reality being the opposite, which makes me wonder if their property is somehow counted in the % of superfast enabled properties data (when perhaps they shouldn't) - inflating reported numbers AND how many other properties might be in similar situations. But that's probably best saved for a separate thread :)

Thanks for reading, and I look forward to hearing your thoughts!

burakkucat:
Welcome to the Kitz forum.  :)

If you have a sufficiently large wallet and are able to submit a full, detailed, business plan to the BT Group plc then yes, you can have a bespoke network rearrangement.

For the average end-user, the answer will always be "no".  :(

ejs:
Are you sure both lines are connected to the same cabinet?

Are those line lengths in metres? It must be doing very well to get 4Mb on ADSL2+ over a 6+ km line! What are the ADSL stats (attenuation in particular)?

Is it possible it's just that the estimate is incorrect and not indicative of the speed you'd actually get? Admittedly the low estimate would complicate any fault reporting.

BC88:

--- Quote from: burakkucat on April 26, 2017, 04:20:36 PM ---Welcome to the Kitz forum.  :)

If you have a sufficiently large wallet and are able to submit a full, detailed, business plan to the BT Group plc then yes, you can have a bespoke network rearrangement.

For the average end-user, the answer will always be "no".  :(

--- End quote ---

Thanks for the welcome and response, burakkucat!

Apologies if I was a little unclear, I think it may have come across that I was referring to the relocation of the DP, rather than just connecting the line to a much closer DP.


--- Quote from: ejs on April 26, 2017, 04:39:09 PM ---Are you sure both lines are connected to the same cabinet?

Are those line lengths in metres? It must be doing very well to get 4Mb on ADSL2+ over a 6+ km line! What are the ADSL stats (attenuation in particular)?

Is it possible it's just that the estimate is incorrect and not indicative of the speed you'd actually get? Admittedly the low estimate would complicate any fault reporting.

--- End quote ---

Yep definitely the same cab, it's a rural location (the cab is located in the most useless place; outside of the village, where it's least housing-dense, so there are only a small number of properties that actually benefit from 80mb speeds) and yes line lengths are in metres.

I had Openreach out to move the master socket into the attic space at the point of entry a 6/7 years ago, which took the speeds from 1Mb to 4Mb (loads of old extension wiring in the property). It made a huge difference... Unfortunately I don't have access to the line stats, but next time I'm down their way I'll grab these.


Here's some more detail in the meantime, if it's helpful:

Neighbour
You searched for telephone number 012028XXXXXX.
CSS Exchange: WIMBN/ WIMBORNE
District code: ST
BT Post code: BH21 7DH
PCP Id: 20
FCP Id:
DP Number: 676
ANFP Category: M
Circuit line length estimate: 5531
Circuit line length calculated: 4990
DP Line length estimate: 5343
A – Earth capacitance: 289
B – Earth capacitance: 287
Celerity line loss: 53.1





Us
You searched for telephone number 012028XXXXX.
CSS Exchange: WIMBN/ WIMBORNE
District code: ST
BT Post code: BH21 7DH
PCP Id: 20
FCP Id:
DP Number: 680
ANFP Category: X
Circuit line length estimate: 6917
Circuit line length calculated: 6510
DP Line length estimate: 6261
A – Earth capacitance: 375
B – Earth capacitance: 376
Celerity line loss: 57.7
LLC Line loss: 53.17

Ronski:
It would be worth a polite email to the CEO of Openreach, clearly explaining what you've put in this thread, and including addresses and phone numbers.

If it's a simple database issue or routing problem they may well be able to resolve it, but if it is a routing issue and there is no spare capacity to change the routing then it won't happen.

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