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Author Topic: Winter tyres  (Read 3934 times)

roseway

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Re: Winter tyres
« Reply #15 on: November 12, 2015, 12:39:03 PM »

Quote
I've talked myself out of being fussy about spares, on the basis that punctures  are actually (tempting fate, touching wood) quite rare nowadays.

My car doesn't have a spare at all, just an emergency repair kit which seals a puncture and inflates the tyre.
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sevenlayermuddle

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Re: Winter tyres
« Reply #16 on: November 12, 2015, 12:53:53 PM »

My car doesn't have a spare at all, just an emergency repair kit which seals a puncture and inflates the tyre.

I carry one of these too, as well as the skinny space saver.

One problem, or so I've heard, is that some tyre centres will refuse to repair a puncture if sealant has been used, so the tyre's a always write-off.  Can't remember their exuse, I'm sure Google would know.
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Ronski

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Re: Winter tyres
« Reply #17 on: November 12, 2015, 01:23:58 PM »

Those emergency kits are no good at all if the hole is too big, or the tyre has blown out.

As part of my job I have repaired car tyres and truck tyres, and it's done pretty much the same way as you would a bicycle tyre/tube. Only difference is most tyres are tubeless, so the patch is stuck to the actual tyre, although we use plug patches which have a rubber tail which is pulled through the hole, then the extra bit is cut off.

Now if your tyre is full of goo you've got to clean it off before you can glue the plug patch into place. I suspect it's because of this that  tyre centre's refuse to repair them, and they'd much rather sell you a new tyre anyway. I myself have never seen a tyre where that type of product has been used, so can't comment how bad it is.
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broadstairs

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Re: Winter tyres
« Reply #18 on: November 12, 2015, 02:17:21 PM »

This document details the how and why of BS AU159 which is the relevant British Standard to which any repairs should be carried out. I have not seen anything which says a repair cannot be carried out if you use a post-puncture repair sealant, however it probably does make life more difficult and time consuming for the repairer.

Stuart
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AArdvark

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Re: Winter tyres
« Reply #19 on: November 12, 2015, 08:21:46 PM »

Also some cars I've owned owner's manuals have advised that even non-directional tyres should be regarded as directional once they've been on the car a while.
I read that some years ago as well.
I think it relates to the tyres getting a 'Wear' pattern, as the wear is not usually 100% even across the tyre. (This happens even if the tyres are inflated correctly etc)
I have noticed this on a car when I was doing a regular journey of hundreds of miles, twice each week with lots of Roundabouts\winding roads and the some of the tyres were wearing more on the edges.
(Yes the tyres were inflated correctly and the toe-in/out etc was correct. Company Car, so everything was serviced and checked to the letter.)

This also relates to Tyre rotation which I have not noticed in car manuals for years.
It could also be the Tyre Manufacturers NOT encouraging you to make your tyres 'last longer via rotation' to increase sales/profit.  ;D ;D

As I trust my life to Tyres/Brakes I tend not to take risks and do not run them down to the last mm of safe tread/wear, even if the law allows me to.
I also, personally, would not run on Tyres with a noticeable asymmetric wear pattern and would not rotate them to try to even them up.
(Until you manage to get the Tyre wear even across the tread, you are actually running on degraded grip etc. Also by time you have 'evened out' the wear you may be down to a tread depth that is giving you degraded grip anyway.)

I have noticed that Tyres give you their best performance during the 1st (1/3 to 1/2) of the Tread from new, after that you are adapting your driving style to the reducing performance of the tyres.
That is why you notice such a change when new tyres are fitted, as you have been compensating for your Tyres as they wear !!

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sevenlayermuddle

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Re: Winter tyres
« Reply #20 on: January 25, 2017, 09:30:53 AM »

Deliberately resurrecting an old thread here, as I think it remains relevant.

Better half just set off for work, got half way up our steep drive, wheels spinning all the way on a layer of sheet ice, before being beaten by a big puddle of solid ice near the top, and gingerly reversing back down again.   Even worse at the second attempt.   So before fixing the problem with a few handfuls of rock salt, I decided to try out these 'winter/summer' Michelin Cross Climate tyres, with which I opened the thread.   

What a difference.  The cross climates cruised calmly up the hill without a hint of wheel spin.  Not so much as a blink from the traction control light either, which also warns of any wheel spin.

Both cars are manual, front-drive, and better than 5mm tread on all tyres.  :)
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Iain

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Re: Winter tyres
« Reply #21 on: January 25, 2017, 09:34:06 PM »

Modern cars with wide, low profile tyres are at best rubbish in poor winter conditions, more so if RWD.
Even though I live on the south coast, having a RWD BMW 330, the extra grip I get I still find worthwhile, more so when I visit relations in Stockport and Scotland. I would not even contemplate a trip up there on standard tyres unless the forecast for the trip was not going to drop under 5C.
« Last Edit: January 25, 2017, 09:53:39 PM by Iain »
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Weaver

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Re: Winter tyres
« Reply #22 on: January 25, 2017, 09:43:32 PM »

I have always been a big fan of winter tyres. I used to keep two sets of wheels so I could easily just just change them over in the spring and autumn.
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sevenlayermuddle

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Re: Winter tyres
« Reply #23 on: January 26, 2017, 09:31:07 AM »

I agree the problem is largely with the fact that excessively wide tyres seem to have become an essential fashion accessory in the minds of car designers.   They may have minimal adverse effects in summer, but imao they are definitely poorer in winter.   Also the fact that modern 'summer' tyres are of more specialised rubber compared with 30 years ago, optimised for warm weather, that looses too much flexibility in the cold.

Like Weaver, I used to keep two full sets of wheels, one for winter, one for summer.  One problem was my insurers (ridiculously) treated my winter tyres/wheels as a 'modification'.   Even though they agreed not to charge me for it, I had to notify them whenever I changed over, which was a hassle.

Hence I settled on the Cross Climates, and yesterday was the first day I got to see any direct evidence of their worth.   Incidentally, when I said 'ice', I meant exactly that... hasn't snowed here at all, but the freezing fog had settled on the drive at a ground temp about -4 creating a layer of ice you couldn't even walk on.
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Weaver

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Re: Winter tyres
« Reply #24 on: January 26, 2017, 10:40:24 AM »

It never even occurred to me to tell my insurer about changing tyres or wheels. Both wheels and tyres in my case were a manufacturer's option, and both sets of tyres were the correct rated ones for my particular model.
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sevenlayermuddle

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Re: Winter tyres
« Reply #25 on: January 26, 2017, 01:47:44 PM »

My wheels were supplied by the car manufacturer via dealer, specified for my model of car, for the stated purpose of fitting winter tyres.  But they were a different (more optimal) size than factory fitment and so not a normal option on a car of my spec, at least in the UK.   So I decided to call the insurers, just to put my mind at rest.      Tbh I almost wished I hadn't mentioned it, but with insurance these days you really do want to be totally open and squeaky clean, just in case you ever need to claim. :(

One of the reasons they cited for concern was that 'non standard wheels might make the vehicle more attractive to a thief'.   That despite the fact the the standard wheels were fancy alloys, whereas the winter wheels were cheap as chips, old fashioned black coated plain steel wheels with a plastic hub cap.   ::)
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matt9

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Re: Winter tyres
« Reply #26 on: January 26, 2017, 02:11:22 PM »

I've also been curious about that in the past and found this piece of information on the AA website:

"If you follow the standard European practice of keeping two sets of wheels, one with winter tyres and one with summer tyres, then you shouldn't need to tell your insurer as long as the winter tyres are fitted to wheels of the correct specification."

https://www.theaa.com/driving-advice/safety/winter-tyres-in-the-uk
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Weaver

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Re: Winter tyres
« Reply #27 on: January 27, 2017, 10:31:03 AM »

Indeed, dealers were making users aware that they should be fitting winter tyres for my particular model, and were making sure you had exactly the right tyres for both summer (speed ratings) and winter use.
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sevenlayermuddle

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Re: Winter tyres
« Reply #28 on: January 27, 2017, 12:10:24 PM »

I've also been curious about that in the past and found this piece of information on the AA website:

"If you follow the standard European practice of keeping two sets of wheels, one with winter tyres and one with summer tyres, then you shouldn't need to tell your insurer as long as the winter tyres are fitted to wheels of the correct specification."

https://www.theaa.com/driving-advice/safety/winter-tyres-in-the-uk

That quote from the AA might be useful evidence for anybody who has to fight an insurance company over a policy that's been cancelled for non disclosure, but I personally would prefer to avoid such a fight in the first place.  And  a little further down that same AA page, it  says...

"Over the winter of 2010/11 we did hear reports of some insurers increasing premiums or remarkably even refusing cover if winter tyres are fitted. As a result we recommend talking to your insurer if you are considering fitting winter tyres."

If your insurer doesn't mind, they'll tell you they don't mind, always best to tell them absolutely everything imho.


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j0hn

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Re: Winter tyres
« Reply #29 on: January 27, 2017, 04:47:08 PM »

Quote
"If you follow the standard European practice of keeping two sets of wheels, one with winter tyres and one with summer tyres, then you shouldn't need to tell your insurer as long as the winter tyres are fitted to wheels of the correct specification."
I wouldn't take that as definitive. Insurance companies try anything to get out of paying. If the policy specifically says something about notifying them that you're using specialist weather tyres then I don't saying "but the AA says it should be alright" will make any difference.

My neighbour had a claim rejected a couple years ago for having a vinyl stripe down both sides of his car. They classed it as a "modification". Fortunately it was a fairly small claim. I'd be fuming if they did that to me with a claim for a considerable amount.
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