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Author Topic: Repeat fault interesting observations  (Read 14343 times)

Black Sheep

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Re: Repeat fault interesting observations
« Reply #15 on: November 01, 2013, 07:34:28 AM »

You would have thought no voice meant push to front of queue though.

I don't think it's still been classed as a voice fault though, according to Walters post. He comments that because the Eclipse test passed, they've written that particular task off. Ergo, it appears only the DSL task remains ?? May have got this wrong.
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burakkucat

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Re: Repeat fault interesting observations
« Reply #16 on: November 01, 2013, 02:40:03 PM »

I would urge either Bob Pullen, Chris Parr or Alex Rolls to please:
  • Review this thread, in its entirety.
  • Pick up a telephone in their office and make a call to your customer's landline number, 01483xxxxxx. Your customer, Mr & Mrs P*, are 'in attendance'. Note that the call is never answered -- because the metallic pathway is broken. The break in the metallic pathway is in the 'D-side', between the PCP (THCN_P20) and your customer's premises.
  • Take appropriate action within your Company, Plusnet, to correct the failings of your 'Customer Service Department' to understand what your paying customer has told your Company in perfectly clear and precise terms.
  • Reject all 'weasel words' emanating from the BT Group plc regarding their current failings. Raise this matter with both Olive Garfield and Gavin Patterson, liv.garfield@openreach.co.uk & gavin.patterson@bt.com respectively, to ensure that the gross incompetence and failings of BT Group plc employees is logged at an appropriate level.
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chrisparr

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Re: Repeat fault interesting observations
« Reply #17 on: November 01, 2013, 02:50:23 PM »

I'd suggest not PMing Alex as he's not been at Plusnet for several months!

I'll get one of the team to come and see what's what and reply shortly, sorry for the problems you're having :(
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Chris Parr
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cpettitt

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Re: Repeat fault interesting observations
« Reply #18 on: November 01, 2013, 03:02:54 PM »

Hi,

I'm really sorry to hear of the problems, having read through this thread. If you could provide a ticket reference so that I can gain access to your account, Walter, I'd be more than happy to investigate this issue for you.
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Chris Pettitt
Plusnet Digital Care Team

waltergmw

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Re: Repeat fault interesting observations
« Reply #19 on: November 01, 2013, 06:43:22 PM »

Hi Chris,
I'm about to send you a PM with some more technical details.

In the meantime I suppose we have to live with the Openreach processes and their timescales but I find it hard to accept that the phone line passes its Eclipse test but without a dial tone available to us AND we clearly have a single leg service as demonstrated by the VDSL data we monitor. As Plusnet have registered that the phone line still has a fault and have confirmed the earliest possible site visit appointment, somebody must have registered the fact that there is a phone fault still to clear.

EDIT I have now sent a PM to messrs Parr & Pettit. I have repeated that unless and until there is a dial tone on the line it seems quite wrong to attempt a L & S at the PCP / ECI MSAN

Kind regards,
Walter



« Last Edit: November 01, 2013, 07:13:09 PM by waltergmw »
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Chrysalis

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Re: Repeat fault interesting observations
« Reply #20 on: November 01, 2013, 07:21:50 PM »

You would have thought no voice meant push to front of queue though.

I don't think it's still been classed as a voice fault though, according to Walters post. He comments that because the Eclipse test passed, they've written that particular task off. Ergo, it appears only the DSL task remains ?? May have got this wrong.

maybe not by plusnet, but a visiting engineer failing to hear a dial tone? what would he treat as.
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waltergmw

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Re: Repeat fault interesting observations
« Reply #21 on: November 01, 2013, 08:48:23 PM »

@ Chrysalis,

As you will have gathered there is a significant degree of chaos around many parts of Surrey.
It is not helped by SCC and marketing folk within BT making promises that cannot possibly be met except by weasel words.
I expect it's the same in many places. Apart from the laws of physics, the odd hurricane and the field staff and subcontractors being asked to complete quite preposterous sub duct installations etc. with far too many broken and blocked ducts, all FTTC installations are "Hoped to be completed by December 31st" when even a layperson can see they will all be hard-pushed to make next Summer.

In this case I have to believe that an engineer, who did not even visit the house but stated an Eclipse test passed, was either examining the wrong pair or was looking at cross-jumpered pairs towards the PCP. That is all water under the bridge now until we get a methodical engineer to prove the E side in the exchange and PCP, then check the tie pairs are correctly configured and finally use the test socket within the house to confirm a dial tone is present on the correct phone number. After that we can start to examine the VDSL performance problems which may require the L & S operation.

Kind regards,
Walter

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kitz

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Re: Repeat fault interesting observations
« Reply #22 on: November 01, 2013, 09:27:38 PM »

Quote
EDIT I have now sent a PM to messrs Parr & Pettit. I have repeated that unless and until there is a dial tone on the line it seems quite wrong to attempt a L & S at the PCP / ECI MSAN

Walter, this concerns me because its now evening and afaik the Customer Care Team dont work weekends. 
So it could be Monday before Chris sees the PM. :(
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burakkucat

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Re: Repeat fault interesting observations
« Reply #23 on: November 01, 2013, 10:34:56 PM »

As Black Sheep kindly explained some time ago, there is the e-Viper process -- available to all CPs -- that should be used to 'fast track' serious issues, blunders and failings back to Openreach:-X
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waltergmw

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Re: Repeat fault interesting observations
« Reply #24 on: November 02, 2013, 12:39:41 AM »

@ Kitz,

Thanks very much for your concerns.

As we have to operate via the PlusNet "question" or fault report too, I hope that their week-end operatives will see I've addressed our PlusNet correspondents here by duplicating my reply above.
I can only hope that BT will turn up un-announced tomorrow (as they have done before) or that somebody within PlusNet will start rattling some cages in a serious manner.
There is no question that the benighted EUs require their phone service restored immediately, even if we have to continue the VDSL fault Much longer.
As this particular fault was only raised, for the second time, at 9:59am, Friday 27 Sep 2013 another few days really won't make a great deal of difference.

Very sadly it is becoming increasingly obvious that that the UK is investing vast subsidies in "The wrong technology" (Peter Cochrane in the Newsnight article in August 2013 and his HoL evidence in Spring of 2012).

Whilst the majority with shorter length lines in urban areas can survive with VDSL those, as in this case with a D side line length of around 1.3 km are being left to fester on rotting under-maintained infrastructure. The situation is exacerbated by the ever-increasing number of inappropriate FTTCs all requiring more attention that the workforce can possibly deal with, including subcontractor installs without test equipment. It is particularly galling for Ewhurstians as you will probably remember BT were allowed, almost unquestionably with the cooperation of Surrey CC, DCMS, Ofcom and politicians of all persuasions at all levels, to destroy our RDPE grant-approved project where we had recognised the inadequate infrastructure. We had specified a brand new full fibre backbone running throughout the village immediately available to extend with FTTH. Instead with three BT FTTCs, quite inappropriate for any fibre distribution solution and each with only three spare fibres in one tube and a further empty tube that might be coaxed to accommodate a 12 fibre bundle, we are quite literally at a dead end. Fibre on demand and claims of jam tomorrow by working on other solutions just won't wash; just as they haven't with Margaret Hodge's PAC. See attached letter to which we have naturally replied that improving the efficiency of BDUK etc. is unlikely to influence the Laws of Physics.

Kind regards,
Walter
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Chrysalis

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Re: Repeat fault interesting observations
« Reply #25 on: November 03, 2013, 01:59:37 AM »

I fear the track has been lost here, in regards to the dial tone issue I would keep it simple, simply report the fault to the provider who you pay your line rental to, do not even mention broadband, keep it simple and state there is no dial tone.  Voice faults are treated with higher priority, so dont try to mix it in with a broadband fault, if you lucky when they fix it the broadband may improve.

That fault I mentioned earlier where the engineer turned up on a sunday, after he fixed my voice my adsl was down, he out of goodwill sorted that at the same time (he could have officially said I need to book a new fault).  When he did fix it I had a siginificant improvement on upstream sync speed, prior to the voice fault my line was struggling to sync at 400kbit (which even long lines usually achieve on adsl), after he fixed the voice it went up to over 800kbit.  Basically i was able to hit the max 832kbit for adsl max and eventualyl later on with ukonline could get over 1mbit.  So sometimes the cause of a voice fault can regress broadband but dont treat it as a broadband fault when the voice is affected, just dont mention broadband at all to the provider.
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waltergmw

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Re: Repeat fault interesting observations
« Reply #26 on: November 04, 2013, 07:55:56 AM »

Thanks Chrysalis,

The fault is registered as a broadband fault as that's where it started. It is only the incompetence of an engineer investigating the broadband fault that caused the single leg dis.

However I am ever hopeful that Plusnet (who "own" both phone & VDSL services) may at long last early this week kick BT Openreach into some sort of reaction.

(Meanwhile yesterday I reported four storm damaged phone line faults with BT which they "hope to fix" by Friday 8th which means re-visiting the "repair" where they have failed even to attempt to connect them in the temporary 20 pr lash-up.

Kind regards,
Walter
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waltergmw

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Re: Repeat fault interesting observations
« Reply #27 on: November 04, 2013, 11:36:02 AM »

@cpettitt,

Your Jonathan Foster still believes a VDSL fault can be fixed disregarding the state of the telephone line.

Kind regards,
Walter
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cpettitt

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Re: Repeat fault interesting observations
« Reply #28 on: November 04, 2013, 04:13:27 PM »

Sorry for the delayed reply, Walter.

I'm just reading the fault from start to finish (I can see the testing that's been done that way). Once I have read through everything and I've come to my conclusion and next steps, I'll let you know - I'll be as quick as I can.
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Chris Pettitt
Plusnet Digital Care Team

cpettitt

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Re: Repeat fault interesting observations
« Reply #29 on: November 04, 2013, 04:36:22 PM »

Walter,

I've taken a look through the fault ticket and I completely understand why you frustrated, especially with the lead times for each piece of work/investigation that is required.

The Lift and Shift will not be completed until the telephone fault has been cleared. BT Openreach will look at the telephone fault and act on this with precedence. An engineer has been booked in, as you're aware on 7th to restore your telephone service.

Once this has been completed, an engineer will complete a Lift and Shift in a bid to resolve the problem with your Fibre service. I appreciate that the lead times are somewhat extended I feel, however, as there is an MBORC in the area, there is very little we can do to alleviate this.

It is important that my colleague, Jonathan continues to do all he can, which he will, to resolve this issue for you. I will keep an eye on proceedings to ensure this issue is resolved as quickly as possible for you.
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Chris Pettitt
Plusnet Digital Care Team
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