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[Roxy]

well I guess the info you got of BS is confidential?

your line isnt short enough to get your estimate, the pair swap looks to have gave you close to a 25% boost and not far off 50mbit now.  Thumbs up to your engineer he seems to have put the effort in.

Definitely worth the time, was pleased mostly with his effort and attitude - certainly in contrast to the previous one.

The new line has given a better sync which is a fair result.    Would be interesting to know though if you are still getting the loss of upstream SNRm when the landline rings.

True. Fingers crossed for the next several days.

[Black Sheep]

"After that he was over to the cabinet where he can 'see' the fault using his old clock(?) machine and it's a low insulation down - to - Earth problem, between the Fibre cabinet and the old phone cabinet".

Hmm, I've mentioned this on a limited access thread, the reasons being that I have no other info to offer and not certain of the roll-out plan ?? But I think the engineer (who sounded like a genuine good one), was 'seeing' a false 'Earth condition' on both legs due to the fitting of vectoring cards. It was only by a colleague happening along the very same conditions during a FTTC fault that it came to light.

They do NOT have any detriment to the actual VDSL circuit, it just a reporting issue. I believe a fix is being worked on ?

I'm curious as to what this old 'Clock' machine is ?? I can only assume it's the old Ohmeter 18C's, whereby we used to twist dials to add/remove resistances to locate a fault ?? Any meter, to be honest, would have detected the same false positive.

I would also confirm that the amount of errors were indeed minimal, if what he told you is to be believed, and I can't see any reason why he would blatantly lie with you in vision range of the tester ? If there was REIN prevalent, the FEC's would have likely been racking up in their hundreds/thousands, so even though he can detect 'noise' outside the house, it doesn't appear to be service affecting to any noticeable degree ?

I hope that he has made a difference to your line, it would appear so on the face of it ?? Obviously DLM will probably take you down slightly, but hopefully not by much ?? PS ....... yes, it would have been fruitless performing a final PQT after the remedial work was done, as the false fault condition would still have been there. Fingers crossed for you. 

[burakkucat]

. . . using his old clock(?) machine . . .

An interesting phrase. I, too, would be interested in knowing what was used.

Just in case Roxy saw the item in question, I have attached an image of my Ohmmeter 18C . . .

[Chrysalis]

BS umm you let some info out? They fitting vectoring cards in all HG cabs now?

[Black Sheep]

'I've mentioned this on a limited access thread, the reasons being that I have no other info to offer and not certain of the roll-out plan '??

Sorry Chrysallis .............. in the words of the song, if I knew I would tell you. 

[Roxy]

When he described the clock machine, he said it was 'mechanical' and put an emphasis on that. Maybe it's an old piece of analogue type hardware that he keeps around when all else fails for a sanity check.

In regards to the false positive and vectoring cards...is that the same vectoring that everyone says will redefine how effective fibre is, some day when they're all installed?


It's unfortunate that next door somehow manages upwards of 5mbps more - not so much for the speed loss itself, though the principle of the matter. I don't see why that would happen if everything was working correctly?!
I haven't installed the OR modem again yet, we'll see how the HH5 handles the next several days.


burakku, no, I didn't see anything like this.

[burakkucat]

burakku, no, I didn't see anything like this.

Thank you. So we've ruled out the Ohmmeter 18C.  Hmm . . . puzzling.

[Roxy]

Since yesterday, four disconnects/reconnects and none were in the 3-5am window that DLM used when it's taking action. I guess I'll see that in the coming days this week.

[Roxy]

I noticed that in pictures of the Routerstats for home hub 5, it shows CRC/HEC tabs. Yet mine does not get those. Is this a limitation of the program with VDSL?

[kitz]

I think it may be more of a limitation of the home-hub.  Routerstats will show this info - if the router can provide it

[Roxy]

Update time... .. ok you can take five to put some popcorn in the microwave.


After the last engineer visited,  my first objective was to see if the line would repeat it's 'disconnection' issues and force the DLM to kick in. I didn't immediately hook up the new router and OR modem, because I figured with the several line resets on the day of the visit, we don't want to give the DLM any extra excuses. As I reported back here, I ended up with four reconnects within a day.

I spent a good half a day going through notes and logs from the Home Hub 5(which we know is very limited). I filtered it down by WAN related queries, and found this entry showing up every time before a drop :
PPP LCP Send Termination Request [User request]

Searching BT resulted in these noteable threads...

https://community.bt.com/t5/BT-Infinity-Speed-Connection/PPP-LCP-Send-Termination-Request-User-request/td-p/1152644
https://community.bt.com/t5/Other-Broadband-Queries/PPP-LCP-Send-Termination-Request/td-p/842922/page/2

At the 'conclusion' of the first one, BT mods effectively swept it under the rug. There's been no official word thereafter.

My personal observations with this error/termination are :

A) When I resync the first time after LCP termination, I reconnect on the same speed as I was before and I mean to the ten hundredth decimal.
B) Only after several of these 'disconnects,' does the speed finally change on sync (most often going down by a 1mbps).
C) It happens at any time of the day. And despite that, the speed it syncs at does not change.
D) I do not lose internet connection, and I've yet to see the hub go orange(flashing for error/problem) around these times.


So right away something seems odd. First what are the chances of resynching at an identical speed? And how is it possible that even at 6PM when noise margin is high and your maximum attainable rate is lowered, that you somehow resync at a higher speed (more importantly, at the same speed you had a day ago at 12 noon)? Lastly, why no loss of internet if the system really did go down?

Having no explanation for this, and fearing the worst (e.g. the inevitable DLM /interleaving), I took it all down and replaced it with the Asus router and OR modem.

I am happy to report that for five days, my IP profile and speeds have stayed the same and my router(as an added bonus regarding the internal network) has not disconnected or lost it's WAN uplink to the modem.


While it's still somewhat early days, on the surface I am going to have to blame the Home Hub 5 for creating a false positive that the DSLAM eventually takes notice of and decides to get involved - to rectify a situation that never existed. Clearly I do not know enough about this technology to know if that's even possible or a safe guard should exist, but given the circumstantial evidence and the reports of others in those threads, it may well be the router hardware.

[burakkucat]

Alarm bells start to ring! 

I seem to recall that shortly after Beattie began to comprehensively push the HH5 to all new users, there were a significant number of reports that the device would regularly drop and re-establish the connection. There may be mention of the problem here, in the Kitz forum and I believe it was also raised in the TBB forum. 

Does anyone else remember? As this kitteh's memory is currently not being helpful. 

[Chrysalis]

when I was beta testing the hh5 I used it as a router only behind the hg612, never as a modem.  My concern was I didnt want a router/modem shared device especially whilst beta testing as any BT side initiated reboot would reset the sync.

Also whilst I was on BT infinity even when not using a homehub ppp used to drop 2-3 times a week until I made a change, that change was disabling btagent and the 2nd wan interface on the hg612.  After that I had much longer uptime's in the region of months not days.

[Roxy]

when I was beta testing the hh5 I used it as a router only behind the hg612, never as a modem.  My concern was I didnt want a router/modem shared device especially whilst beta testing as any BT side initiated reboot would reset the sync.

Also whilst I was on BT infinity even when not using a homehub ppp used to drop 2-3 times a week until I made a change, that change was disabling btagent and the 2nd wan interface on the hg612.  After that I had much longer uptime's in the region of months not days.

BT Agent exists on the ECI modem as well? I thought the BT Agent issue was fairly rare in that it only related to firmware updates resetting the connection.

[kitz]

Alarm bells start to ring! 

I seem to recall that shortly after Beattie began to comprehensively push the HH5 to all new users, there were a significant number of reports that the device would regularly drop and re-establish the connection. There may be mention of the problem here, in the Kitz forum and I believe it was also raised in the TBB forum. 

Does anyone else remember? As this kitteh's memory is currently not being helpful. 

Yep..  the HH5 does have rather a bad reputation for both rebooting and also dropping the connection for no apparent reason.