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Author Topic: BT Home Hub 3.0 - Type B  (Read 66769 times)

burakkucat

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BT Home Hub 3.0 - Type B
« on: November 06, 2011, 02:02:01 AM »

Those of you who use "Beatie" as your broadband service supplier, either BT Total Broadband or BT Infinity, will have been given one of the Home Hubs to use (as a modem/router for the former service or as a router for the latter).

Certain forum regulars will be aware that b*cat is interested in the various pieces of equipment and the technology that allows an end user to be able to access the Internet. I recently made an eBay purchase which consisted of two Huawei HG612 modems (the current official active CPE for VDSL2 connections in this country) and a BT Home Hub 3.0 - Type B. One of the Huawei modems will shortly be forwarded to a fellow researcher, whilst the other will be used by me.

As for the BT HH3, I thought I would have a look inside. So with care and precision, it was disembowelled. Hmm, nothing particularly outstanding to see . . .  :-\  Purely for your interest, I scanned both sides of the PCB and have attached the images to this post.

After scanning, it was reassembled and I can reassure those sensitive people that absolutely no equipment was harmed in the process!  :P
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bbnovice

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Re: BT Home Hub 3.0 - Type B
« Reply #1 on: November 06, 2011, 06:57:19 PM »

Hi:

So what were the conclusions of your "autopsy" of the HH?

I'm interested as I'm being drawn to BT Infnity but have not migrated due to concerns over several problems. One of those issues is the terrible reputation of the BT HH and /or the Huawei.


   
« Last Edit: November 06, 2011, 06:59:23 PM by bbnovice »
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burakkucat

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Re: BT Home Hub 3.0 - Type B
« Reply #2 on: November 06, 2011, 08:13:13 PM »

Quote
So what were the conclusions of your "autopsy" of the HH?

It's just an average bit of kit -- nothing particularly special about it, nothing to get really excited over. Let's say my opinion is neutral.

Quote
I'm interested as I'm being drawn to BT Infnity but have not migrated due to concerns over several problems.

I have a few of comments.

The first is that if you wish to have a FTTC service with a VDSL2 link from the DSLAM to your home, you can subscribe to a service from numerous retailers. BT Infinity is just the sevice from BT Retail.

My second comment is that if you only intend to connect one device / computer, you can directly connect it to the Huawei HG612. Your sole computer will need to be configured to establish a PPPoE connection, etc, but it can be done.

My third comment is that if you still intend to use the BT Infinity route, you do not have to use the HH3. You can substitute any "cable" router/switch in place of it. If I had access to a BT Infinity service to "play with", I would definitely try using a 2Wire 2701HGV-C in place of the HH3. The 2Wire 2701HGV-C can be purchased quite cheaply (and brand new) on eBay as a Version 3.0 of the BT Business Hub, Type 2. It is important not to purchase an original BT Business Hub, Type 1 (which is a re-badged 2Wire 1800HG) nor Versions 1.0 or 2.0 of the BT Business Hub, Type 2 (which are re-badged 2Wire 2700HGVs).

As for the Huawei HG612, which is installed by OpenReach as the active CPE for all FTTC installations, the latest version 3B with the SP10 firmware is adequate for the 12a VDSL2 profile upgrade that is currently being rolled out across the country. Of course, to be able to monitor the line statistics, one will need to install the unlocked SP10 firmware that Asbokid has made available to us all.  ;)
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bbnovice

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Re: BT Home Hub 3.0 - Type B
« Reply #3 on: November 07, 2011, 02:39:28 PM »

Hi burakkucat

Many thanks for the comprehensive feedback. I think I understand it all !

I'm aware that others offer FTTC on my exchange (eg ZEN) but their prices are not terribly attractive compared with BT.

For example ZEN is 28 per month (with a 96 connection fee plus cost of hardware) for a service they estimate at 30Gb for my line but which is restricted to a monthly cap of 10Gb.  BT's current offer is also 28 per month (including line rental) for the same speed but the monthly cap is a lot higher at 40Gb. Furthermore there is only a 25 connection fee and you also get telephone calls at a reduced rate.

My thinking in using BT is that, just at the moment, this is a brand new service on my exchange, and that if there are teething problems BT are more likely to resolve them if they are responsible for the whole thing end to end especially as I already use BT for phone service. I know that technically BT retail and OR are 2 seperate entities but I do sometimes wonder. Possibly I'm being naive.

I'm aware that ZEN has a good service reputation but I'm not sure I want to introduce a third party into the equation until after the service has been proven in practice for a while.     


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burakkucat

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Re: BT Home Hub 3.0 - Type B
« Reply #4 on: November 08, 2011, 12:54:34 AM »

Hi BB,

Yes, everything you've mentioned makes perfect sense. I will agree, on price alone "Beattie" will be an excellent choice. As you currently use "her" to provide your telephone service, then taking the Infinity broadband service is (almost) a "no brainer". :)

Consider my neighbour "Gordon". He professes to being a numpty where technology is concerned but bar a minor hiccup when the first attempt was made to install his Infinity broadband service, everything has subsequently been fault / issue free. He is, as a consequence, very happy with the service. It is from "Gordon"'s Infinity connection that I will occasionally quote details, for it is one of the best of which I am aware. (I guess it helps that the D-side copper pair is precisely 440 yards / 0.25 mile / 400 metres.)

Now consider Mr Eagle (a.k.a. Baldy_Bird or Bald_Eagle1). He has a third-party, PlusNet, involved in the supply of his telephony and FTTC broadband service. His tale of woe is now giving that slim volume (War And Peace) a good run for the Roubles. ;)

As a new FTTC installation, you should be provided with a Huawei HG612, type 3B, as the active CPE by OR and BT Retail will send you a HH3, via the postal service. 
« Last Edit: December 17, 2012, 10:54:39 PM by burakkucat »
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waltergmw

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Re: BT Home Hub 3.0 - Type B
« Reply #5 on: November 10, 2011, 12:14:08 PM »

Hi BB,

I would just inject a word of caution with any BT broadband services. They are fine when they work but there are many stories of very significant difficulties if you have to engage with the BT fault reporting systems.

IF you are unlucky enough to get into that predicament then e.g. an expensive Zen solution becomes a much cheaper and far less stressful option.

Kind regards,
Walter
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Bald_Eagle1

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Re: BT Home Hub 3.0 - Type B
« Reply #6 on: November 10, 2011, 12:49:36 PM »


As for the Huawei HG612, which is installed by OpenReach as the active CPE for all FTTC installations, the latest version 3B with the SP10 firmware is adequate for the 12a VDSL2 profile upgrade that is currently being rolled out across the country. Of course, to be able to monitor the line statistics, one will need to install the unlocked SP10 firmware that Asbokid has made available to us all.  ;)


Along with the current 17a profile upgrade, It is rumoured that BT are currently investigating / trialing the 30a profile to give up to 200Mb or 300Mb speeds, probably just for those who live very close to the street cabinet in which the DSLAM is located.

The Huawei HG612 modem does report 30a compatibility, but I believe there may be some doubt regarding its processing power for such high speeds/frequencies.


Paul.
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jeffbb

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Re: BT Home Hub 3.0 - Type B
« Reply #7 on: November 10, 2011, 09:40:38 PM »

Hi
quote probably just for those who live very close to the street cabinet in which the DSLAM is

located.


or better still in their back garden  ;D

Regards Jeff
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Bald_Eagle1

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Re: BT Home Hub 3.0 - Type B
« Reply #8 on: November 11, 2011, 03:56:29 PM »

Hi
quote probably just for those who live very close to the street cabinet in which the DSLAM is

located.


or better still in their back garden  ;D

Regards Jeff

Haha,

There's plenty of room in my back garden for a fibre cabinet.

I wouldn't even charge BT a peppercorn rent for siting one there.

I wouldn't turn down an offer of free FTTH broadband for life though ;D

Paul.
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f2richard

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Re: BT Home Hub 3.0 - Type B
« Reply #9 on: December 12, 2011, 09:16:56 AM »

So, has anyone successfully used a BT Home Hub 3 to connect to a non-BT Infinity FTTC VDSL ISP?

We're very fortunate in that our village is being provided with FTTC broadband in a scheme sponsored by our local county council.  The wholesale ISP is Fluidata and I've selected IDNet as my supplier.

It would significantly lower the cost of entry for members of our community if we were able to purchase 2nd hand Home Hub 3's, of which there seems to be a plentiful supply!

Has anyone successfully done this? Have BT locked out the ability to change the login names for VDSL connection?

Look forward to your replies, and thanks.
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waltergmw

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Re: BT Home Hub 3.0 - Type B
« Reply #10 on: December 12, 2011, 02:58:05 PM »

Hi Richard,

I believe you are required to use the Openreach supplied VDSL modem if you want to discuss any problems as they are the only ones that are supported.

Most are the Huawei Echolife HG612 although I've seen one report from Cornwall of a ECI Telecom one  TYPE 1B.
B-FOCuS V-2FUb/I Rev.B

VERY Sadly if routing functions are required they are then provided by the home hub or other router, depending upon your service provider.
Yet more clutter and a thoroughly "un-green" power increase IMHO.

Kind regards,
Walter



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f2richard

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Re: BT Home Hub 3.0 - Type B
« Reply #11 on: December 13, 2011, 01:04:05 AM »

Walter,

Thanks for your reply.

The only involvement that Openreach have in this scheme is to unbundle the pair from the existing copper cabinet, transfer them over to the non-BT owned fibre cabinet, do an on-premises faceplate change and test.  From that point on they are not involved other than when called upon by Fluidata to fix a line fault.  There is no stipulation in this scheme as to the hardware that has to be used, indeed there are whole variety being offered by the retail ISPs involved in the scheme (these range from Billion 8200n's through to Thomson TG672 and TG789) - these are being flogged for close to 100 hence my effort to see if the Home Hub 3 can be used in a non-BT FTTC scheme.

Specifically I would like to know if it is possible to change the PPoE username/password to be different from the BT pre-populated credentials and whether I would be able to switch off any other BT specific features.

Or perhaps I misunderstood your reply and what you are saying that the HH3 does not actually have a VDSL modem built in and the Infinity port is in fact a WAN port that supplies the PPoE session information?



Thanks!

« Last Edit: December 13, 2011, 01:07:09 AM by f2richard »
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burakkucat

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Re: BT Home Hub 3.0 - Type B
« Reply #12 on: December 13, 2011, 02:36:08 AM »

Specifically I would like to know if it is possible to change the PPoE username/password to be different from the BT pre-populated credentials and whether I would be able to switch off any other BT specific features.

Or perhaps I misunderstood your reply and what you are saying that the HH3 does not actually have a VDSL modem built in and the Infinity port is in fact a WAN port that supplies the PPoE session information?

Ah. now that you have clarified your initial question, I can easily answer that by saying that the HH3 does not have an integrated VDSL2 modem but it is, as you have suspected, that the WAN port passes the PPPoE credentials, via an external modem, to the FTTC DSLAM.

I have read rumours that the HH3 has been locked by Beattie to operate only on her broadband services, be they ADSL, ADSL2+ or VDSL2 in origin. I could make a note on my ever-lengthening ToDo List and check that for you but I suspect you will now be crossing the HH3 off your list.

A somewhat OT thought but as asbokid has made available unlocked firmware for the Huawei EchoLife HG612 (the OpenReach supplied modem) and they are now appearing quite regularly on eBay, you might like to consider their use . . .  :-\
« Last Edit: December 17, 2012, 10:57:02 PM by burakkucat »
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waltergmw

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Re: BT Home Hub 3.0 - Type B
« Reply #13 on: December 13, 2011, 08:23:57 AM »

@ Richard & BKK,

I'm pleased that you two disgraceful night-owls have indeed discovered what I meant to say !

I am interested to know what effects the BT E side cabling has on a FTTC service so it would be helpful if you could publish your modem's statistics and whether you have an isolated D side line.
I.e. 1. Do you have a Full Metallic Path Facility as BT's glorious lexicographers describe it ?
2. Do you know what type of MSAN you are connected to ?

Kind regards,
Walter
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f2richard

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Re: BT Home Hub 3.0 - Type B
« Reply #14 on: December 13, 2011, 09:09:25 AM »

Thanks again Walter and BKK,

BKK - you're right, other than the HH3 being cheap secondhand for an N mode router, I can no longer see the point. I wonder what the reasoning behind providing two separate pieces of equipment was at BT towers!

I think I'm more likely now to go for a Billion 8200N which is a combined modem and router - I've used their stuff and recommended it to many and have found them reliable and good performers.

This is an interesting project which has involved lots of lobbying of BT to lay a fibre cable into the village (unsuccessful), despite spending upwards of 160,000 on installing a new duct from the village to the exchange they stamped their petulant feet and told us they were pulling new copper rather than fibre!  So, we looked at the options and realised that the local county council had spent a small fortune laying fibre to the school in the neighbouring hamlet (provided by Virgin Media), so some fibre bundles were available a lot closer than we thought. Fruitful discussions with the CC who were sitting on a pile of money from the government for rural broadband improvements led to a cunning plan being put into place.  The local landowning farmer agreed to allow fibre to be laid from the school cab up into the village.  Fluidata were approached to become the wholesale service provider and they in turn have selected 4 retail ISPs to offer the service.  The service sits on top of the local CC's county network and terminates at Teledata.

It's FMP and I believe, seeing as the twisted pair is moved out of the BT curb side cab over into the non-BT DSLAM and then onto Virgin's fibre cable to the POP its non BT E and D side.  No idea what the MSAN is - is there a way to discover that?

R
_
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