Kitz Forum

Broadband Related => ISPs => Topic started by: NewtronStar on December 04, 2016, 01:52:44 AM

Title: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on December 04, 2016, 01:52:44 AM
Coming out of contract in 7 days with EE this is a hard choice and looking all over the place for a cheaper deal I don't need good ISP support and hopefully never will TT and SKY do not cover this area so they are out ZEN and AAISP are to expensive so they are out.

Just need landline with caller ID and FTTC broadband 40/10 no bells or whistles or TV packages looking to spend less than £30 a month including line rental

Can you offer advise
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Weaver on December 04, 2016, 08:16:10 AM
Talktalk business any good?
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Chrysalis on December 04, 2016, 02:29:35 PM
If you happy with EE why move?

If its the case that you always want new customer deals, you may be able to get a good retention deal out of them.

newt put your details in their checker

https://www.vodafone.co.uk/broadband/deals

£25 all in price.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: keyap on December 04, 2016, 02:39:32 PM
Am with Origin and can't fault them (so far). Cost for the package you're looking for would be around £30.

They only have a small footprint but use other LLUs if you're outside their catchment area (mine's via Vodafone but the T&Cs are as per Origin's policy). If you contact them pre placing the order they will let you know who it would be so you can decide whether it's right for you and / or whether there are any advantages or disadvantages. TBH, using Vodafone's LLU was quite appealing to me however, I may have re-consider if they had quoted something else!

I quite liked the look of them as:-

No download limits
No fair usage policy
No traffic shaping
No blocked sites

We've made it known from the very beginning that we won't block websites or filter any content, unless obligated by law. For parents concerned about their children, there is plenty of free, easy-to-use software available which offers you a more reliable way to control what you see online than any service provider ever could.


For me, all the above is true - no change in speed at any time, irrespective of what I'm doing  ;) and nothing is blocked  ;) ;)

There's also no connection charge and you can also use your own modem/router. They sent me a ASUS DSL-N16 which had been preset up, however, they also included a summary with all the info needed to use my own equipment. I run a HG612 and ASUS RT-AC68U.

Happy to share more info if you need it as I queried numerous things with them, for example they will, at your request and assuming your line will support, change your profile  ::)
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on December 04, 2016, 03:15:04 PM
Have to say Vodafone is looking a appealing at that price, what about using your own modem are they still holding back from giving out username & password ?
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Ronski on December 04, 2016, 03:39:01 PM
From what I've read on here it seems to depend on who you speak to in CS/Support.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on December 04, 2016, 04:02:19 PM
Thats not good then don't fancy haggling just to get the U & P  >:(
thanks Ronski i'll have a think about this.

And thank you keyap also checking out Origin as I type it never seems so straightforward when checking out ISP providers on the net.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Dray on December 04, 2016, 04:06:59 PM
I see Keyap is using his own modem with his ISP Origin and Origin are supplying him with a Vodafone wholesale connection.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on December 04, 2016, 04:22:41 PM
Don't know Dray it seems contradictory as to why Vodafone ISP withholds the authentication details from customers and Origin ISP give it out freely even when using a Vodafone connection  ???
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Chrysalis on December 04, 2016, 04:48:23 PM
if origin do actually use vodafone wholesale then that seems a better choice, as they also waive the migration fee.  Although of course we dont know what their arrangements are for capacity etc.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: keyap on December 04, 2016, 05:08:09 PM
Origin use a variety of 'partners'. You'll need to contact them pre placing the order to check out which one they would use for you.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on December 04, 2016, 05:24:36 PM
Just noticed Chry when looking at keyap ISP provider Origin he does say " using Vodafone's LLU" now I know we don't have any LLU providers at my exchange so it's going to be re-sold BTw from vodafone though it does not change the price.

Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on December 04, 2016, 05:42:56 PM
Origin use a variety of 'partners'. You'll need to contact them pre placing the order to check out which one they would use for you.

Cheers keyap the list of ISP's has come down to two ISP VF & Origin and Origin is winning

Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: keyap on December 04, 2016, 06:03:57 PM
Not a problem. I think that price is an introductory 6 month offer though. From memory, it increases by £10 on month 7.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on December 04, 2016, 06:16:24 PM
Not a problem. I think that price is an introductory 6 month offer though. From memory, it increases by £10 on month 7.

Ah, no thought that was the total cost per month term of 18 now it becomes £33.33 per month and EE is £39.46, i'll have to redo the maths again
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: kitz on December 05, 2016, 02:36:40 PM
Don't know Dray it seems contradictory as to why Vodafone ISP withholds the authentication details from customers and Origin ISP give it out freely even when using a Vodafone connection  ???

Origin use various providers depending upon your location.  They use a combo of
1) Their own LLU for regions in Yorkshire.
2) Vodafone wholesale.   Note the wholesale, it is not the same as vodafone retail.  They still have direct contact with Openreach and have more config options over vodafone than the generic vodafone retail.    Exactly the same as how the ISP has more control with TalkTalk wholesale.. which isnt the same as TT residential packages.   However vodafone needs to be at your exchange.
3) Plusnet White Label.

Quote
i'll have to redo the maths again

The ISP compare (http://www.kitz.co.uk/isp/broadband_price_compare.php) should do the maths for you. 

However note I havent updated the latest BT xmas offers because I just havent had time... but I dont think youre interested in them anyhows. 
Forget that.  The new BT pricing doesnt apply until tomorrow so I cant change them yet. From a quick glance prices will be going up.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Ronski on December 05, 2016, 03:47:42 PM
@Kitz I  notice when using the ISP compare if you enter price range of £0 to £30 it shows prices over £30 total.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on December 05, 2016, 06:22:30 PM
Have contacted Vodafone 10 minutes ago they can do FTTC unlimited 40/10  £22.00 and Phone evening & weekend package for £4 with caller ID total cost £26 for 18 months = £468 +
one off activation charge of £49  :(

Still have to call customer service to get authentication details, can you not setup the 8800nl as modem and let the VF router do the authentication stuff ?
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: burakkucat on December 05, 2016, 06:32:09 PM
Have you also asked Origin as to what they could provide for you?  :-\
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on December 05, 2016, 06:46:17 PM
no i am on the phone EE as i type an at the moment its going to be £32 per month they are seeing if they can match vodefone offer.

EDIT: just off the phone with EE the lowest they could go is £29
Now calling Origin they seems to very busy it been 10 minutes now  ???
EDIT: right Origin £26.82 for six months then £36.82 for rest of term
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: kitz on December 05, 2016, 08:39:22 PM
@Kitz I  notice when using the ISP compare if you enter price range of £0 to £30 it shows prices over £30 total.

Hmm.
It searches on the broadband price column, its possibly showing over £30 for those ISPs who yet arent following ASA's regulations that came in Oct  whereby the phone and broadband element should be combined into one price where possible.

If you click on the 'total button' it should order by total price...  and just having done that I see it does appear to be only Vispa and Uno, who arent yet doing this. 

I don't think I can get it to search for total by default as it then becomes overly complicated for those ISPs which offer standalone products.  All the maths are done as functions outside of that stored in the database.
I'll have a think :hmm:
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on December 05, 2016, 10:11:20 PM
The new contract for BB & Phone has been signed via bank details it's another leap into the dark yet I know my BB line stats will hold up regardless of which ISP it falls to that is if I can still access the stats via a supported modem :-\

The third ISP under this FTTC service will be with Vodafone what can I say the price was right!
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: UncleUB on December 06, 2016, 06:30:14 PM
Have you also asked Origin as to what they could provide for you?  :-\

I would have a read here,

http://www.ispreview.co.uk/review/products/799.html

Before making your mind up.I was with them when South Yorkshire Digital Region folded a couple of years back, they left many users in a state of limbo.Always talk a good talk but when it comes to deliver...
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: kitz on December 07, 2016, 12:11:13 AM
Interesting UB.   I checked out the reviews a couple of months ago and they were mostly good, not sure whats happened over the past month.

I'm aware of what happened with Digital Region.   Origin themselves were a bit in limbo when their main supplier went bust and I thought that once theyd got over that mess things were back on an even keel. :/
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: UncleUB on December 07, 2016, 01:54:11 PM
Interesting UB.   I checked out the reviews a couple of months ago and they were mostly good, not sure whats happened over the past month.

I'm aware of what happened with Digital Region.   Origin themselves were a bit in limbo when their main supplier went bust and I thought that once theyd got over that mess things were back on an even keel. :/

I got out before the closure date of DR but those that were talked into staying and being transferred over Origins new network were left without internet for ages.Origin had a lot of problems and were unable to deliver what they had promised.
I'm not sure if I would ever consider them again but I wouldn't rule them out.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on December 12, 2016, 07:19:07 PM
Vodafone details came in via post last Saturday and all looks ok apart from our telephone number is going to changed  ??? quickly called sales and a awaiting an email to say we can keep are old number this doe not give me much confidence as the switch over is next Monday.

This can I use own modem part is getting me down sales say yeah I think so and chat says no way it is impossible and others sources say you can't use a third party modem very confused and to make things worse I find out the VF router can't be used as bridge to 8800NL no settings available.

The other part of me says you have watched your line stats for to long now it's time to let go  :-[ but would like to have a choice
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: burakkucat on December 12, 2016, 07:40:53 PM
I don't get a particularly "happy feeling" about Vodafone as a CP, from what you have written.  :no:
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on December 12, 2016, 07:53:52 PM
when speaking to sales no mention of change of phone number here is part of the letter

"where possible we will also try to ensure that you keep your existing home phone number should you wish, unfortunately we can't offer this service for Virgin Media Customers - so please do let them know your leaving"

Now I am with EE and the Voice/Phone exchange is only with BT there is no VM or LLU here MR VF
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Chrysalis on December 12, 2016, 09:54:45 PM
had a look regarding the CPE situation but doesnt look good, it seems a few lucky customers managed to get the auth details but then vodafone put a stop to it.

Seems much stricter than sky who themselves have even admitted they know and allow 3rd party routers on their network (just wont support on faults), sky even removed the auth info requirement so no longer needed for successful DHCP auth.

Shame as otherwise vodafone looked a good bet.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on December 12, 2016, 10:10:11 PM
Indeed Chry have made a big mistake with this ISP but you know me I'll be using all my legal knowledge to get this overturned or will walk away from ISP T&C leaving me without any ISP or phone it's their loss not mine.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Chrysalis on December 12, 2016, 10:14:38 PM
is too late to cancel?
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on December 12, 2016, 11:15:20 PM
Well lets look at the T&C for Equipment and give me your interpretation
where does it say you cannot use a third party modem  ;)

 
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on December 12, 2016, 11:31:37 PM
is too late to cancel?

No it's not to late to cancel
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: burakkucat on December 12, 2016, 11:47:31 PM
If you have not signed a paper document to enter into a contract with Vodafone, then I believe that there is a "cooling off period" . . . which is a mandatory part of the "distance selling regulations".  :-\
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on December 13, 2016, 12:06:57 AM
No paper/documents signed for contract the issue is giving the end-user/customer the authentication details for a third party modem which does not seem to breach the contract under page 24 section 6 (The Equipment)

So if they don't give me my authentication details it's going to become very messy for them !
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: ejs on December 13, 2016, 08:13:24 PM
I thought I found the relevant term in the Vodafone terms & conditions earlier:
Quote
4.5   Regardless of whether we need to access your home to install a new line or if we’re taking over an existing line, we’ll send you the necessary Broadband Equipment which you’ll need to connect in order to access your Vodafone Broadband and Home Phone Services. You agree to follow any instructions provided to you by us in order to set up and connect the Broadband Equipment.

Is saying that you need to use something the same as saying it's mandatory to use that something? Do they have to also say that you cannot use anything else, if they're already saying that you must use their Broadband Equipment?
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Chrysalis on December 14, 2016, 06:43:08 PM
Newt has been offline on MDWS since yesterday, has the migration now occurred?
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on December 14, 2016, 09:16:10 PM
No still with EE until Monday taken MDWS and RPi offline and going cold turkey without any line stats as that maybe what I'll have for the next 18 months with a VF modem and no way to use a third party modem  :bye:

The Phone number will change but will be changed back to original number after three days, the only way they could rectify their mistake is by cancelling the order and then start a new order which when activated would be on the 3rd of January 2017
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on December 15, 2016, 09:14:42 PM
HHG2500 arrived was hoping it wouldn't it's 50% larger than a Billion 8800NL and 20% larger than the EE modem BrightBox2 and hooked it upto the 8800NL via lan the GUI is useless it only took me 2 mins to go through all the settings, the old EE BB2 modem is by far superior.

The 2.4 Ghz signal strength (dBm) is 18% lower than the 8800NL
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: keyap on December 17, 2016, 06:34:38 PM
Here's something me and my friend got hold of when considering Vodafone. He did upload to somewhere on here but i can't find it so thought I'd re-post.

It's written confirmation from Vodafone, in the form of a 'chat' session, that you can use your own modem/router.

Hope it help
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: ejs on December 17, 2016, 07:15:10 PM
And a sales advisor would never get some technical detail like that wrong? They might have accidentally said that to a few people, but that doesn't mean everyone else will be able to hold them to it.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on December 18, 2016, 12:17:20 AM
The VF telephone sales rep said I could use a third party modem by calling the customer services department and the Chat session Rep says it is impossible to use a third party modem so two different answers to same question.

At this point i'm resigned that won't be able to use a third party modem with vodafone connect, what will I lose you ask !

1. No way to change the DNS Server I use Google
2. No way to block WAN pings IPv4 or 6
3. some ports are open on HHG2500
4. TR-069 & remote is active open to Mirai
5. No Telnet access to monitor line stats
6. No useful Modem line stats
7. No security log events
8. No dhcp setting ranges for other devices

and so on
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: ejs on December 18, 2016, 06:04:35 AM
1. You can change the DNS servers on your computer.
4. The open port used for TR-069 does not mean it suffers from all the other vulnerabilities that allowed some routers to be infected with the Mirai worm.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: kitz on December 18, 2016, 09:01:51 AM
2. No way to block WAN pings IPv4 or 6

I thought they were blocked by default and no way to change this setting.   Which is a PITA - one of the first things I normally do when configuring a new router is allow ICMP pings.   
Blocking ICMP is not always a good thing, not only does it stop some diagnostics but it can also break path MTU Discovery :/

4. TR-069 - As ejs said, just because port 7547 is open does not mean its vulnerable to Mirai.  It also needs to have buggy f/w that allows TR-064 to open port 80.

9. Very basic config options that anyone used to configuring their own LAN will be unhappy with.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on December 19, 2016, 08:09:02 PM
I'll have to eat some of my words only until the HHG2500 is configured by vodafone when going live for the 1st time then a host of extra options are available to EU via GUI

You can change DNS server
Wan pings or ICMP pings are selectable on / off
No ports open all ports are stealth
DHCP ranges can be changed as usual
And there is logs available to look at
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on December 29, 2016, 06:36:32 PM
Have gave up hope with Vodafone and cancelled our contract which has a 30 day cooling off period thank god for that going back to EE good offer and no connection fee with username & password

Now its not just the case you can't use a third party modem it's these constant disconnects which is pissing me off and sat down to watch DR Who Xmas show on iplayer HD and 2 resyncs with in 10 minutes  >:(

Avoid Vodafone if possible that is just from my own experience.



Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: burakkucat on December 29, 2016, 10:16:34 PM
Avoid Vodafone if possible that is just from my own experience.

Here's hoping that your reversion back to an EE provided service goes smoothly.  :fingers:
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on December 29, 2016, 10:59:40 PM
It should do the only thing that showed up during a GEA test with Vodafone is interference on the line and raising a REIN team from openreach which won't find or fix anything as I have been trying to find the source for over three years  ???
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: burakkucat on December 29, 2016, 11:57:15 PM
When we next see you uploading your circuit's statistics to MDWS then we will know you are back with EE.  :)
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Chrysalis on December 30, 2016, 08:07:33 AM
the good news I guess newt is your experience will serve to help others and vodafone honour a cooling down period that lasts after installation.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on December 30, 2016, 01:40:13 PM
I didn't realize VF had this 30 day period cooling off then seen a post on the forums from Kitz dated October, this HHG2500 will be  shipped back once it's return bag arrives but unfortunately we lose the connection fee of £49.

One thing I don't understand with Vodafone when I run the BT Speed Test it will not allow me to run the further diagnostic test the one that gives your IP profile I know this happens with SKY and TT   
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: psychopomp1 on December 30, 2016, 07:10:47 PM
One thing I don't understand with Vodafone when I run the BT Speed Test it will not allow me to run the further diagnostic test the one that gives your IP profile I know this happens with SKY and TT

You definitely cannot run the BT 'further diagnostics' tests on Sky or TalkTalk connections, they will only work on BTW based circuits.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on December 30, 2016, 08:51:11 PM
yeah the tech team said I am getting vodafone FTTC via the BTW which should allow the BT 'further diagnostics' tests to run even the tech team said it should work but no just get this message

"The Performance Tester is currently unable to run a speed test for your broadband connection. Please try again shortly, however if this problem persists,raise the issue with your service provider"
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: kitz on December 31, 2016, 12:42:08 AM
Glad they are honouring their additional 30 day cooling off period.   As you know I was looking at them earlier this because of cost.. but when I weighed up everything it was just too restrictive for me.   Its certainly cheap so I can see why it is popular, but Ive seen a few others also opt to get out early too.  Hope the migration back to EE goes smoothly. :fingers:


One thing I don't understand with Vodafone when I run the BT Speed Test it will not allow me to run the further diagnostic test the one that gives your IP profile I know this happens with SKY and TT

It's because the test is provided by BT wholesale and therefore can only test connections that traverse over the BT wholesale network.  Its always been like that - TT & Sky LLU users have never been able to use the diagnostics because those ISPs are non BTw.  So is Vodafone since they took over the old C&W LLU equipment and used their backhauls.

From  ~ Can I use the BTw Performance Tester? (http://www.kitz.co.uk/adsl/btwperformancetest.htm)

Quote
To use the BT Wholesale performance tester in its entirety, your ISP needs to provision your connection over the BT Wholesale network.

Some examples of ISPs that use the BTw network are:- BT, Plusnet, Zen, IDnet.
It will not work if your broadband is provisioned by an LLU supplier such as TalkTalk or Sky.


Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: aesmith on December 31, 2016, 04:22:59 PM
It never worked when I was with Plusnet either.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on December 31, 2016, 05:13:10 PM
So is Vodafone since they took over the old C&W LLU equipment and used their backhauls.

That explains it and was thinking this must be because it's LLU or something like that, thanks Kitz and interesting to as when checking the availability checker on local exchange it gives me no LLU providers but as my FTTC comes from the larger parent exchange it shows it can be done.

Most UK ISPs use BT exchange equipment to supply their DSL broadband, for those ISPs you should use the information on the left.
The following is a list of providers offering an alternative service to BT Wholesale based
broadband in your area.

LLU Providers   
    
   C&W   Not available   
   Edge Telecom   Not available   
   Entanet   Not available   
   Kingston   Not available   
   Lumison   Not available   
   Node4   Not available   
   Origin   Not available   
   Rutland   Not available   
   Sky   Not available   
   TalkTalk   Not available   
   Timico   Not available   
   WB Internet   Not available   
   Zen   Not available
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on January 06, 2017, 07:06:58 PM
EE tells me there is no available ports so we cannot migrate to them on fibre and the order for 40/10 that was placed last Thursday has been cancelled.

What can i do now ?
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: burakkucat on January 06, 2017, 09:21:18 PM
Get back to EE and let them know that a spare port is not required. They should just take over the one that you are currently using.  :-X
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on January 06, 2017, 10:58:37 PM
Get back to EE and let them know that a spare port is not required. They should just take over the one that you are currently using.  :-X

EE said the FTTC cabinet is full the only way is to downgrade to standard broadband and wait to see if a port becomes available the difference this time the ISP is LLU'd (vodafone) so the port must be different to EE's port  :-\

I lost my composure with EE on the telephone they never called me back to say the order did not go through a lot of xxx words during the call but I did apologize after it had sunk in
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: burakkucat on January 06, 2017, 11:17:13 PM
. . . the ISP is LLU'd (vodafone) so the port must be different to EE's port  :-\

No.  :no:  The line-card port has not changed. Remember that the G.993.2 circuit remains the same for any ISP/CP.

That G.993.2 link is between your modem/router and Openreach's Huawei SmartAX MA5603T MSAN in the cabinet associated with NIHB_P1. The physical fibre link connects the MA5603T MSAN with the OLT situated in NIBA.

EE are being very "economical" with the truth if that is their response.  :o

I really do not know what to suggest.  :(
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Chrysalis on January 06, 2017, 11:26:31 PM
The issue is that between different GEA providers it counts as a cease and then a new provide.  For that to work there needs to be a free port beforehand, else after the CEASE someone in the waiting list gets allocated the port.

I actually give EE a thumbs up for alerting newt before hand, some providers have stayed silent (to get the new customer), and then had a angry customer on adsl afterwards stuck there.

Sadly for newt, this trying out vodafone idea has turned out to be a disaster, it seems is 3 realistic options.

1 - stay with vodafone and keep checking to see if ports free up, if they do then order migration, issue with this then will outlast the trial period.
2 - move to a vodafone reseller where it may not count as a GEA move.
3 - push ahead with the migration and downgrade to adsl with the understanding when a port frees up then will move back to vdsl.

if option #1 then I think newt can have a stable connection if putting the vodafone router behind the billion 8800nl or the hg612, When I tested the bt homehub that worked fine in such a configuration, likewise the sky hub also can work like that, so I be surprised if vodafone dont allow that configuration.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on January 06, 2017, 11:39:59 PM
EE are being very "economical" with the truth if that is their response.  :o
I really do not know what to suggest.  :(

It is a bit late now as it's 23:23pm to call someone like Plusnet for a deal but the sales staff don't know the condition of the FTTC cabinet during the sale only after it go's though the procedure then it shows whether the line can be allocated to a FTTC port in the cab  :-\

A third call to VF tonight shows 7 drops in 24 hours and again had to stick it in the master socket and again it dropped out.

@ Chry they did not alert me I had to call them to find this out  :(
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on January 07, 2017, 07:10:47 PM
Gave Origin a call to see what they could do for me they say it takes 14 days for order to be processed so that would be over the 30 day cooling off period with Vodafone and into a an 18 month contract the only way would be to cease the order with Vodafone and they take over the line as ADSL and wait for VDSL port to become available.

Sorry but I am not going back to ADSL which works out as £23 for ADSL & phone I am currently paying VF £26 for FTTC 40/10 and phone E/W calls.

How long can it take for a FTTC port to become available these days and don't know if there is just the one line card in the slot of this 288 FTTC cabinet or if it's fully populated
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: burakkucat on January 07, 2017, 09:08:07 PM
The big fibre cabinet, associated with NIHB_P1, contains a Huawei MA5603T MSAN (used only as a DSLAM). As that cabinet has not been physically extended, to allow for more tie-cable pair terminations and associated low-pass filters, its maximum capacity is for 288 end-users. (Six line-cards, each card with 48 ports.)

If I were in your present situation my choice and, thus, action would be to leave Vodafone, as a priority, within the 30-day period. If it means dropping back to a G.992.{1|3|5} service with EE, until such time as a port for a G.993.2 service comes available, then I would do so.

I have forgotten, hence the next question: What service could you obtain from BT Consumer?
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on January 07, 2017, 09:43:53 PM
Don't want to be waiting around for 4 month for a FTTC port to become available to me as that is a backwards step and yes I have made a mistake by going to vodafone and will pay for it with a shitty modem & their T&C.

Have to say I am starting to get used to not being able to see any stats that used to be available under Dslstats telnet all I have now is SNR Margin and Actual Data rate and CRC + FEC that is still a heck of a lot more than you had with a locked down HG612 & HH3  :) I have to keep myself positive you know what I meen  ;)

Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: d2d4j on January 07, 2017, 10:05:22 PM
Hi

It's just a thought, but if your friendly with a neighbour, might be possible to share their connection using LOS, then when a port is free, separate

We did this for a neighbour who fell on hard times, and was easy with multiple statics

Many thanks

John
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on January 07, 2017, 10:18:05 PM
Cheers for that but want is LOS ?
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: d2d4j on January 07, 2017, 10:33:01 PM
Hi

Sorry, LOS is line of sight wifi.

2 outdoor hi power wifi AP.

There is a few posts on here about this, and the cost is not expensive

Many thanks

John
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on January 07, 2017, 11:05:14 PM
Yes I see now read a thread about that some time ago on this forum it's not possible for me to do this my pride would not allow me to do so, this proverb says it all you reap what you sow "you eventually have to face up to the consequences of your actions"
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: d2d4j on January 07, 2017, 11:21:59 PM
Hi newtonstar

There are a lot proverbs, pride before a fall but the best one to go by, is everyone needs friends

Appreciate what your saying though

Many thanks

John
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on January 09, 2017, 06:12:48 PM
Lets see were we are with Vodafone - line drops are continuing the longest up time connection I have seen was 20 hours and 49 minutes the worst was 12 drops in less that 24 hours.

So called VF for the third time on Saturday and still waiting for the 2nd line tech team to call me back, what I have been told if they cannot fix these resyncs/retrains then the contract with them will cease we shall see.

Code: [Select]
Jan  8 21:04:37 2017 Jan  8 21:04:37 2017 1 System debug ACS_INFORM_SENT;0 BOOTSTRAP,4 VALUE CHANGE,2 PERIODIC
Jan  8 21:04:54 2017 Jan  8 21:04:54 2017 1 WAN information WAN_DISCONNECTED;VLAN Physical Device;data;ipsec3
Jan  8 21:04:54 2017 Jan  8 21:04:54 2017 1 WAN information WAN_DISCONNECTED;VLAN Physical Device;data;ppp2
Jan  8 21:05:07 2017 Jan  8 21:05:07 2017 1 System debug ACS_ERROR_CODE;9
Jan  8 21:05:07 2017 Jan  8 21:05:07 2017 1 System error ACS_CONNECTION_FAILED
Jan  8 21:05:24 2017 Jan  8 21:05:24 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  8 21:05:26 2017 Jan  8 21:05:26 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  8 21:05:30 2017 Jan  8 21:05:30 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  8 21:05:38 2017 Jan  8 21:05:38 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  8 21:05:54 2017 Jan  8 21:05:54 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  8 21:06:26 2017 Jan  8 21:06:26 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  8 21:07:30 2017 Jan  8 21:07:30 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  8 21:07:30 2017 Jan  8 21:07:30 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADO_RCVD
Jan  8 21:07:30 2017 Jan  8 21:07:30 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADR_SENT
Jan  8 21:07:30 2017 Jan  8 21:07:30 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADS_RCVD
Jan  8 21:07:32 2017 Jan  8 21:07:32 2017 1 System information PPP_AUTH_TOPEER_CHAP_STARTED
Jan  8 21:07:33 2017 Jan  8 21:07:33 2017 1 System information PPP_AUTH_TOPEER_SUCCESSFUL
Jan  8 21:07:34 2017 Jan  8 21:07:34 2017 1 WAN information WAN_CONNECTED;VLAN Physical Device;data;
Jan  8 21:07:34 2017 Jan  8 21:07:34 2017 1 WAN information WAN_CONNECTED;VLAN Physical Device;data;
Jan  8 21:07:36 2017 Jan  8 21:07:36 2017 1 System debug ACS_NEXT_TRY;6673
Jan  8 22:28:46 2017 Jan  8 22:28:46 2017 1 LAN information LAN_HOST_DEL;DESKTOP-38L0KB0;
Jan  8 22:58:49 2017 Jan  8 22:58:49 2017 1 System debug ACS_INFORM_SENT;0 BOOTSTRAP,4 VALUE CHANGE,2 PERIODIC
Jan  8 22:58:52 2017 Jan  8 22:58:52 2017 1 System debug ACS_NEXT_TRY;7
Jan  8 22:58:52 2017 Jan  8 22:58:52 2017 1 System debug ACS_CONNECTION_REQUEST
Jan  8 22:58:52 2017 Jan  8 22:58:52 2017 1 System debug ACS_CONNECTION_REQUEST
Jan  8 22:59:00 2017 Jan  8 22:59:00 2017 1 System debug ACS_INFORM_SENT;6 CONNECTION REQUEST
Jan  8 23:18:14 2017 Jan  8 23:18:14 2017 1 LAN information WLAN_HOST_ADD;
Jan  8 23:51:55 2017 Jan  8 23:51:55 2017 1 LAN information WLAN_HOST_ADD;
Jan  8 23:54:00 2017 Jan  8 23:54:00 2017 1 LAN information WLAN_HOST_DEL
Jan  9 00:12:01 2017 Jan  9 00:12:01 2017 1 LAN information WLAN_HOST_DEL
Jan  9 02:19:10 2017 Jan  9 02:19:10 2017 1 WAN information WAN_DISCONNECTED;VLAN Physical Device;data;ipsec3
Jan  9 02:19:10 2017 Jan  9 02:19:10 2017 1 WAN information WAN_DISCONNECTED;VLAN Physical Device;data;ppp2
Jan  9 02:19:41 2017 Jan  9 02:19:41 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 02:19:43 2017 Jan  9 02:19:43 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 02:19:47 2017 Jan  9 02:19:47 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 02:19:55 2017 Jan  9 02:19:55 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 02:20:11 2017 Jan  9 02:20:11 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 02:20:43 2017 Jan  9 02:20:43 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 02:21:47 2017 Jan  9 02:21:47 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 02:21:47 2017 Jan  9 02:21:47 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADO_RCVD
Jan  9 02:21:47 2017 Jan  9 02:21:47 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADR_SENT
Jan  9 02:21:47 2017 Jan  9 02:21:47 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADS_RCVD
Jan  9 02:21:49 2017 Jan  9 02:21:49 2017 1 System information PPP_AUTH_TOPEER_CHAP_STARTED
Jan  9 02:21:50 2017 Jan  9 02:21:50 2017 1 System information PPP_AUTH_TOPEER_SUCCESSFUL
Jan  9 02:21:51 2017 Jan  9 02:21:51 2017 1 WAN information WAN_CONNECTED;VLAN Physical
Jan  9 02:21:51 2017 Jan  9 02:21:51 2017 1 WAN information WAN_CONNECTED;VLAN Physical
Jan  9 02:21:56 2017 Jan  9 02:21:56 2017 1 System debug ACS_NEXT_TRY;7
Jan  9 02:22:04 2017 Jan  9 02:22:04 2017 1 System debug ACS_INFORM_SENT;4 VALUE CHANGE
Jan  9 11:29:49 2017 Jan  9 11:29:49 2017 1 LAN information LAN_HOST_ADD;DESKTOP-38L0KB0;
Jan  9 11:31:44 2017 Jan  9 11:31:44 2017 1 System information LOCAL_UI_LOGIN
Jan  9 13:21:23 2017 Jan  9 13:21:23 2017 1 LAN information LAN_HOST_DEL;DESKTOP-38L0KB0;
Jan  9 13:33:49 2017 Jan  9 13:33:49 2017 1 LAN information WLAN_HOST_DEL;android-
Jan  9 13:33:54 2017 Jan  9 13:33:54 2017 1 LAN information WLAN_HOST_ADD;android-
Jan  9 13:34:04 2017 Jan  9 13:34:04 2017 1 LAN information WLAN_HOST_DEL;android-
Jan  9 16:36:02 2017 Jan  9 16:36:02 2017 1 WAN information WAN_DISCONNECTED;VLAN Physical Device;data;ipsec3
Jan  9 16:36:03 2017 Jan  9 16:36:03 2017 1 WAN information WAN_DISCONNECTED;VLAN Physical Device;data;ppp2
Jan  9 16:36:27 2017 Jan  9 16:36:27 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 16:36:29 2017 Jan  9 16:36:29 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 16:36:33 2017 Jan  9 16:36:33 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 16:36:41 2017 Jan  9 16:36:41 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 16:36:57 2017 Jan  9 16:36:57 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 16:37:31 2017 Jan  9 16:37:31 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 16:37:32 2017 Jan  9 16:37:32 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 16:37:36 2017 Jan  9 16:37:36 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 16:37:44 2017 Jan  9 16:37:44 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 16:38:00 2017 Jan  9 16:38:00 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 16:38:00 2017 Jan  9 16:38:00 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADO_RCVD
Jan  9 16:38:00 2017 Jan  9 16:38:00 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADR_SENT
Jan  9 16:38:01 2017 Jan  9 16:38:01 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADS_RCVD
Jan  9 16:38:03 2017 Jan  9 16:38:03 2017 1 System information PPP_AUTH_TOPEER_CHAP_STARTED
Jan  9 16:38:04 2017 Jan  9 16:38:04 2017 1 System information PPP_AUTH_TOPEER_SUCCESSFUL
Jan  9 16:38:04 2017 Jan  9 16:38:04 2017 1 WAN information WAN_CONNECTED;VLAN Physical Device;data;
Jan  9 16:38:04 2017 Jan  9 16:38:04 2017 1 WAN information WAN_CONNECTED;VLAN Physical Device;data;
Jan  9 16:38:09 2017 Jan  9 16:38:09 2017 1 System debug ACS_NEXT_TRY;8
Jan  9 16:38:18 2017 Jan  9 16:38:18 2017 1 System debug ACS_INFORM_SENT;4 VALUE CHANGE
Jan  9 16:48:29 2017 Jan  9 16:48:29 2017 1 LAN information WLAN_HOST_ADD;android-
Jan  9 16:49:10 2017 Jan  9 16:49:10 2017 1 WAN information WAN_DISCONNECTED;VLAN Physical Device;data;ipsec3
Jan  9 16:49:10 2017 Jan  9 16:49:10 2017 1 WAN information WAN_DISCONNECTED;VLAN Physical Device;data;ppp2
Jan  9 16:49:40 2017 Jan  9 16:49:40 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 16:49:42 2017 Jan  9 16:49:42 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 16:49:46 2017 Jan  9 16:49:46 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 16:49:54 2017 Jan  9 16:49:54 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 16:50:10 2017 Jan  9 16:50:10 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 16:50:42 2017 Jan  9 16:50:42 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 16:50:42 2017 Jan  9 16:50:42 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADO_RCVD
Jan  9 16:50:42 2017 Jan  9 16:50:42 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADR_SENT
Jan  9 16:50:43 2017 Jan  9 16:50:43 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADS_RCVD
Jan  9 16:50:45 2017 Jan  9 16:50:45 2017 1 System information PPP_AUTH_TOPEER_CHAP_STARTED
Jan  9 16:50:45 2017 Jan  9 16:50:45 2017 1 System information PPP_AUTH_TOPEER_SUCCESSFUL
Jan  9 16:50:47 2017 Jan  9 16:50:47 2017 1 WAN information WAN_CONNECTED;VLAN Physical
Jan  9 16:50:47 2017 Jan  9 16:50:47 2017 1 WAN information WAN_CONNECTED;VLAN Physical
Jan  9 16:50:52 2017 Jan  9 16:50:52 2017 1 System debug ACS_NEXT_TRY;6
Jan  9 16:50:59 2017 Jan  9 16:50:59 2017 1 System debug ACS_INFORM_SENT;4 VALUE CHANGE
Jan  9 16:51:29 2017 Jan  9 16:51:29 2017 1 System debug ACS_ERROR_CODE;9
Jan  9 16:51:29 2017 Jan  9 16:51:29 2017 1 System error ACS_CONNECTION_FAILED
Jan  9 16:51:29 2017 Jan  9 16:51:29 2017 1 System debug ACS_NEXT_TRY;16
Jan  9 16:51:46 2017 Jan  9 16:51:46 2017 1 System debug ACS_INFORM_SENT;4 VALUE CHANGE
Jan  9 16:52:16 2017 Jan  9 16:52:16 2017 1 System debug ACS_ERROR_CODE;9
Jan  9 16:52:16 2017 Jan  9 16:52:16 2017 1 System error ACS_CONNECTION_FAILED
Jan  9 16:52:16 2017 Jan  9 16:52:16 2017 1 System debug ACS_NEXT_TRY;35
Jan  9 16:52:27 2017 Jan  9 16:52:27 2017 1 LAN information LAN_HOST_ADD;DESKTOP-38L0KB0;
Jan  9 16:52:51 2017 Jan  9 16:52:51 2017 1 System debug ACS_INFORM_SENT;4 VALUE CHANGE
Jan  9 16:53:21 2017 Jan  9 16:53:21 2017 1 System debug ACS_ERROR_CODE;9
Jan  9 16:53:21 2017 Jan  9 16:53:21 2017 1 System error ACS_CONNECTION_FAILED
Jan  9 16:53:21 2017 Jan  9 16:53:21 2017 1 System debug ACS_NEXT_TRY;76
Jan  9 16:53:25 2017 Jan  9 16:53:25 2017 1 System information LOCAL_UI_LOGIN
Jan  9 16:54:38 2017 Jan  9 16:54:38 2017 1 System debug ACS_INFORM_SENT;4 VALUE CHANGE
Jan  9 16:55:08 2017 Jan  9 16:55:08 2017 1 System debug ACS_ERROR_CODE;9
Jan  9 16:55:08 2017 Jan  9 16:55:08 2017 1 System error ACS_CONNECTION_FAILED
Jan  9 16:55:08 2017 Jan  9 16:55:08 2017 1 System debug ACS_NEXT_TRY;111
Jan  9 16:57:00 2017 Jan  9 16:57:00 2017 1 System debug ACS_INFORM_SENT;4 VALUE CHANGE
Jan  9 16:57:30 2017 Jan  9 16:57:30 2017 1 System debug ACS_ERROR_CODE;9
Jan  9 16:57:30 2017 Jan  9 16:57:30 2017 1 System error ACS_CONNECTION_FAILED
Jan  9 16:57:30 2017 Jan  9 16:57:30 2017 1 System debug ACS_NEXT_TRY;227
Jan  9 17:01:17 2017 Jan  9 17:01:17 2017 1 System debug ACS_INFORM_SENT;4 VALUE CHANGE
Jan  9 17:01:47 2017 Jan  9 17:01:47 2017 1 System debug ACS_ERROR_CODE;9
Jan  9 17:01:47 2017 Jan  9 17:01:47 2017 1 System error ACS_CONNECTION_FAILED
Jan  9 17:01:47 2017 Jan  9 17:01:47 2017 1 System debug ACS_NEXT_TRY;544
Jan  9 17:10:52 2017 Jan  9 17:10:52 2017 1 System debug ACS_INFORM_SENT;4 VALUE CHANGE
Jan  9 17:11:22 2017 Jan  9 17:11:22 2017 1 System debug ACS_ERROR_CODE;9
Jan  9 17:11:22 2017 Jan  9 17:11:22 2017 1 System error ACS_CONNECTION_FAILED
Jan  9 17:11:22 2017 Jan  9 17:11:22 2017 1 System debug ACS_NEXT_TRY;1276
Jan  9 17:17:46 2017 Jan  9 17:17:46 2017 1 WAN information WAN_DISCONNECTED;VLAN Physical Device;data;ipsec3
Jan  9 17:17:46 2017 Jan  9 17:17:46 2017 1 WAN information WAN_DISCONNECTED;VLAN Physical Device;data;ppp2
Jan  9 17:18:12 2017 Jan  9 17:18:12 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 17:18:14 2017 Jan  9 17:18:14 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 17:18:18 2017 Jan  9 17:18:18 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 17:18:26 2017 Jan  9 17:18:26 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 17:18:42 2017 Jan  9 17:18:42 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 17:19:14 2017 Jan  9 17:19:14 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 17:20:18 2017 Jan  9 17:20:18 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 17:20:18 2017 Jan  9 17:20:18 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADO_RCVD
Jan  9 17:20:18 2017 Jan  9 17:20:18 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADR_SENT
Jan  9 17:20:18 2017 Jan  9 17:20:18 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADS_RCVD
Jan  9 17:20:20 2017 Jan  9 17:20:20 2017 1 System information PPP_AUTH_TOPEER_CHAP_STARTED
Jan  9 17:20:21 2017 Jan  9 17:20:21 2017 1 System information PPP_AUTH_TOPEER_SUCCESSFUL
Jan  9 17:20:22 2017 Jan  9 17:20:22 2017 1 WAN information WAN_CONNECTED;VLAN Physical Device;data;
Jan  9 17:20:22 2017 Jan  9 17:20:22 2017 1 WAN information WAN_CONNECTED;VLAN Physical Device;data;
Jan  9 17:20:24 2017 Jan  9 17:20:24 2017 1 System debug ACS_NEXT_TRY;704
Jan  9 17:20:34 2017 Jan  9 17:20:34 2017 1 WAN information WAN_DISCONNECTED;VLAN Physical Device;data;ipsec3
Jan  9 17:20:34 2017 Jan  9 17:20:34 2017 1 WAN information WAN_DISCONNECTED;VLAN Physical Device;data;ppp2
Jan  9 17:20:59 2017 Jan  9 17:20:59 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 17:21:01 2017 Jan  9 17:21:01 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 17:21:05 2017 Jan  9 17:21:05 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 17:21:13 2017 Jan  9 17:21:13 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 17:21:29 2017 Jan  9 17:21:29 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 17:22:01 2017 Jan  9 17:22:01 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 17:22:01 2017 Jan  9 17:22:01 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADO_RCVD
Jan  9 17:22:01 2017 Jan  9 17:22:01 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADR_SENT
Jan  9 17:22:01 2017 Jan  9 17:22:01 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADS_RCVD
Jan  9 17:22:03 2017 Jan  9 17:22:03 2017 1 System information PPP_AUTH_TOPEER_CHAP_STARTED
Jan  9 17:22:03 2017 Jan  9 17:22:03 2017 1 System information PPP_AUTH_TOPEER_SUCCESSFUL
Jan  9 17:22:05 2017 Jan  9 17:22:05 2017 1 WAN information WAN_CONNECTED;VLAN Physical Device;;ipsec3
Jan  9 17:22:05 2017 Jan  9 17:22:05 2017 1 WAN information WAN_CONNECTED;VLAN Physical Device;;ppp2
Jan  9 17:22:07 2017 Jan  9 17:22:07 2017 1 System debug ACS_NEXT_TRY;694
Jan  9 17:33:41 2017 Jan  9 17:33:41 2017 1 System debug ACS_INFORM_SENT;4 VALUE CHANGE
Jan  9 17:49:57 2017 Jan  9 17:49:57 2017 1 System debug ACS_NEXT_TRY;6
Jan  9 17:50:03 2017 Jan  9 17:50:03 2017 1 System debug ACS_INFORM_SENT;2 PERIODIC
Jan  9 18:37:56 2017 Jan  9 18:37:56 2017 1 LAN information WLAN_HOST_DEL;android-
Jan  9 18:53:23 2017 Jan  9 18:53:23 2017 1 System information LOCAL_UI_LOGIN
Jan  9 19:07:16 2017 Jan  9 19:07:16 2017 1 LAN information WLAN_HOST_ADD;android-
Jan  9 19:09:49 2017 Jan  9 19:09:49 2017 1 System information LOCAL_UI_LOGIN
Jan  9 21:04:49 2017 Jan  9 21:04:49 2017 1 System information LOCAL_UI_LOGIN
Jan  9 21:32:54 2017 Jan  9 21:32:54 2017 1 WAN information WAN_DISCONNECTED;VLAN Physical Device;data;ipsec3
Jan  9 21:32:54 2017 Jan  9 21:32:54 2017 1 WAN information WAN_DISCONNECTED;VLAN Physical Device;data;ppp2
Jan  9 21:33:15 2017 Jan  9 21:33:15 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 21:33:17 2017 Jan  9 21:33:17 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 21:33:21 2017 Jan  9 21:33:21 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 21:33:29 2017 Jan  9 21:33:29 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 21:33:45 2017 Jan  9 21:33:45 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 21:34:17 2017 Jan  9 21:34:17 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADI_SENT
Jan  9 21:34:17 2017 Jan  9 21:34:17 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADO_RCVD
Jan  9 21:34:17 2017 Jan  9 21:34:17 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADR_SENT
Jan  9 21:34:17 2017 Jan  9 21:34:17 2017 1 System information PPPOE_PADS_RCVD
Jan  9 21:34:19 2017 Jan  9 21:34:19 2017 1 System information PPP_AUTH_TOPEER_CHAP_STARTED
Jan  9 21:34:20 2017 Jan  9 21:34:20 2017 1 System information PPP_AUTH_TOPEER_SUCCESSFUL
Jan  9 21:34:21 2017 Jan  9 21:34:21 2017 1 WAN information WAN_CONNECTED;VLAN Physical Device;ipsec3
Jan  9 21:34:21 2017 Jan  9 21:34:21 2017 1 WAN information WAN_CONNECTED;VLAN Physical Device;ppp2
Jan  9 21:34:27 2017 Jan  9 21:34:27 2017 1 System debug ACS_NEXT_TRY;10
Jan  9 21:34:38 2017 Jan  9 21:34:38 2017 1 System debug ACS_INFORM_SENT;4 VALUE CHANGE
Jan  9 21:34:45 2017 Jan  9 21:34:45 2017 1 System information LOCAL_UI_LOGIN
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on January 09, 2017, 10:26:22 PM
JST  ;)
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on January 09, 2017, 10:54:31 PM
This part is strange since moving from EE to Vodafone those nuisance calls on the landline have stopped and that is with CPR call blocker removed are VF doing this at the exchange level
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: j0hn on January 10, 2017, 12:33:54 AM
If your waiting/watching for a free port on your cabinet the best/easiest way is checking the BTw checker just after midnight. I've seen my cabinet with a waiting list at 23:55, then available at 00:02am. This allowed me to put in an order to migrate. By 8am the cabinet was showing a waiting list again.

Pretty stupid system that locks you with your current ISP just because the cabinet is full. They don't even visit the cabinet when doing a migration.
The issue is that between different GEA providers it counts as a cease and then a new provide.  For that to work there needs to be a free port beforehand, else after the CEASE someone in the waiting list gets allocated the port.
Is this still the case? When with Talktalk and with my cabinet full, I couldn't migrate to any ISP, including those who use TalkTalk backhaul.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on January 10, 2017, 12:05:12 PM
Does the BTw checker give you information about cabinet ports if so post the link here john.

Vodafone called to say engineer will arrive tomorrow 8am-1pm they are also concerned about drops on my line, but what can the engineer do in my case the line was rock steady with EE and with Billion 8800NL in place. 
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: les-70 on January 10, 2017, 12:48:54 PM
 I think the BTW checker is http://www.dslchecker.bt.com/adsl/adslchecker.welcome    You may need to use a neighbor's phone number, who is not LLU'd,  to get a result.  Just be sure that the neighbor is on the same CAB as you.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: burakkucat on January 10, 2017, 06:08:04 PM
Vodafone called to say engineer will arrive tomorrow 8am-1pm they are also concerned about drops on my line, but what can the engineer do in my case the line was rock steady with EE and with Billion 8800NL in place.

From the snippet of the log you showed, above, the problem is with the VF PPP session and higher software layers. There is nothing wrong with the physical infrastructure -- hence there is nothing for an "engineer" from VF (or an Openreach technician) to do.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on January 10, 2017, 07:23:26 PM
I used to drop the PPPoE session on the 8800NL often but that never effected the FTTC connection but this HHG2500 when the PPPoE session drops out it takes down the FTTC connection as well seen as a new IP address and different Data rate on the DS & US.

As far as I know there are two types of drops PPPoE sessions which does not effect your VDSL connection you just don't have any internet access and a line drop which does effect your VDSL connection & no internet connection while the modem resyncs.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Chrysalis on January 10, 2017, 08:05:14 PM
Newt you may have answered this which if you did I apologise.

But is there a reason you cannot run the vodafone router behind the billion in bridge mode or the hg612?
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on January 10, 2017, 08:29:10 PM
You can't bridge the HHG2500 to HG612 or 8800NL as the 2500 does not have a working WAN socket and yet there is one but covered up and also there is no option in the GUI firmware 2500 to select a bridging mode.

One point before engineers arrives tomorrow morning I don't want a DLM reset as the line is not in anyway banded it is working as it should with G.INP active should I tell him or her not to do a DLM reset ?   
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Chrysalis on January 10, 2017, 08:45:09 PM
I meant the other way round.

The HHG2500 would be the router, but the HG612/8800NL would be the modem.

I expect one of the LAN ports acts as a WAN port in that case, so it wont be labeled as WAN but would be a dual purpose port.

The should solve the dropouts as you would have a good modem in place.

if vodafone dont even let you use it behind a bridged modem then they are the most locked down isp in the UK as even BT and sky let you connect modem's.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on January 10, 2017, 08:58:04 PM
I meant the other way round.
The HHG2500 would be the router, but the HG612/8800NL would be the modem.

I know what you meen but it is not possible the HHG2500 has no way to communicate with a modem on the outside but you can setup the HHG2500 as a modem and use say a RT-AC68U as the router with some changes on the HHG2500 settings but that is not what we want.
 
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on January 10, 2017, 09:28:24 PM
Not to worry Chry I can still stick in the DSL cable to 8800NL and gather the full FTTC stats when I want but without any PPPoE activity (no internet In or OUT) was even thinking about one of those dsl splitters one for 2500 and 8800NL but if memory serves me right that would cause a large bridge tap on both modems and cause my circuit to become very unstable  ;)
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Chrysalis on January 10, 2017, 09:33:11 PM
I think you should take burakkucat's advice and migrate back to EE even if it means adsl temporarily.  Although I know thats easy for me to say as I wouldnt have to use that connection.  But if you dealing with frequent cutouts affecting netflix etc. then the current VDSL isnt great anyway.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: burakkucat on January 10, 2017, 09:55:42 PM
. . . was even thinking about one of those dsl splitters one for 2500 and 8800NL but if memory serves me right that would cause a large bridge tap on both modems and cause my circuit to become very unstable  ;)

It is impossible to have two modems connected to one circuit.  :no:  The DSLAM would get very confused and then sulk, by going mute!
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on January 10, 2017, 10:24:11 PM
But if you dealing with frequent cutouts affecting netflix etc. then the current VDSL isnt great anyway.

Sure I was watching a movie on Sky GO last week and had 3 disconnects halfway into the movie and said feck this then tried again the next day and two disconnects before the end of the movie it was not a great experience.

As I said if this ISP connection is not up to standard the contract will be nullified under consumer law and I can walk away from vodafone and find a suitable ISP if and when a port
becomes available.

I would like to give these guys at vodafone a chance to rectify this as you have seen jumping ships to many times comes at a cost, if the line passes the engineer test as I expect it will then the onus will be on Vodafone's side IE Modem/router or their Network  ;)

It is impossible to have two modems connected to one circuit.  :no:  The DSLAM would get very confused and then sulk, by going mute!

Was only thinking about it BC and I guess a sure way to feck my DLM profile
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on January 10, 2017, 10:46:28 PM
And would you believe it the PPP session on the HHG2500 has been up for more than 24 hours have seen this happen before on many posts were the engineer is to visit a fault reported premises  :lol:

PPP session uptime 1 day, 1 hour and 8 minutes
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: j0hn on January 10, 2017, 11:49:24 PM
Does the BTw checker give you information about cabinet ports if so post the link here john.
just the http://www.dslchecker.bt.com site
as your Vodafone you'll need to use the address checker but it gives the exact same info you need.
WBC FTTC Availability date will show "waiting list" if no free ports, and "available" when an order can be placed.
If it's a full cabinet and 1 free port becomes available then I wouldn't wait till morning to call an ISP, I would instantly place the order with your new ISP of choice. You can always call later in the day and amend any order/barter for a better deal.

I only know of BT Retail using the waiting list. Plusnet used to but now no longer place customers on the waiting list. This means my very full cabinet (waiting for 2nd cab to go live) still becomes "available" occasionally. It's usually showing full again by lunchtime, sometimes much quicker. This has allowed me to migrate twice, and notify a neighbour they can place an order.

Tip: You can get BT Infinity 1 Unlimited for £29.99/month for the full 12 months by going via topcashback. It says new customers only, but only the cashback part is rejected if you have already been a customer. The cheaper contract terms can't be changed. After calling later the same day they dropped this to £27.99. No good if you're not interested in BT, but handy for situations like yours where only 1 port becomes free. BT's system appears to book it instantly. I tried on 2 occasions with another ISP and the order was cancelled both times due to the cabinet being full, despite the checker becoming available. The ISP informed me their online ordering system does not reserve the port in real-time.

Hopefully your cabinet becomes available and you can migrate to another VDSL2 service. Shocking that Vodafone would rather throw you away as a customer rather than let you use your own modem.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on January 11, 2017, 05:36:06 PM
Cheers John for that helpful information the checker is showing FTTC as available and has always done so unless EE has got it wrong at there end and the FTTC is not full as they said.

Engineer arrived this morning was his first customer of the day 8:20am the line shows as excellent copper pairs on the JDSU balance was perfect no CRCs no crosstalk yet I will dispute this no need for a DLM reset all tests passed and took himself off to the cabinet to check if all was well at that end. 

EDIT: PS Vodafone have waived the connection fee of £49 for are trouble

Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: burakkucat on January 11, 2017, 05:56:48 PM
In a way, it is good news to have confirmation of what we already knew. That the metallic pathway is in good condition.  :)

Now VF will have to accept that the problem is within their own domain -- either the HHG2500 or their RAS. The former can be tested by substitution with a known workable device -- say a Billion 8800NL, as long as the login credentials are provided. ::)
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on January 11, 2017, 07:18:56 PM
You make a good point BC - testing your circuit with another modem in these forums and also on ISP technical forums is an essential part of the diagnostics to rule out the modem being the culprit and for me and many others on Vodafone connect this avenue is blocked it's stupid and unhelpful even the OR Engineer said your not the first customer I've had using Vodafone with VDSL dropout complaints.

Do I ring Vodafone support to find out what the Engineer put on the notes to ISP or will they call me back to what was or not found ?

I am a bit of noob when it comes to ISP technical support as I've only needed to call once in 4 years and now have called 3 time and 4 chats in under 1 month  :doh:
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Ronski on January 11, 2017, 07:38:05 PM
Cheers John for that helpful information the checker is showing FTTC as available and has always done so unless EE has got it wrong at there end and the FTTC is not full as they said.

I'm certain that if you have an active FTTC connection the checker will always shows that you have availability, you need to check an address/number that does not currently have an FTTC connection.

Which also begs the question if the ISP can see you already have an FTTC connection why can't they just take it over???
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: burakkucat on January 11, 2017, 07:55:16 PM
. . . even the OR Engineer said your not the first customer I've had using Vodafone with VDSL dropout complaints.

Do I ring Vodafone support to find out what the Engineer put on the notes to ISP or will they call me back to what was or not found ?

I would be inclined to contact VF, to update them on the result of the Openreach technician's visit. Then the above comment, about other VF customers having dropout problems, could also be relayed back.

The next item to discuss is where in the VF domain does this problem originate, as the metallic pathway has now been ruled out? A very simple test would be to substitute a known, reliable modem/router for the HHG2500. But you will need the login credentials so as to establish a working connection . . .
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on January 11, 2017, 08:41:52 PM
Brilliant idea Ronski would never have thought about that so tried two neighbors between me and I know for sure one of them does not have any broadband and the results show as FTTC available

Will do BC just need a rest will give them a bell tomorrow still need to calm down after the OR visit but this one was not the grumpy type he was very knowledgeable and even understood what G.INP was 

 
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: j0hn on January 11, 2017, 09:17:35 PM
I'm certain that if you have an active FTTC connection the checker will always shows that you have availability, you need to check an address/number that does not currently have an FTTC connection.

Which also begs the question if the ISP can see you already have an FTTC connection why can't they just take it over???
I believe that to be incorrect. No idea with a number check, but the address checker will show "waiting list" if the cabinet is full, even if you have FTTC. That's certainly what my line has always done.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on January 20, 2017, 08:21:58 PM
Vodafone sent me a replacement HHG2500 to see if this would stop the VDSL disconnects unfortunately that made no difference and still getting 4 to 8 disconnects per day, noticed sync increased yesterday on the UPstream and G.INP has been applied normally that only happens when a line becomes unstable.

Another tech2 call expected tomorrow from VF so we have had an OR engineer who passed the line as good and a second CPE modem router for testing and after 11 requests they won't give me the username & password to test a third party modem on my line  :wall:

just going to post some stats from the Billion sorry there is not much duration to go on but VF will be monitoring these random disconnects  ::)


Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Ronski on January 21, 2017, 08:42:12 AM
I believe that to be incorrect. No idea with a number check, but the address checker will show "waiting list" if the cabinet is full, even if you have FTTC. That's certainly what my line has always done.

Number check shows as available (so long as the number has fttc already),  and address check is as John says. I confirmed this on my line yesterday.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on February 10, 2017, 12:13:12 AM
Nearly sure we shall be walking away from Vodafone so here we go again which ISP MK2 this time I am going to leave this to the members to decide but must keep it realistic

Here is what I am considering

Plusnet
Origin
EE

or any other apart from AA or SKY TT and BT
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: burakkucat on February 10, 2017, 12:44:46 AM
Considering that your telephony serving exchange (NIHB) is classified as "Market 1" and does not have any LLU presence but your head-end exchange for a G.993.2 service (NIBA) is classified as "Market 3" you probably will experience the elevated price scenario with Plusnet. Also the Plusnet service has gone downhill over the last year and a half, from reading the comments of their customers. So I would rule out Plusnet.

Origin are still a bit of an unknown, to me. So "be cautious" would be my comment.

EE served you well . . .  ;)

A&A have been described as a "strange company run by a strange man" but if one can cope with the little eccentricities and the hefty price then they would be first on the list.

Sky. Murdock family. Enough said.

TalkTalk may or may not be available to you. It depends upon whether the service availability is based on the status of NIHB (no) or NIBA (yes). I've been with them for nearly ten years and have had no problems with their service.

BT Consumer . . . what could I say? Er . . .  :-X
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Ronski on February 10, 2017, 10:20:36 AM
I've been with Plusnet for over 13 years,  but things certainly seem to have gone down hill recently. So I'm considering moving to IDNET when my new Huawei cabinet goes live.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on February 10, 2017, 01:23:21 PM
Those are fair and honest comments from both of you and installed the Origin modem/router asus N300 for elderly friend that moved from BT to Origin.

My worry is the last time we tried to move away from VF somehow the cabinet was full but it shows as available and the big sticker on the fttc cabinet is still saying Fibre in this area  ???
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Ronski on February 10, 2017, 03:40:02 PM
Make sure you do a full address check,  don't use your phone number.  It may of just required a new line card.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on February 10, 2017, 07:50:55 PM
So did as you asked and inputted my full address to check and it shows as FTTC is still available

 
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Chrysalis on February 11, 2017, 12:04:16 AM
i would migrate back to ee now and of course fight vf later about any financial penalty they may try to impose as ee was problem free for you
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Ronski on February 11, 2017, 08:41:30 AM
Check it each day, if it stays available chances are they've increased capacity,  and you'll be ok moving.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on February 11, 2017, 01:20:43 PM
Yes EE was a very stable service but then was using the HG612 + BB2 and then the 8800NL during the 18 months.

Has anyone seen any info from ofcom allowing the ISP's customer to have upto 8 disconnects a day and is not classed as good enough reason to terminate contract just something the tech2 said during a call last week.   
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on February 13, 2017, 11:22:05 PM
Have worked out how many disconnects I've had since moving to Vodafone and that was on the 19th of December to this day = 56 days with 480 resyncs that scares the hell out of me
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: burakkucat on February 13, 2017, 11:33:16 PM
. . . 56 days with 480 resyncs . . .

That works out at over eight resynchronisation events per day.  :o  There is no way that can be considered normal behaviour.  :no:
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on February 13, 2017, 11:51:00 PM
That is correct BC and I kind of knew just after the 2nd day things were not quite right and started the process of investigation to my circuit on day 10 by the ISP it was a slow process at first with tickets being open and then closed then tests direct to mastesocket then openreach engineers

The final ticket stayed open for 2 weeks and finally Vodafone said we have done everything possible to fix this and the early termination fee as been waived.

We put an order in with EE so lets see how it goes this time.

PS I never want to talk to any ISP support team from now on  :fingers:
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: burakkucat on February 14, 2017, 12:14:06 AM
PS I never want to talk to any ISP support team from now on  :fingers:

I can quite understand. Especially when you are more knowledgeable than the CS entity to whom you are talking!  ::)

(Just think what it must be like for Kitz.  :-X  )
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on February 14, 2017, 12:33:25 AM
(Just think what it must be like for Kitz.  :-X  )

It feels feels like headbutting a board of nails for the first 3 weeks and then you become so numb all the frustration has gone then you start doubting yourself but don't let that feeling take over dig deep and find that fire within again and call your ISP everyday
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Chrysalis on February 14, 2017, 02:21:44 AM
"Hello my SNR margin is oscillating like crazy"

rep "you tried rebooting"

*Smacks head against wall and throws phone out window*
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: tickmike on February 14, 2017, 10:52:40 AM
I can quite understand. Especially when you are more knowledgeable than the CS entity to whom you are talking!  ::)

(Just think what it must be like for Kitz.  :-X  )

I find Kcom/Eclipse very good even at a high technical chat with them, being mainly a business ISP I would think they have to be.  :)
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on February 14, 2017, 06:40:28 PM
Just going to give you a typical day with Vodafone using a HHG2500 this is what I've had to put up with for 55 days.

Code: [Select]
Date Time Category Severity Log details
14.02.2017 04:20:40 WAN information WAN disconnected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service
14.02.2017 04:23:45 WAN information WAN connected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service type:
14.02.2017 04:32:04 WAN information WAN disconnected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service
14.02.2017 04:33:40 WAN information WAN connected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service type:
14.02.2017 04:48:12 WAN information WAN disconnected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service
14.02.2017 04:50:52 WAN information WAN connected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service type:
14.02.2017 07:36:19 WAN information WAN disconnected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service
14.02.2017 07:38:54 WAN information WAN connected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service type:
14.02.2017 16:40:22 WAN information WAN disconnected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service
14.02.2017 16:43:27 WAN information WAN connected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service type:
14.02.2017 16:49:28 WAN information WAN disconnected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service
14.02.2017 16:53:03 WAN information WAN connected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service type:
14.02.2017 17:01:20 WAN information WAN disconnected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service
14.02.2017 17:04:26 WAN information WAN connected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service type:
14.02.2017 17:17:12 WAN information WAN disconnected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service
14.02.2017 17:19:52 WAN information WAN connected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service type:
14.02.2017 17:23:59 WAN information WAN disconnected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service
14.02.2017 17:25:35 WAN information WAN connected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service type:
14.02.2017 17:33:04 WAN information WAN disconnected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service
14.02.2017 17:34:41 WAN information WAN connected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service type:
14.02.2017 18:10:46 WAN information WAN disconnected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service
14.02.2017 18:13:26 WAN information WAN connected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service type:
14.02.2017 20:37:17 WAN information WAN disconnected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service
14.02.2017 20:39:59 WAN information WAN connected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service type:
14.02.2017 21:57:33 WAN information WAN disconnected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service
14.02.2017 22:00:08 WAN information WAN connected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service type:
15.02.2017 02:32:35 WAN information WAN disconnected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service
15.02.2017 02:35:40 WAN information WAN connected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service type:
15.02.2017 03:19:42 WAN information WAN disconnected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service
15.02.2017 03:21:13 WAN information WAN connected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service type:
15.02.2017 03:42:24 WAN information WAN disconnected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service
15.02.2017 03:45:30 WAN information WAN connected, WAN type: WAN PTM over DSL, service type:





Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: tubaman on February 14, 2017, 07:22:44 PM
It's interesting that it manages to go from 07:38 till 16:40 without any drops but drops more regularly at other times - is this typical of what you've seen?
 :(
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: burakkucat on February 14, 2017, 07:52:48 PM
It's interesting that it manages to go from 07:38 till 16:40 without any drops . . .

Ah, yes. So it does. (But it's still yuck!  :yuck:  )
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on February 14, 2017, 08:01:58 PM
yes I would say it does have a typical trend in that evening time seems to be become more unstable and then just after 00:00 it then becomes unstable again and add in a bit of randomization in to the mix it's hard to pin down why or what causes this.

Now saying that my gut tells me the HHG2500 is not well shielded or has bad filters that don't reduce the effects of RFI and SHINE in the DSL circuitry stage inside the modem  :-\ 
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Chrysalis on February 15, 2017, 12:39:03 AM
Newt whats the stance now from VF?

I think you already have evidence of a "unfit for purpose" service, which should allow you to leave penalty free.

After giving you bad advice to join VF in the first place I hope to rectify that by giving you good advice to jump back to EE now providing the dsl checker still shows your cabinet as having spare ports.  Then afterwards you can use the "unfit for purpose" mantra to avoid fee's from VF.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Ronski on February 15, 2017, 06:13:35 AM

Chrysalis, see NS post below.

The final ticket stayed open for 2 weeks and finally Vodafone said we have done everything possible to fix this and the early termination fee as been waived.

We put an order in with EE so lets see how it goes this time.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Chrysalis on February 15, 2017, 07:28:41 AM
Cool, I think he done the right thing.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on February 15, 2017, 05:11:54 PM
the order for EE broadband & phone service was done online on sunday and this way they can send messages to mobile giving updates into how the order is proceeding, the last message says active by midnight 27/2/2017, and extra £9 a month more than VF but this time with All Calls still £6 less than what EE were charging before we left.

And still checking availability using are address each day  :fingers: 
PS updated the disconnected log for 24 hours
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: burakkucat on February 15, 2017, 10:34:09 PM
. . . the last message says active by midnight 27/2/2017, . . .

The next twelve days will probably seem like forever. Especially with --

Quote
PS updated the disconnected log for 24 hours

Double yuck! :yuck:
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on February 16, 2017, 12:54:56 PM
Just hope the order goes through this time BC, i can live with slow broadband and interleaving and being capped but have to say disconnections are the most frustrating issue to have it's definitely change my perspective about broadband speed snrm and all that stuff.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on February 19, 2017, 02:15:00 PM
Entered the telephone number into availability checker this time I read the text below and noticed this multiple order and a date, does that confirm the order to EE is going ahead received the welcome pack on friday.

 
For all ADSL and WBC Fibre to the Cabinet (VDSL or G.fast) services, the stable line rate will be determined during the first 10 days of service usage.

This line is on a Market A Exchange.

There are multiple orders open on your line which are due to complete by 27-Feb-2017.

For VDSL or G.fast Ranges A and B, the term "Clean" relates to a line which is free from any wiring issues (e.g. Bridge Taps) and/or Copper line conditions, and the term "Impacted" relates to a line which may have wiring issues (e.g. Bridge Taps) and/or Copper line conditions.


In order to be eligible for handback, downstream speed should be less than Downstream Handback Threshold values.


Throughput/download speeds will be less than line rates and can be affected by a number of factors within and external to BT's network, Communication Providers' networks and within customer premises.


The Stop Sale date for Datastream is from 30-Jun-2012; the Formal Retirement date for Datastream is from 30-Jun-2014.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: burakkucat on February 19, 2017, 04:40:39 PM
There are multiple orders open on your line which are due to complete by 27-Feb-2017.

I wonder if that is a reference to the telephony side of the migration?  :-\

If I've remembered correctly, Vodafone migrated your telephony service from BT Wholesale to their LLU platform. So I would expect the reverse to occur when migrating back to EE.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Chrysalis on February 19, 2017, 04:57:22 PM
the days are ticking down when you can use a "proper" modem again.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on February 19, 2017, 07:39:24 PM
I wonder if that is a reference to the telephony side of the migration?  :-\

Really don't know BC as it's the first time I've seen this info before and never checked it when migrating to VF, at least something is going on this time and the more I think about the last time we tried to move back to EE we received no emails no welcome pack in 7 days.

the days are ticking down when you can use a "proper" modem again.

Your so right I can't wait to kick the feck out of this HHG2500 can't put all the blame on VF as Huawei made this piece of turd and it has BCM63168 which looses sync to the DSLAM, it's the most unreliable all in one FTTC modem I've ever used from a ISP even the HH5A was reliable and the BrightBox2 was perfect
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: burakkucat on February 19, 2017, 09:47:10 PM
. . . I can't wait to kick the feck out of this HHG2500 can't put all the blame on VF as Huawei made this piece of turd and it has BCM63168 which looses sync to the DSLAM, . . .

It might be an idea to offer it to csiwek (http://forum.kitz.co.uk/index.php?action=profile;u=9372), as it's a configured device from which he can remove the NAND flash chip and then investigate.

I thought it is regularly dropping the PPPoE connection to the VF bRAS but the synchronised state with the DSLAM remains intact.  :-\

In terms of physical construction, the HHG2500 seems to be quite well made. I would like to see how one behaves if, say, OpenWRT could be loaded onto it in place of the current software image.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on February 20, 2017, 07:13:36 PM
If it's so well made why does it keep disconnecting am on the 7th disconnect since 6pm why would anyone with a sane mind even consider trying flash it with OpenWRT it's a piece of turd the w-fi signal strength is also very bad   :thumbdown:
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: ejs on February 20, 2017, 07:17:03 PM
There's no support for Broadcom DSL in OpenWRT, so it would be only functioning as a wireless router if it could be made to run OpenWRT.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Ronski on February 20, 2017, 07:20:48 PM
It'd still be worth donating it to CSIWEK just in case it helps him work out how to crack the thing without a very large hammer that it deserves!
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on February 20, 2017, 07:28:50 PM
Ronski I just wanna place in it's return bag to Vodafone an forget about this mess.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Ronski on February 20, 2017, 07:53:47 PM
Didn't realise they wanted it back.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on February 20, 2017, 08:47:59 PM
If you go into ETF (Early Termination Fee) even though it has been waived there is a good chance the ISP will ask for their modem/router to be sent back, but the Tech2 team said to me after I asked should I send the modem/router back to you after the next ISP has taken over he said no, but I don'r trust them.

So I'll keep the modem/router and wait for VF's final bill via post and see what they say.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: burakkucat on February 20, 2017, 08:49:47 PM
So I'll keep the modem/router and wait for VF's final bill via post and see what they say.

That is a good plan of action.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: burakkucat on February 20, 2017, 08:52:34 PM
There's no support for Broadcom DSL in OpenWRT, so it would be only functioning as a wireless router if it could be made to run OpenWRT.

So that's me told!  ;)  :D

Perhaps there is an alternative "alternative OS" for the hardware?  :-\
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Roxy on February 21, 2017, 05:32:06 PM
Hey kids,

As eluded to previously in my query on cabinet locations, our relocation is coming up soon.

I caught up with BT via the 'complaints' department, whom helped shape a new deal for me after all our troubles.
The summary of that package is Infinity 2 at a slightly discounted rate, with our telephone features(also discounted) on a no contract arrangement.

When I move, they stated I can keep the same package/discounts however I have to sign into a twelve month contract for the phone and a three month contract for the broadband.

I queried why they cannot waive this policy in our case, and they retorted that the deal we were given was not indefinite. I do not understand that, since they never stated it had a certain longevity or shelf life to it. It sounds like a clever way to get me back into a contract.

Looking over our available local ISP options, the usuals are in our new area, to include Sky, Plusnet, TalkTalk, etc (sadly just of range for Virgin).

I'm also interested in changing our mobile service to Vodafone or EE (as Tesco mobile is bad in the new area). A company that could package landline, mobileand broadband would be good.

Price :
BT - our current deal
Sky - most expensive of the big ones from what I saw
Plusnet - least costly

Traffic management :
BT - None?
Sky - None
Plusnet - They state none?

Download usage limits:
BT - None
Sky - None
Plusnet - Cannot clarify

Contract duration(landline/broadband):
BT - Twelve/ Three
Sky - Twelve/ Twelve
Plusnet - Twelve/ Twelve

Easy of transfer/logistics:
BT - There was a line there previously. They state they only need to reactive the line and then send Openreach out to connect it at the cabinet. I suspect this means then no signup fee(?), just the new contract.
Sky - Normal activation fee applies, have to setup a new account and go through that entire process
Plusnet -  Normal activation fee applies, have to setup a new account and go through that entire process


So why do I want to leave BT if the deal I have is good?


+Cost might be less elsewhere
+I loathe BT offshore support
+I don't trust their no traffic management claims, particularly with P2P
+It's still BT Wholesale hardware

Reasons to stay with BT and avoid changing?

+Could be a headache signing with a new company and starting all over
+Their support may just as horrendous
+Speeds won't be any better as it's still BT Wholesale hardware.


So in short, until I go somewhere that no longer uses BT hardware, I'm stuck like everyone else forking cash over to the same tired old man. Though it's a toss up whether to deal with a different sales /support team instead.



Thoughts?
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on February 21, 2017, 09:19:49 PM
Roxy people like me want a cheaper Broadband and Phone service after the current ISP contract has come to an end and if you look now most ISP's will have a minimum fee for 12/18 months and once the contract has finished you will have pay the full price.

So you have two options stay with current provider and pay more or change provider and pay less but don't select Vodafone as your choice of ISP.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: tubaman on February 22, 2017, 11:06:19 AM
When I came to the end of my BT contract a while ago I found that saying "Leaving BT" to their automated system got me through to the people who have rather more flexibility over what can be offered.
 ;)
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Chrysalis on February 22, 2017, 11:55:19 AM
Roxy plusnet have traffic management (prioritisation) but they dont apply fixed rate limits on their unlimited packages. 
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Roxy on February 23, 2017, 12:04:32 PM
@Newtron

I will check to make sure if I switch that they don't up the cost after the initial contract period ends.

@tubaman

That would be helpful, if I wasn't already on a discounted package. The gentlemen I am dealing with has already stated he appreciates I am not happy about signing a new contract and would understand if I left BT altogether. That impresses upon me that there's nothing else they are willing to offer or bend on.

@Chrysalis

Thank you for that. I guess Sky and BT are the only main players that have no limit? I suspect there may be some reseller ISPs to look at.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on February 24, 2017, 07:28:37 PM
Just an update EE BrightBox2 arrived today now have two of them the FTTC still showing as available at cabinet with 3 days to go the order can't go belly at this stage

Vodafone's modem/router is still unreliable this should be the last stats collected from the current state of my circuit banded downstream & upstream.

Code: [Select]
adsl info --stats
adsl: ADSL driver and PHY status
Status: Showtime
Last Retrain Reason:    0
Last initialization procedure status:   0
Max:    Upstream rate = 7259 Kbps, Downstream rate = 38159 Kbps
Bearer: 0, Upstream rate = 4296 Kbps, Downstream rate = 27315 Kbps

Link Power State:       L0
Mode:                   VDSL2 Annex B
VDSL2 Profile:          Profile 17a
TPS-TC:                 PTM Mode(0x0)
Trellis:                U:ON /D:ON
Line Status:            No Defect
Training Status:        Showtime
                Down            Up
SNR (dB):        7.6             10.4
Attn(dB):        24.7            0.0
Pwr(dBm):        11.2            5.0

                        VDSL2 framing
                        Bearer 0
MSGc:           18              64
B:              47              30
M:              1               1
T:              64              64
R:              16              10
S:              0.0517          0.1963
L:              9896            1671
D:              1251            168
I:              64              41
N:              64              41

                        Counters
                        Bearer 0
OHF:            436795          92475
OHFErr:         0               0
RS:             111743931               3822251
RSCorr:         162669          0
RSUnCorr:       0               0

                        Bearer 0
HEC:            0               0
OCD:            0               0
LCD:            0               0
Total Cells:    82413224                0
Data Cells:     3958            0
Drop Cells:     0
Bit Errors:     0               0

ES:             0               0
SES:            0               0
UAS:            18              18
AS:             1448

                        Bearer 0
INP:            8.00            4.00
INPRein:        0.00            0.00
delay:          16              8
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: burakkucat on February 24, 2017, 08:25:05 PM
Just an update EE BrightBox2 arrived today now have two of them the FTTC still showing as available at cabinet with 3 days to go the order can't go belly at this stage

Just seventy five and a half hours (approximately) to go before the start of Tuesday.  :fingers:
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Roxy on February 24, 2017, 09:24:16 PM
Just seventy five and a half hours (approximately) to go before the start of Tuesday.  :fingers:

Speaking of EE...are they particularly accurate with their postcode checker on https://broadband.ee.co.uk?
They give out an exact figure instead of a range like others. It shows my current address as having the 'guaranteed minimum' that you see on other sites. Maybe they play it safe?
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on February 24, 2017, 10:46:23 PM
EE are definitely playing the safe game, here is my estimate ->

We estimate that your line can support download speeds of between 17 Mb/sec and 42 Mb/sec, and upload speeds of between 3.9 Mb/sec and 7.7 Mb/sec.

As you have chosen our Standard Fibre Broadband service, the maximum speed you can expect to see will be up to 38 Mb/s even if your line can support a faster speed.
Your Minimum Guaranteed Download Speed will be 11.4 Mb/sec. they must be confused here as that would be for ADSL2+
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: gt94sss2 on February 25, 2017, 07:08:30 PM
Hey kids,

As eluded to previously in my query on cabinet locations, our relocation is coming up soon.

I caught up with BT via the 'complaints' department, whom helped shape a new deal for me after all our troubles.
The summary of that package is Infinity 2 at a slightly discounted rate, with our telephone features(also discounted) on a no contract arrangement.

Thoughts?

It would help to know what prices you are currently on - especially as BT are currently offering existing customers deals as they can otherwise leave ATM due to pending price rises. However a few thoughts:

a) it might be cheaper to sign up as a new customer with BT once you've moved rather than migrate account (especially if you use a cash back website);
b) don't forget that BT now own EE so also offer BT branded sims via the EE network; and
c) Plusnet (also owned by BT) seems to have gone through some network/CS issues in the recent past.

Do you know what speeds you are able to achieve in your new property?
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Roxy on February 25, 2017, 08:23:56 PM
It would help to know what prices you are currently on - especially as BT are currently offering existing customers deals as they can otherwise leave ATM due to pending price rises. However a few thoughts:

a) it might be cheaper to sign up as a new customer with BT once you've moved rather than migrate account (especially if you use a cash back website);
b) don't forget that BT now own EE so also offer BT branded sims via the EE network; and
c) Plusnet (also owned by BT) seems to have gone through some network/CS issues in the recent past.

Do you know what speeds you are able to achieve in your new property?

A) I did not see any cashback for BT, however I did with others
B) Ok thank you
C) Is that good or bad?

In the new place I am told it's 66-80mbps and if I am correct I am 113 meters as the crow flies to the cabinet.

Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: gt94sss2 on February 25, 2017, 09:41:14 PM
a) https://www.topcashback.co.uk/bt-total-broadband/ and http://www.quidco.com/bt-broadband/ for example.
c) personally I would avoid Plusnet - I don't think they are as good currently as they used to be.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Chrysalis on February 25, 2017, 10:00:49 PM
I checked my line on EE's estimator.

I agree they been very conservative on the guaranteed speed.  For me which is way below even the low impacted range on the BTw checker.

So right now I am synced at 71mbit but my snrm is below 6db.
Current attainable reported as 69mbit.
EE estimate 62.9mbit
EE guarantee 30mbit O_o (sky guaranteed me 56mbit and estimate of 68mbit. at time of order, so the gap between the 2 figures is way smaller). Sky also seem willing to not wait for it to get as low as 56mbit for it to be treated as a fault "If the speed is much lower than 68Mbps, please contact us"

I am curious which of the 2 figures EE will use for fault escalation.

The good news is the fault range based on this quote is above 30mbit, but its way below sky's 68mbit.

Quote
Fibre broadband: 62.9 Mb/sec download, 20.0 Mb/sec upload. We estimate that your line can support download speeds of between 45.9 Mb/sec and 80.0 Mb/sec, and upload speeds of between 15.0 Mb/sec and 20.0 Mb/sec.
If you select a Fibre 38mb package, your broadband speed will be capped to 38Mb/sec
The speed range provided is only an estimate. Speed is impacted by a variety of factors such as number of people using the network, location from the exchange and our traffic management policy. For more information about our traffic management policies please visit ee.co.uk/terms. If you receive speeds significantly below the range quoted to you, please contact us. Full details of your estimated line speed, how they may be affected and what you can do if you have any problems will be communicated to you via an email.

So if I joined EE I probably couldnt escalate a fault unless speed falls below 45.9mbit/sec.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Roxy on February 26, 2017, 11:53:29 AM
Ugh 'fault escalation' ya... as long as BTW have a strangle hold on things (and not the good Ted Nugent kind) then you can bet escalation only comes as a last resort.

@gt94

Ok thanks for the links and comment on plusnet.

Here is my latest bill with BT:

Line Rental £18.99
BT Privacy Caller Display £1.75
Calling Plan Unlimited Anytime Calls £5 (discounted from £8.50)
Broadband Unlimited BT Infinity 2 £26 (discounted from £35?)

Total rental and other charges £52.14
One off charges for activation and modem delivery, £29.99 Have asked if this can be waived since we're only doing a transfer


I went in and arranged a new and similar package with as close to what I already have now, and it comes out as

Line Rental £18.99
BT Privacy Caller Display 12 months offer £free (will rise to £1.75)
Calling Plan Unlimited Anytime Calls £5 (discounted from £8.50)
Broadband Unlimited BT Infinity 2 £26 (will rise to £35)

Total rental and other charges £53.49 (£64.24 after twelve months)
One off charges for activation and modem delivery, £29.99

Alternatively,
Sky £51.49 a month/18 months with £29.99 activation fee
Plusnet £46.49 a month/12 months(which raises to £54.47 after 12 months), with £29.99 activation fee
Origin £37.73 a month/18 months(which raises to £47.73 after 6 months), with no activation fee
EE £39 a month/18 months(which raises to £47.50 after 18 months)with £32 activation fee
Vodafone £38 a month/18 months, with £49 activation fee - interestingly, there is no line rental cost. The £38 is broadband(including VAT) only
John Lewis £40 a month/12 months(which raises to £48 after 12 months), no activation fee



Looks like my current deal is the best in the long run in that it will only carry 12 months contracted phone, three months contracted broadband, and not raise in price any further all while being only slightly more expensive than some of the other initially cheaper options.




Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Chrysalis on February 26, 2017, 02:51:42 PM
yes I meant escalation at the CP level, openreach can of course disagree with the CP on whats worth escalating.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on February 26, 2017, 03:31:18 PM
EE £39 a month/18 months(which raises to £47.50 after 18 months)with £32 activation fee

my deal from EE is £35 unlimited Fibre 40/10 and Anytime + mobile calls £16.50 + line rental £18.50 caller ID free, acivation fee £25.00 contract term 18 months
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Roxy on February 26, 2017, 05:52:36 PM
yes I meant escalation at the CP level, openreach can of course disagree with the CP on whats worth escalating.

From my experience, they quite often do. It's worse when they don't communicate it properly. Support sends the OR engineer, OR engineer goes to start a job and calls BTW for some information. BTW tells him not to carry out the work. Everyone shrugs their shoulders for different reasons and nothing gets done.

This is why I so hoped our new location would be Virgin covered, because it's no longer under the thumb of BTW. Though I suppose without any competition, it creates another tyrant anyways.

@Newtronstar

Ok thank you.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on February 27, 2017, 08:04:21 PM
Good news the migration back to EE has gone smoothly not sure of the time it became active because I unplugged VF's modem/router just before 00:00 last night.

And even better news the DSL connection has not dropped out once except for one drop when changing over from BrightBox2 to 8800NL, would have had 4 - 6 DSL dropouts from 5 - 7pm with VF & that HHG2500.

Conclusion Vodafone's network or hardware (HHG2500) was unreliable on my circuit had they given me the username & password to test the 8800NL this issue could of been resolved easily without wasting my time & 2 Openreach Engineers time it's been a strange BroadBand experience.     
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: burakkucat on February 27, 2017, 08:09:27 PM
That's very good news.  :)

I'm pleased to know that you now have a stable service, once again.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: displaced on February 27, 2017, 09:01:18 PM
Excellent news, NewtronStar!

I presume the switchover included a lovely DLM reset?  That'll clear the Vodafone-related damage and, after a week or so, you should get G.INP back on your line.

Phew :)

Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on February 27, 2017, 09:39:49 PM
Thanks displaced TBH I don't know when G.INP will arrive back it took 11 days on the first ISP DLM reset yet it never returned after a DLM reset by OR, I'm just very happy to see a stable line again  :) 
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: roseway on February 27, 2017, 10:59:21 PM
That's really good news after all the bother you've had recently.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: Chrysalis on February 28, 2017, 12:01:02 PM
back on MDWS I hope? :)
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on February 28, 2017, 05:17:17 PM
That's really good news after all the bother you've had recently.

Gonna say it was not an easy two months even the family was complaining about are broadband connection

back on MDWS I hope? :)

Oh yeah up and running there is just something very special when using this wee white box called the Billion 8800NL very hard to find any flaws way ahead of it's time  :thumbs:
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: burakkucat on February 28, 2017, 05:37:07 PM
back on MDWS I hope? :)

Guess whose circuit I have been monitoring (on & off) since around 1655 hours, yesterday?  ;)

I am expecting some DLM intervention, either tonight or early tomorrow.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on February 28, 2017, 07:03:41 PM
If EE could put it's members on the DLM speed profile of 2880 then I would get away with DLM intervention unfortunately we are put on the DLM standard profile 1440 so this line will be heading towards an increase of interleaving on the downstream from current depth of 19 to 600 or above this line is to long and noisy.
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: burakkucat on February 28, 2017, 09:10:59 PM
If EE could put it's members on the DLM speed profile of 2880 then I would get away with[out] DLM intervention . . .

Some CPs/ISPs will make a request (on their EUs' behalf) for a change in the DLM profile. I wonder if EE would be willing to request a "standard" to a "speed" profile adjustment for you?
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: NewtronStar on March 01, 2017, 06:16:20 PM
Indeed Vodafone tech2 were able moved me from DLM standard to stable during their diagnostic stage which was wrong all that did was to band my line very quickly.

How does one find out which DLM profile is being used by your ISP the last time I called EE 20 months ago they could not give me the answer
Title: Re: Which ISP
Post by: burakkucat on March 01, 2017, 06:24:24 PM
How does one find out which DLM profile is being used by you ISP . . .

I am not sure. Perhaps Tony (tbailey2) might be able to assist?  :-\