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[les-70]

   There is only a quite small change in error rates associated with the SNRM changes that I see.  The SNRM/per tone also changes smoothly across the tones as it does with cross talk.   If it was REIN I would expect associated errors to be more significant and SRNM/tone to be ragged.

 (Yesterday I accidentally left 3 fluorescent strip lights on the loft!  They cause a  marked increase in errors which had me really puzzled until in the evening when I noticed the indicator light that I put on the landing switch -in anticipation of such errors -- was glowing.)

[Chrysalis]

I am certain that it just varying cross talk with people turning modems on and off

Thats the problem with fttc - we dont know if it is x-talk.. or not   Once upon a time we would have said it was a small amount of REIN.

indeed.

The way I try to diagnose is that if the drop in snr happens suddenly and during openreach working hours and especially if it appears permanent, its likely crosstalk, but of course cannot be 100% on it.

If its gradual and moves up and down, its probably something like RFI.

I think unless vectoring hardware is active in dslams, BT cannot know either, e.g. the GEA tester has a crosstalk detector but I think it wont be reliable.

A sudden loss of snr can also be down to a fault that starts, like joint becoming loose, corroded etc. Trying to diagnose remotely on the internet is only going to be guess work.

[phi2008]

Is it possible to make the 8800NL act like an unlocked HG612? That is can it handle a PPPoE connection and allow access to stats over a LAN port at the same time? 

[JustAnother]

Yes, it does this with the bridging mode, infact it only requires a single port for this, something I don't understand.

[phi2008]

A LAN(stats) and PPPoE bridge interface on one Ethernet port? I thought you needed something like VLANs and a managed switch to put two "interfaces" on one port? Anyone care to explain to me and JustAnother how that works? 

[Chrysalis]

guys know anyone who has this in stock?

after trying the zyxel and having a taste of the better bcm chipset/driver I want this router which hopefully has a working bridge mode but noone has it in stock and am still waiting for amazon

[kitz]

adslmax bought one last week.. but I dont know where he got it from.

[adslmax]

adslmax bought one last week.. but I dont know where he got it from.

broadbandbuyer (got it back to me because I have explained to broadbandbuyer that it wasn't Billion caused my DLM) got it back to me four days ago and now ongoing stable connection for 4 days now (no DLM)

[Chrysalis]

broadbandbuyer is out of stock sadly, and I guess if it shows up I might get max's returned one

[adslmax]

broadbandbuyer is out of stock sadly, and I guess if it shows up I might get max's returned one

Billion 8800NL are in stock now but seem more expensive at £70.62 excluding delivery charge which mean next business day delivery costs £6.60 inc VAT. They have 3 in stock at the moment. http://www.broadbandstuff.co.uk/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=67sku=Billion_8800NL_Wireless-N_VDSL2%28Fibre%29/ADSL2+_Firewall_Router&products_id=3584

[les-70]

  A bit cheaper on Amazon but may not actually be in stock http://www.amazon.co.uk/Billion-8800NL-Gigabit-Wireless-Router/dp/B00K6D2ESM

[Chrysalis]

amazon is cheaper and out of stock which is where I ordered, since the zyxel is doing fine now I will wait for amazon.

[les-70]

  I have now repeated a 24 hour test 3 times for each of the 3 test cases. The tests are for an HG612 with the latest 038 firmware and the 8800NL with two firmwares, the shipped one with 038 dsl driver and the later one with the 039 dsl driver. (The 039 is the same as the one in the current ZyXel firmwares) i.e. 9 days of tests.  All on fast path.

  The results are

                HG612       8800NL-038     8800Nl-039
  ES/hour      9-12             14-17             15-19
  CRC/day    1000-3000    1000-4000      7000-20000
  SES/day        1-8             1-13               10-28                 

 It would be easier to understand whether the differences matter if we knew what the DLM counted as errors.  An important observation was that the for all three tests the ES/hour rates were very stable most of the day varying only by a factor of two between most hours but with an odd hour or two each day bigger. 

  The extra CRC and SES rates of the 8800NL and in particular the 039 firmware derive from a few minutes of time each day.  It looks like the 63168 and 039 driver is simply worst at handling the odd nasty bits of noise on my line. 

   As I said I would love to know if these differences really matter and whether the DLM only really looks for the LOS and LOF errors that usually cause a resync.  With my HG612 attainable at about 74-75Mb/s the 8800NL-38  always had an attainable about  2-3 Mb/s bigger and 8800NL-039 about 3-4 Mb/s bigger. 


  Stats edited on 5th Oct to reflect extra 8800NL-039 tests and historic data from HG612 and 8800Nl-039 with similar snrm

[Chrysalis]

les your graphs look all over the place O_o, snrm varying a lot.

[les-70]

   My graphs include all sorts of tests but see http://forum.kitz.co.uk/index.php?topic=14030.msg270879#msg270879  My snrm is indeed "all over the place"  It seems to have very little impact on my testing provide my speed is capped to be at or just below the minimum that occurs. e.g. currently 72 when the minimum attainable is 73. I tried not capping a couple of months ago but the DLM resynced me in the night to 80/20 and I did not like the error counts the next day when the attainable went to 73.  I quickly went back to capping.  I dare say the DLM would sort me out one way or another but I prefer my way!