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[biglouie]

Hi all

I've been reading all your posts for a while to try and ID if I can do anything to improve my broadband speed.

I plugged my Netgear GT router into the test socket today and got a much higher downstrean connection speed (2500kbps up to 5750kbps) so I take from this I have some internal wiring issues. I'm on an AOL 8Mb connection

Anyway, I wanted to post some details to see if someone considerably cleverer than what I am like, can advise me on what could be done.

In short, the router plugged into the master socket gives me about 3500kbps, plugged into the test socket underneath gives me 5700kbps, the noise margin and all other figures were the same during the testing of master socket, test socket and on the usual internal extension, except connection speed, which I;m taking to be sync rate to the DSLAM.

My broadband is provided by AOL, my exchange is not unbundled by them (CPW) as yet so BTW underlies the broadband, with BRAS technology. So on speed checks my throughput never goes above 1600kbps depending on checker used.

I've done DR TCP tweaks and have routerstats logging at the moment (already seeing some changes in noise margin, upwards)

So question is, do I disconnect my bell wire or fit an NTE5 face plate to the master socket? The master is in the loft, but happy to stick the router up there as it can be hardwired to the PC and the NAS with ethernet.

If I put a new face plate on, will all the extension be defunct or do they still work?

I want the 5700kbps that I get from the test socket!

All help much appreciated, bit stuck with what to do now.

Stats
----------

Master Socket tests

ADSL Link     Downstream     Upstream
Connection Speed    3776 kbps    448 kbps
Line Attenuation    46.0 db    28.0 db
Noise Margin    9.1 db    15.0 db

1.6 mb on speed check

BT Test Speed Tester results for Master Socket connection

Test1 comprises of Best Effort Test: -provides background information.
    IP profile for your line is - 1750 kbps
    DSL connection rate: 448 kbps(UP-STREAM)  3776 kbps(DOWN-STREAM)
    Actual IP throughput achieved during the test was - 1549 kbps


Test Socket router stats

ADSL Link     Downstream     Upstream
Connection Speed    5728 kbps    448 kbps
Line Attenuation    45.0 db    28.0 db
Noise Margin    9.3 db    15.0 db

1.6mb on  a speed check, but no BT Speed tester results as I have to wait 3 hours between tests and now it just fails when I try to run a test.

Thanks you.

[emgee]

Your line is defintely capable of more speed that you are now getting. If you remove the bell wire, the extensions would be OK with microfilters fitted. The faceplate would be a better long term solution and, I believe, would remove the need for additional filters.
Once you make either of these changes, you need to wait up to 3 days for your IP profile to be updated and, hence, an improved throughput. Even though you may sync around 5700, your IP profile will remain at 1750 until the system catches up, so you won't see improved speedtests straight away.

[biglouie]

thx for the reply emgee. Understood on bras profile (ip profile) changes.

I have 3 extensions, all have microfilters where devices are attached.

I'll have a look see for bell wire instructions then.

Noise Margin is totally stable all day from what i can see, 9db, sometimes 14db. Noob question I know, but it seems from what I am reading that I want high, stable noise margin, is that correct?

With regards faceplate, is this the sort of thing I;m after? http://www.tamarshop.co.uk/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=363

Cheers

[emgee]

I should point out that it's worth checking your internal extension wiring for other problems, as it may not be as simple as the bell wire, though that's a good starting point. See the guide on the main site http://www.kitz.co.uk/adsl/troubleshooting.htm . Monitor your stats before and after and take note of the noise margin just as the router starts up.
Be careful not to start and stop your connection too many times in succesion, as I did! This could be seen as a fault and cause the system to increase your margin.

Not sure about the quality of that faceplate in your link. The adslnation one is generally recommended, available here http://www.broadbandbuyer.co.uk/Shop/ShopDetail.asp?ProductID=3306

[biglouie]

cheers emgee, I'll track all the changes.

I dont get why I am sync'd at 3.5 and only achieve 1.5mb throughput.

Guess I'll just watch the graphs and see if there is a reason I might have a lower bras profile.

thx again for the link and help

[emgee]

You mentioned in your first post going from 2500kbps to 5700kbps when trying the test socket. A sync of 2500 would give you an IP profile of 2000, so a throughput of 1.6mb wouldn't be far off.

edit: I see from re-reading your first post that your current IP profile is 1750, hence your speeds. You must have been synced lower than 2500 at some stage. Once you have your router connected to the master socket, with ADSL faceplate, you should see an improvement within 3 days.

How long have you been synced at 3500?

[biglouie]

..hard to tell really, as I have only really checked intermittently over time in the router, so it has varied between 2500 and 3750 over the last year or so. I just haven't given it the time to investigate and sort out. So as you say, must be a sync event that is lower down for DLM to plump for 1750. I'll find out over the next few days as I now have routerstats running.

Infact just checked them now and I notice that at 9.35 I had a sudden spike on the noise margin from 6db to 21db, which caused the sync to drop. resync came in at 2000 with a noise margin of 14db. So there is the answer. I just need to work out what has caused the high noise margin event. I;ve had a call and placed one in that time frame so I'll do some testing on that! I have BT diverse DECT phones, so maybe there is a channel problem. I have no idea how to check what channel they operate on, I always assumed they dynamically set their channel.

Routerstats is a nifty piece of s/w. handy.

[emgee]

DECT phones don't normally affect the ADSL signal directly, they can affect the wifi performance but that doesn't seem to be the issue.

If you could isolate your extensions by connecting the router(and dect phones) to the test socket for a day or more, that would give a clearer picture. Looks a lot like a problem with the internal  wiring.

[biglouie]

for sure its an internal wiring issue...

Nice flat graph all last night, then a sudden, off the scale peak in the noise margin (over 30db spike) but didnt lose sync.

I pulled the bell wire last night. No noticeable difference in noise margin, but a jump from the 2500/3000 sync rate to 5000 (similar to the test socket)

I did a BT speed test in the evening and found out that my line profile had changed from the normal 1750 to 3000 I guess due to the day of solid 5700 sync on the test socket.

Throughput tests show a switch from 1.6mb d/l lto 2.7mb download speeds. So I am happier. Just need to ID what causes these spikes and see how I might eliminate them.

I take your point on DECT phones and agree, less likely to cause a noise related event on the phone line.



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[roseway]

That big spike is presumably the result of Netgear routers' false reporting of the noise margin when it goes negative.It should go down, not up, but Netgear routers report negative noise margins as very large positive numbers, due to a programming error in the firmware.

Brief spikes like this are generally the result of repetitive electrical impulse noise (REIN), and you can read all about it here.

[biglouie]

Oh right, thanks roseway, had no idea there was an issue with the netgear firmware regards to that. It didnt cause me to lose sync (not according to routerstats anyway) but seeing as my upstream in routerstats is currently reporting zero and has been since 6am this morning, I am wondering if there is a bug in routerstats! Router info shows steady 15db for upstream, has since I started monitoring.

Spike was bang on 7.30am, but nothing special occurs in our house at 7.30 so I wonder if its an external inference, maybe neighbour influence I'll keep monitoring.

Is it strange that it didnt lose sync through this spike? I would expect it to drop out.

[biglouie]

Just by way of an update for those who may be thinking of removing the bell wire.

My noise margin has NOT altered since removing the bell wire (steady at between 8.5 and 9.5db), the REIN type spikes have not occurred (with one exception).

What has changed is my sync rate. Where as I was syncing at 2500 to 3500 previously, I am now continuously sync'd with one drop (above REIN type event) at 5500. After the spike it came back in at approx 5500.

My IP profile now appears to have changed on the BRAS and I now have a 4500 profile (according to BT Speed Tester) this seems to have changed over night.

My download speed according to http://www.dslzoneuk.net/speedtest.php is now just over 2mb. My speed according to http://www.speedtest.net/ is now just over 4mb. No idea which one to believe, but my observed performance for download and surfing is significant.

Face plate arrived today, but I need to put a power supply in the loft (where master socket is) to enable me to plug the router into it, so that will wait. I'll post back my personal feedback between bellwire and faceplate once its all done.

In my case, bell wire removal was/is a winner. Phones still work as they dont need the bell wire. Very pleased.

Thx for all your advice on this forum guys, much appreciated.

[roseway]

Excellent result.

[emgee]

Excellent, great improvement!

Very fast update to your profile, probably because it's a fairly big jump. Smaller increases take longer, I believe.
I always get a better result on speedtest.net also but it seems to tally with the throughput on the BT speedtester, so I think it's accurate.

You're very close to a 5000 IP profile so, if you want to be greedy, remember you tend to get better rates if you resync in the morning.

[biglouie]

Something else that may or may not be worth noting. I run a Netgear D834GT with the latest firmware. Even during the odd spike I have seen (mostly due to my placing a Network Storage device next to the router and transfering lots of files, I had Noise Margins of as low as 1 and 2 but the sync didnt drop and remained at 5000 odd. Very impressed that it 'managed' the noise event without losing sync.